Talk:Santa Barbara, California/Archive 1

side bar
I was trying to make a side bar for this page. It didn't work out well. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.185.179.4 (talk) 22:41, 5 June 2005 (UTC)


 * Thanks for trying! -Willmcw 23:09, Jun 5, 2005 (UTC)

Note: The sidebar is up, but still has problems.

Alien Sighting
I heard that there was a alien sighting on 5-8-05. Is that true?
 * Unlikely, but anything is possible. Find a respectable source for it and we can add it. Cheers, -Willmcw 23:09, Jun 5, 2005 (UTC)

Infobox
Somebody should fix the infobox. There has been little progress on it since I put it up. Admittedly i'm not very good with infoboxes, but it is indeed important. -- hello, i'm a member  |  talk to me!  01:00, 25 December 2005 (UTC)

Infobox
Thanks for adding the infobox! I was just going to suggest that this article needed an infobox here, glad it's gotten added. I wanted to open up a discussion about it now:

1) Is the bottom of the seal cut off for anyone else?

2) I have different figures for the square miles. The official census website says 19 land square miles: (this also has the population density which is currently missing in the infobox)

This seems to have more specific land and water square mile figures (they're different from the current values in the infobox as well) The land area roughly agrees with the official census info, so this probably the right figure, I think.

3) This claims to have the city flag of Santa Barbara:

4) Antandrus -> "The American Riviera" "Santa Barbara" get about 6400+ hits on Google, so it seems well enough known. I'm not a local so I don't know if the name is commonly used around there, but some of my tourist books do say "American Riviera".

5) Does anyone have any good metro estimates? It seems that the whole Santa Barbara County is used for the Census designation of the Santa Barbara "metropolitan area", but that seems a little inaccurate to me.

Let me know what you guys think. --Rc251 10:42, 8 August 2005 (UTC)


 * Regarding "American Riviera"--it's fine with me to leave it in, especially since it appears to be Google-notable. Very possibly it's one of those designations used more often by non-locals and visitors than by locals; I've lived here for most of my life, and just don't hear people use it.
 * Locals and local publications use the term.--Rockero 17:52, 17 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Regarding the metro estimate: the entire area in SB County south of the Santa Ynez Mountain crest and east of Highway 101 where it turns north at Gaviota has a 2000 population of 201,058 (I'm using the officially released TIGER census files of census blocks, linked to the tables, and querying in ESRI ArcView; I do GIS for a living).  I don't know where to get a 2005 estimate for the metro area:  the county might have one, but most of our articles use the 2000 census data for population since it is the most recent actual "official" count.


 * Thanks! Antandrus  (talk) 15:15, 8 August 2005 (UTC)

Proposed Organizational Structure
Some friends and I discussed how a comprehensive article on SB would be structured given its history and tourism emphases. Here is what we came up with. Please consider and revise, and maybe we can move this up to pending tasks and include the detailed history. Americanwalrus 11:22, 17 January 2006 (UTC)


 * Other than a small change, it looks good to me. Will Beback 19:53, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

[changes have now been integrated into to do list above) Americanwalrus 07:55, 24 January 2006 (UTC)

Perhaps we should put footnotes. -- hello, i'm a member  |  talk to me!  02:14, 3 February 2006 (UTC)

sat photo
"the far right" "the extreme right" How about someone just crops the damn photo so that SB is the only major city visible in it? These directions are a bit silly.


 * SB takes more space on a map than it otherwise might due to its borders including the airport. However, more fundamentally, I'm not sure that the satellite phot adds much. Nowadays they're easily obtainable, at least three geo links have them. Perhaps a more typical view would be better? -Will Beback 08:22, 24 October 2006 (UTC)


 * I'd be happy to snap one from one of the adjacent hills as a replacement for this, given a sunny day and a few minutes; I agree the current photo doesn't add much. Alternatively, if people like the satellite photo, I know some public domain high-res photos from 2005 from which I could make a city-only view.  Antandrus  (talk) 15:00, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

I have a couple nice photos I could add that do SB justice, if you'd like. I don't know how to add photos, but everything seems preety intuitive at Wikipedia. Travel4Fun 16:33, 12 November 2006 (UTC)Travel4Fun

tourism and museums
I see a link to info re: The maritime Museum is up. From what I've seen, tourists love some other museums in SB, when they know about them and can peel themselves away from State Street and the ocean. Can I add a link to info re: a few excellent museums in SB? Travel4Fun 16:37, 12 November 2006 (UTC)Travel4Fun


 * It'd be better if you added the information to the article. -Will Beback 20:58, 12 November 2006 (UTC)


 * I agree with Will. Instead of just putting a link, can you add something about the museums themselves?  (Oh, and please check our policy on external links).  Thanks, Antandrus  (talk) 21:00, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

Images
Really repetitive with the images, eh? Rmpfu89 20:43, 17 December 2005 (UTC)

Just a pathetically small issue, but on the second to last picture: The caption below the picture says it is looking "Northeast", and it would be true if Santa Barbara was located on the East Coast. Shouldn't it either say "looking from the Northeast" or looking "South" or "Southwest"?


 * No, the caption is correct. Here  is the approximate location of the airplane:  the view is to the northeast, and it is actually towards the wharf, which is 1) at the center of the picture, and 2) near the big "S" in Santa Barbara on the TopoZone map.  Remember that Santa Barbara is on a portion of the California coast that faces south--there are only a few spots on the West Coast where this is true (Santa Cruz and Long Beach are others) Antandrus  (talk) 05:58, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

List of people moved
I am going to create a new page for the list of people from Santa Barbara and move all the names there: List of people from Santa Barbara. Having this very long list on the main page for the city is awkward. If anyone has a problem with this, please let me know.Njerseyguy 19:55, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Oh, and I linked to the page through a new "See also" section.Njerseyguy 19:58, 16 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Thanks--it was starting to bug me too. (This page could use a little cleanup/formatting/rewrite.)  Antandrus  (talk) 20:45, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

History
Needs history--when was the city founded? When was its bicentennial? Badagnani 09:29, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

Edits by 75.15.157.152
The following has been reverted several times by different users:
 * Santa Barbara is a crazy liberal town. please don't re-edit this. The rich people are white liberals, they are "hipocritas" they love their wine and their organic food (crazy i'm telling you).

It is being placed here and on the users talk page in hopes that he will understand why such comments are not acceptable in Wikipedia articles. Before spending time in discussion, will wait to see if the OP is interested in discussing the subject. Dbiel (Talk) 07:46, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I've temporarily semi-protected the page. ·:·Will Beback  ·:· 08:04, 3 June 2007 (UTC)


 * While it's a little early in the morning for wine, I am enjoying organically grown strawberries for breakfast, and yes, that's a completely inappropriate edit. Thanks for the sprotect. :) Antandrus  (talk) 14:14, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

Cleanup
This article is a mess, and somewhat hard to read. Someone should try and compact the article a little more. -- hello, i'm a member  |  talk to me!  22:57, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:SantaBarbara.gif
Image:SantaBarbara.gif is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 05:26, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

No History section at all? Really?
Come on, even a brief outline is better than nothing.


 * It's been on my to-do list for several years ... is anyone else watching this page? I know, I know -- it's painfully lacking.  This article is a bit of a mess.  Antandrus  (talk) 02:47, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

Homeless
I deleted the part about homelessness in Santa Barbara being connected to high real estate costs. The assertion had no citation to begin with. I can tell you as a native most homeless people in Santa Barbara migrated there because the weather is better for sleeping out doors. A semi liberal outlook on the homeless also helps. ("Semi liberal" because there is some vicious anti homeless sentiment there as well.) As I can't give a citation for my first hand views, I can't include them in the article either. Perhaps a paragraph with proper citations can be added by a more knowledgable person. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.138.41.10 (talk) 13:40, 4 August 2008 (UTC)


 * I agree on all counts. I'm just not sure how to cite it, or where to look for something citeable.  At any rate, thanks for taking that out; it's a false correlation.  Antandrus  (talk) 06:00, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

Article rework
Is anyone else watching this page? I'm considering doing a major rewrite, including adding a history section. It would start with a bookstore run to see what other local histories may have been published recently (I have many of the Walker Tompkins books, but they're mostly collections of vignettes, and difficult to use for a general history: they also end in the 1980s). Are there specific things anyone thinks may be missing, including things needing to be photographed? Antandrus (talk) 16:32, 9 August 2008 (UTC)


 * memorable-events-sbs-history/ 66.57.189.230 (talk) 05:58, 13 August 2008 (UTC)

and what about Politics?
I'm new to both Santa Barbara and wikipedia, but I would like to see a Politics section, something comparable to the same section on the Santa Barbara County wiki, which I found to be very helpful. Perhaps it's rude to suggest work for *someone else* to do, but I don't know enough about local politics to even know where to start. Jeremy.orhan (talk) 05:16, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

In Popular Culture
Really? REALLY? no one mentioned the SOAP OPERA? THE SOAP OPERA THAT IS INTERNATIONALLY FAMOUS? THE SOAP OPERA THAT PEOPLE IN THE SOVIET UNION KNEW ABOUT WHEN IT WAS STILL AIRING? Wow. There is an article on Wikipedia about the soap itself.

It may no longer be the case, but it certainly USED to be the case that, when you told people you were from santa barbara, they would immediately think of the soap opera. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.6.76.141 (talk) 02:05, 6 May 2010 (UTC)

Politics in Santa Barbara
This is a general response that is unworthy for inclusion into the main article: Politics in Santa Barbara is pretty diverse - even wild. The rich old land owners in Montecito are typically hard core fiscal and somewhat social conservatives. But among them are sprinkled some eccentric old environmentalists/libertarians. They are balanced out by the hordes of liberal college students that pack the campuses. Not to say that the college scene is entirely liberal. Westmont, the Christian college, is typically socially conservative and the Young Republicans maintain a vocal outpost at UCSB. The downtown area and suburbs are a mix of professionals who can go either way and it's not unusual to find a fiscally conservative lawyer with socially liberal views. The lower middle class, hanging on by their fingernails, tend to be liberal friendly since liberals are usually pro rent control. So to say they're moderate conservatives is fair. The SB hispanic population cannot be discounted. Ironically, although they are disliked by the GOP, hispanic people are generally conservative Catholics. The GOP fears them because they have an incredibly vocal radical leftist element which successfully martialed immigration rhetoric to seem representative of the whole. Outside the city limits you'll find many ranchers and wine growers that are generally conservative. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 139.139.51.70 (talk) 09:46, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

You do not sound like you know what you are talking about. I would characterize the overall character of the city as "socially liberal with fiscal conservativism." This is the case for most of the wealthy in the city. The VAST majority of the wealthy who live in SB have between $5-50 million net worth (sizeably invested in local real estate in many cases) and are typically "new money" (new to the area). The minority are ridiculously wealthy and are considered (for the most part) "old money." There is, however, a complication because many of the descendants of these old money families are very liberal minded, having grown up with wealth (the Kashoggis are an excellent example, you should see the kids, lol). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.6.76.141 (talk) 02:23, 6 May 2010 (UTC)

News-Press
Is the paragraph about the News-Press in 2006 really relevant to this article about Santa Barbara? Surely it would be more relevant on the News-Press page than here. Grjako (talk) 12:02, 1 July 2010 (UTC)


 * I'm going to remove it. The matter isn't relevant to the history of Santa Barbara, and is already covered by the News-Press page. Grjako (talk) 08:36, 15 July 2010 (UTC)

Featured Article
I'm setting the goal of featured article for this article. Please join me in reaching that goal!-- hello, i'm a member  |  talk to me!  05:52, 12 November 2005 (UTC)

EDITING QUESTION
10/24/6 - I fixed the sq mile numbers in the info box to match the number of the SB City website.


 * You added a couple of more decimal points, but that wasn't really a correction. You also changed several statistics that weren't on the city webpage. Can you give us your source for those? I've reverted the changes until we're sure. -Will Beback 05:23, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

... I made a major correction.

Here is the ref http://www.santabarbaraca.gov/NR/rdonlyres/67F9B44E-BC1E-4101-B1AA-AFDD796DAF04/0/FactSheet2005.pdf

Land is 21 sq mi and water is 23 sq mi because of the water connecting the city to the airport.

ALSO .. note that the area text is wrong too. In fact, the text box looks like it has the metric units from the text box used as sq miles instead.

Also, you removed my editing of the media section. Jeramy Gordon is a new comer to town who has junky daily (M-F) paper. "The city's free daily" makes it seem more important as does mentioning his name at all. Wendy McCaw is national news.

And, you removed my addition of Edhat as a hyperlocal. Edhat is an important source of news now that people have unsubscribed from the News-Press.

I feel strongly that all these edits should stay!


 * You are correct about the area, my mistake. What is this about the News-Press and the Edhat? Also, please don't add commercial links. -Will Beback 05:58, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

.. I didn't add any commerical links. Those were added by someone else. I added Edhat as a media source, and our newest resident Ellen as a local celeb.

The link to the NOAA climate data in the box is incorrect, but I can't figure out how to find the correct PDF. Perhaps somebody can help? Babaluma (talk) 01:21, 19 September 2010 (UTC)


 * Fixed -- the entries in http://cdo.ncdc.noaa.gov/climatenormals/clim20/ca were in alpha order, though it wasn't a particularly friendly naming convention they used -- turns out the data was from the city station, not the airport. Antandrus (talk) 01:31, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

Courthouse Photo
The lovely photo of the Courthouse interior does not actually depict a courtroom, as the caption implies. It is the room formerly (and occasionally) used by the County Board of Supervisors. The plaque on the front door is pretty clear about that (hard to use that as a source cited though). So are the original construction drawings, the building staff, etc. The long table with the row of chairs also indicates a typical Board of Supervisor's dais, not a typical courtroom layout. I hope the nice person who added the photo can make the appropriate revision. 76.102.193.2 (talk) 07:54, 8 October 2011 (UTC)

The Bacara Resort
The Bacara Resort, which is listed as a business in Santa Barabara and the wedding place of several celebrities and dignitaries, is not located in Santa Barbara at all. It is located in the northern most portion of the City of Goleta and is ten (10) miles west of the city limits of Santa Barbara. Lance Craig — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.182.18.110 (talk) 02:48, 14 January 2012 (UTC)


 * That's true -- I just fixed it. We could, technically, prune some stuff from the article (some of the parks, a lot of the schools) that aren't within the city limits.  The article does blur the distinction between the city and the general area, i.e. the South Coast. Antandrus  (talk) 03:33, 14 January 2012 (UTC)

Misaligned streets need further description
The Middle and late 19th century section says:"In 1851, land surveyor Salisbury Haley designed the street grid, famously botching the block measurements, misaligning the streets ...." The street misalignment may be famous in Santa Barbara, but there should be some elaboration for the six billion or so people who are not familiar with the problem. Trying to understand it, I looked at Santa Barbara on Google Maps, and there is nothing obviously wrong with the street layout. Someone who knows exactly what the problem is should explain it for the rest of us. Otherwise, this statement should be removed, since it adds nothing but frustration to a person reading the article.

Thanks.--Jim10701 (talk) 03:59, 27 March 2012 (UTC)


 * I'm sorry it's frustrating for you.
 * If you look carefully at the street grid, you will notice there are places where the streets make mysterious jogs -- the intersections at Mission and De La Vina, and De Le Guerra at Santa Barbara streets are two that come to mind. You have to zoom in to see the problem.  The grid cells, which otherwise would be squares, become mis-shapen there; if you're driving on Mission towards the hills you have to dogleg to the left.  The problem had to do with the rawhide measuring tool Haley was using, which shrank in the sun, changing length during the day as he worked (according to one story told by Walker Tompkins in more than one of his books on local history).  I had it in more detail at one point.  Antandrus  (talk) 05:02, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Population Discrepancy
The opening paragraph mentions the 2010 census as saying the city population is 88,410. However, the information box on the right lists the population in 2010 as 90,893. There could be a date or population number that's wrong here. Or if all sources are cited correctly, it should probably be specified in the article that there's an uncertainty in population. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.135.186.103 (talk) 10:57, 4 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Good catch. It turns out the 90,893 number is the current (2012) estimate on the city website, so I changed the date and cited it. Antandrus  (talk) 14:40, 4 December 2012 (UTC)

Five
The article contains the following:

> Five villages flourished in what is today Santa Barbara:

> 1) Mispu (now occupied by the City College);

> 2) Syukhtun, chief Yanonalit’s large village between Bath and Chapala streets (later called “El Baño”, site of El Baño pool);

> 3) Amolomol at the mouth of Mission Creek;

> 4) and Swetete, above the present bird refuge.

It states that five villages were there, yet lists four. Typo, missing info? Can someone more knowledgeable about Santa Barbara's history fix this up please? 83.100.233.169 (talk) 19:11, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

Demonym
What is the preferred term for a resident of Santa Barbara, apart from "Santa Barbarian"? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.225.17.141 (talk) 17:40, 11 August 2013 (UTC)

External links modified
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20100413121614/http://oldsite.sbchamber.org:80/employment/index.html to http://oldsite.sbchamber.org/employment/index.html
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20090609100621/http://www.usbr.gov:80/dataweb/html/cachuma.html to http://www.usbr.gov/dataweb/html/cachuma.html

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Recent edits
I removed a number of sections that consisted of directory-style listing of nn subjects, many with promotional external links. I'm preserving this material on the Talk page by providing this link. K.e.coffman (talk) 03:04, 2 March 2017 (UTC)


 * I also removed the "In popular culture" section as uncited original research. I'm preserving this content by providing this link. K.e.coffman (talk) 19:42, 2 March 2017 (UTC)

Disambiguation vs Alameda
Interestingly, both Santa Barbara and Alameda can refer to a county, a city, and an island in California. All of these are located in the disambiguation for Santa Barbara, but none are for Alameda. Is this necessary?2601:640:4080:5960:CCF5:2698:8142:3A5E (talk) 03:54, 12 May 2017 (UTC)
 * Yes, it is helpful on this article since they all have notoriety but may not be easily distinguished by international users of Wikipedia. Fettlemap (talk) 21:07, 12 May 2017 (UTC)

External links modified
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20141103002921/http://www.calafco.org/docs/Cities_by_incorp_date.doc to http://www.calafco.org/docs/Cities_by_incorp_date.doc
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120917105445/http://www.usc.edu/dept/tsunamis/2005/news/articles/pdfs/2005_01_09_tsunami_LAT.pdf to http://www.usc.edu/dept/tsunamis/2005/news/articles/pdfs/2005_01_09_tsunami_LAT.pdf
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120720065051/http://www.sbcfire.com/au/dphist/history.htm to http://www.sbcfire.com/au/dphist/history.htm
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090514052829/http://solsticeparade.com/history.htm to http://www.solsticeparade.com/history.htm

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