Talk:Santa Monica Mountains

Untitled
User2004, which redirects to Will Beback, added a list of named peaks in the Santa Monica Mountains. What is the source of this list? The reason I ask is that Mount Bell appears to be fictitious, and certainly is not in the USGS list of names in California. (Also, the claim that Mugu Peak is the westernmost is wrong. I can fix that, but it indicates unreliability of the entire list. But Mount Bell is "missing information" rather than "conflicting information".)--Paleolith (talk) 07:13, 3 January 2008 (UTC)


 * I don't recall the source. Mt. Bell is widely described on the Internet. . What's the real westernmost named peak? ·:· Will Beback  ·:· 22:36, 7 January 2008 (UTC)


 * OK, thanks. Apparently it is invariably referred to as Mt. Bell, and I was searching for "Mount Bell" as the article refers to it. However, the number of references found by Google is tiny -- on the same order as the number for Barney Knob, a summit near the intersection of Decker Road and Encinal Canyon Road known to the USGS but almost no one else, and not accessible to the public. Less than 1/10 as many references as for Mt. Lee. The Burbank topo quad shows the 1587' point with no name. It also shows a 1600+' point between there and Mt. Lee, also with no name. The USGS web site does not include it.


 * Well, there is no invariable about it, considering that "Mt." is merely an abbreviation for "Mount", and the decision as to which one to use is up to the writer. I have seen Mt. Wilson and Mount Wilson; Mt. Palomar and Mount Palomar; Mt. Whitney and Mount Whitney. This is also a failing with the Wikipedia, which should be programmed to recognize "Mt." and "Mount" interchangeably and everywhere. As it is, someone can search for a place (just to make one up) like Mt. Hamilton, but if the Wikipedia article is titled Mount Hamilton, then the search engine can return "no matches found". The computers should be programmed to recognize that Mt. = Mount; St. = Street; Ave. = Avenue; Hwy. = Highway, and so forth. For example, whether I see "Pacific Coast Highway" or "Pacific Coast Hwy.", my mind recognizes them as being the same without even applying any thought at all. It is just automatic. Likewise, Pt. Mugu and Point Mugu mean the same to me w/o bothering to think about it. Likewise, "Doctor Jeckyl and Mister Hyde" means the same as "Dr. Jeckyl and Mr. Hyde" w/o even applying one iota of thought to it. Why can't the computers be set up to do the same thing? And to do it nearly instantaneously?74.163.36.44 (talk) 05:23, 19 October 2008 (UTC)


 * The westernmost one is Laguna Peak. Pretty obvious to anyone who has stood on top of Mugu Peak. Laguna Peak has an antenna forest blocking the view of Oxnard. ;-)


 * This is all part of the question of what is a named feature, whose names, do we include informal names, etc. This is partly philosophical and partly practical. If we want a single citation, then I don't know where we can go other than the USGS. If we include other names, then we'll need to cite them all, and I imagine there are a LOT more names given informally (Eagle Rock for example). And what is the purpose of including the list? That might drive how it is derived and cited.


 * Here's the USGS list, east to west. What would you think about switching to this list, better formatted and with notes added of course, and perhaps sorted by height as is the current list. I do have qualms about a couple of the listings, especially Point Dume and Parker Mesa.


 * {| class="wikitable" border="1"


 * Feature_Name || Latitude || Longitude || El. m. || El. Ft. || Map_Name
 * Mount Hollywood || 34.1280637 || -118.3011874 || 492 || 1614 || Burbank
 * Mount Lee || 34.1347299 || -118.3209103 || 521 || 1709 || Burbank
 * Cahuenga Peak || 34.1369520 || -118.3259105 || 553 || 1814 || Burbank
 * San Vicente Mountain || 34.1286176 || -118.5128608 || 598 || 1962 || Canoga Park
 * Castellammare Mesa || 34.0438975 || -118.5595268 || 108 || 354 || Topanga
 * Parker Mesa || 34.0447306 || -118.5734161 || 79 || 259 || Topanga
 * Calabasas Peak || 34.1122286 || -118.6520307 || 644 || 2113 || Malibu Beach
 * Saddle Peak || 34.0758404 || -118.6584189 || 851 || 2792 || Malibu Beach
 * Laskey Mesa || 34.1755606 || -118.6811996 || 428 || 1404 || Calabasas
 * Mesa Peak || 34.0625069 || -118.7189758 || 555 || 1821 || Malibu Beach
 * Brents Mountain || 34.0858398 || -118.7225875 || 513 || 1683 || Malibu Beach
 * Goat Buttes || 34.0952841 || -118.7389771 || 388 || 1273 || Malibu Beach
 * Solstice Hill || 34.0344516 || -118.7498093 || 170 || 558 || Malibu Beach
 * Ladyface || 34.1350057 || -118.7731458 || 619 || 2031 || Thousand Oaks
 * Castro Peak || 34.0858398 || -118.7853675 || 855 || 2805 || Point Dume
 * Point Dume || 34.0016746 || -118.8062001 || 56 || 184 || Point Dume
 * Negrohead Mountain || 34.1097284 || -118.8098136 || 619 || 2031 || Point Dume
 * Saddle Rock || 34.0952843 || -118.8298142 || 635 || 2083 || Point Dume
 * Barney Knob || 34.0775070 || -118.8787049 || 527 || 1729 || Triunfo Pass
 * Sandstone Peak || 34.1202843 || -118.9309301 || 899 || 2949 || Triunfo Pass
 * Boney Mountain || 34.1116734 || -118.9592645 || 865 || 2838 || Triunfo Pass
 * Clarks Peak || 34.0833405 || -118.9634310 || 600 || 1969 || Triunfo Pass
 * Conejo Mountain || 34.1883387 || -118.9842666 || 548 || 1798 || Newbury Park
 * La Jolla Peak || 34.1152843 || -119.0484349 || 466 || 1529 || Point Mugu
 * Mugu Peak || 34.0925068 || -119.0548238 || 384 || 1260 || Point Mugu
 * Laguna Peak || 34.1086176 || -119.0642687 || 433 || 1421 || Point Mugu
 * }
 * Ladyface || 34.1350057 || -118.7731458 || 619 || 2031 || Thousand Oaks
 * Castro Peak || 34.0858398 || -118.7853675 || 855 || 2805 || Point Dume
 * Point Dume || 34.0016746 || -118.8062001 || 56 || 184 || Point Dume
 * Negrohead Mountain || 34.1097284 || -118.8098136 || 619 || 2031 || Point Dume
 * Saddle Rock || 34.0952843 || -118.8298142 || 635 || 2083 || Point Dume
 * Barney Knob || 34.0775070 || -118.8787049 || 527 || 1729 || Triunfo Pass
 * Sandstone Peak || 34.1202843 || -118.9309301 || 899 || 2949 || Triunfo Pass
 * Boney Mountain || 34.1116734 || -118.9592645 || 865 || 2838 || Triunfo Pass
 * Clarks Peak || 34.0833405 || -118.9634310 || 600 || 1969 || Triunfo Pass
 * Conejo Mountain || 34.1883387 || -118.9842666 || 548 || 1798 || Newbury Park
 * La Jolla Peak || 34.1152843 || -119.0484349 || 466 || 1529 || Point Mugu
 * Mugu Peak || 34.0925068 || -119.0548238 || 384 || 1260 || Point Mugu
 * Laguna Peak || 34.1086176 || -119.0642687 || 433 || 1421 || Point Mugu
 * }
 * Boney Mountain || 34.1116734 || -118.9592645 || 865 || 2838 || Triunfo Pass
 * Clarks Peak || 34.0833405 || -118.9634310 || 600 || 1969 || Triunfo Pass
 * Conejo Mountain || 34.1883387 || -118.9842666 || 548 || 1798 || Newbury Park
 * La Jolla Peak || 34.1152843 || -119.0484349 || 466 || 1529 || Point Mugu
 * Mugu Peak || 34.0925068 || -119.0548238 || 384 || 1260 || Point Mugu
 * Laguna Peak || 34.1086176 || -119.0642687 || 433 || 1421 || Point Mugu
 * }
 * La Jolla Peak || 34.1152843 || -119.0484349 || 466 || 1529 || Point Mugu
 * Mugu Peak || 34.0925068 || -119.0548238 || 384 || 1260 || Point Mugu
 * Laguna Peak || 34.1086176 || -119.0642687 || 433 || 1421 || Point Mugu
 * }
 * Laguna Peak || 34.1086176 || -119.0642687 || 433 || 1421 || Point Mugu
 * }


 * --Paleolith (talk) 16:11, 9 January 2008 (UTC)


 * On further thought (previous entry was added last night but not signed until now), I'm thinking that the list should include all USGS summits but allow for others as well. At the moment I'm aware of four summits not on the USGS list, of which Mt. Bell is probably the least known. The others are Bee Rock, Glendale Peak, and Tri-Peaks. There are certainly more, as I haven't even really looked. Also, I would use the standard method for presenting coordinates. Unfortunately the ones which most need coordinates are the non-USGS ones, and finding a reference for those is harder. --Paleolith (talk) 16:11, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Flora Photos Needed!
I will have the list of flora (pretty much) complete in a couple more days. But I need photos that can go in Wikimedia Commons. Please help. Leave message on my talk page. EricDiesel (talk) 23:03, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Post the list and I'm sure we can find or take photographs. ·:· Will Beback  ·:· 05:56, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

US renames Negrohead Mountain after black pioneer
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/8526878.stm

---— Gadget850 (Ed)  talk 21:31, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

External Links for Trails
An external link to hikespeak.com with information on 50+ hikes in the Santa Monica Mountains was removed from the Santa Monica Mountains Page for potential wikipedia guideline conflicts. A less topical list on outdoorla.org remains on the page. Is it appropriate for either or both links be included? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rasquache74 (talk • contribs) 09:28, 4 February 2012 (UTC)

Photo caption
User:Hike The Monicas added a photo with the caption "Heart Leaved Penstemon - Keckiella cordifolia - Wildflowers Santa Monica Mountains. Photographed in Malibu, California on the Backbone Trail". I copy-edited the photo caption to correct errors, but it was reverted. First, I changed the vernacular name of the plant to lower case, per WP:FLORA. Second, I italicized the genus and species, per grade 4 science class. Third, I moved the photo to the right, where it would be less disruptive to the section headings. Finally, I removed the location as being in Malibu, California. A glance at the the official map of Malibu, and the official Backbone Trail map, shows they don't seem to cross (but I may be wrong). Thank you for your input. Magnolia677 (talk) 22:36, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
 * http://www.city-data.com/zipmaps/Malibu-California.html Hike The Monicas (talk) 22:39, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
 * The Backbone Trail does not seem to enter the Malibu city boundary (in red) of the map you added. If it does, at what coordinate?  This tool may help.  Thank you. Magnolia677 (talk) 22:51, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
 * Except for the Eastern 2 miles near Will Rogers State Park, and the Western 3 miles near the Ventura County line, the remaining 62 miles of the trail lies within the Malibu, Ca zip code. | see Malibu Surfside News Quoting from the Malibu Surfside News: " Because the trail crosses all of the major canyon roads in Malibu" Hike The Monicas (talk) 23:26, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
 * The city of Malibu did not incorporate all the areas traditionally considered in the community of Malibu long before a city existed. The Malibu zip code includes an even larger area that is conveniently delivered by letter carriers from the Malibu post office. It is a logical error to say the true statement "the trail crosses all the major Canyon roads in Malibu" therefore "the trail is in the city of Malibu" (not true). The roads all start at PCH in Malibu but the actual trail crossings are outside the city limits.
 * I understand your reasoning, but like a lot of things, Wikipedia doesn't allow original research. We have to rely on secondary sources.  Nonetheless, it's just not that important to me.  Oddly important to others, which makes Wikipedia a mostly non-collegial place.  That has to change if Wikipedia is to continue.  Hike The Monicas (talk) 21:03, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

Assessment comment
Substituted at 05:26, 30 April 2016 (UTC)

Location of Laurel Canyon Blvd
Laurel Canyon Blvd is listed with the roads that are further west than the Sepulveda Pass. Actually Laurel Canyon runs well to the east of the Sepulveda Pass, between Coldwater Canyon Blvd and the 101 Freeway. Blixton (talk) 00:02, 21 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Can you provide a citation for this? FreeKnowledgeCreator (talk) 08:32, 23 December 2016 (UTC)

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