Talk:Sarmad Kashani

Heysan (talk) 07:04, 2 March 2016 (UTC)

WikiProject class rating
This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as stub, and the rating on other projects was brought up to Stub class. BetacommandBot 19:44, 9 November 2007 (UTC)

Jewish?
I don't understand the Jewish connection. Can someone clarify for me? There is nothing on Judaism in the article apart from Jewish reverence for him and links to Jewish articles. Norgy (talk) 20:09, 9 May 2008 (UTC)


 * There is a lot of evidence which suggests he was born into a Jewish family and then raised in a Jewish tradition before his multiple conversions/transition to mystic sainthood. See a recent paper (among others): The Identity of a Mystic: The Case of Sa'id Sarmad, a Jewish-Yogi-Sufi Courtier of the Mughals, Nathan Katz, Numen, Vol. 47, No. 2 (2000), pp. 142-160 (paper here).  His putative Jewish background and these sources should be noted, and people should stop deleting/changing the references to Judaism/Hinduism/Islam history and people.  It's ironic that the issue is debated here on Wikipedia, and that's fine, and is part of what makes Sarmad an interesting character.  But if you are going to change the stub, or edit the article, please provide some sources.  Yes, his background is disputed.  That is the point.  We're not trying to do original research here and come up with a definitive explanation for Sarmad's personal religious identity.  Gershonw (talk) 02:41, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

Name, Arabic or Persian?
This has been changed back and forth innumerable times on this page. Could some native speakers please confirm? My understanding is that SAMAD is Arabic for eternal, and that SARMAD means the same thing in Farsi. Anyone? Gershonw (talk) 14:57, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
 * If we do make it one or the other, please use the template: lang-ar| for arabic, lang-fa| for Persian. Just replace ar with fa in the current form.


 * I found it in Hans Wehr. I cannot solve the riddle as I don't have an etymological dictionary. Either way, please use the template for language names.  Ogress  smash!  16:22, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
 * He was writing in Persian and Arabic language is irrelevant here (no mater what the etymology of the word is). Alefbe (talk) 21:34, 27 April 2010 (UTC)

The need for major rewrite
Different sources present different stories about his family background and his religious affiliations. Some say he was from a Jewish family, some say Armenian and some even say that he was from a muslim family. Also, about renouncing Islam in favor of Hindoism, many sources don't support that, and many talk about his relation with the Nuqtavi sect. The current version of the article is a mixture of some sources in the most absurd way (for example by mixing contradicting claims about the Armenian and Jewish family background). Alefbe (talk) 21:44, 27 April 2010 (UTC)
 * gave it a try, still quite some work to do though! The best source on his religious inclinations is Katz (2000) (I think). Let me know what you think! Oh, and this article is in desparate need of more links to it from other articles... Bahnheckl (talk) 13:14, 17 January 2013 (UTC)

Heysan (talk) 07:04, 2 March 2016 (UTC) I do not see the contradiction between being Jewish and Armenian. The current wording seems fine, i.e., "Jewish Persian-speaking Armenian merchants".

Reason for execution
Heysan (talk) 07:04, 2 March 2016 (UTC) The page http://www.tribuneindia.com/2007/20071007/spectrum/book1.htm states that "Sarmad was initially accused of breaking an injunction against public nudity, but that was later dropped in favor of the charges of atheism and unorthodox religious practice, for which he was convicted." The page http://www.tribuneindia.com/2007/20071007/spectrum/book1.htm states that "Sarmad was beheaded because he refused to recite the full Kalima". Doesn't the "full Kalima" refer to "There is no god but God, [and] Muhammad is the messenger of God." Thus, it is not clear to me that the "second part" refers to "but God" (as currently stated in this article) and not "Muhammed is the messenger of God".

The Tragedy of Sufi Sarmad
My grandparents used to tell me the story of Sufi Sarmad. Sufi Sarmad was Muslim but he was the type of Sufi that should have never entered the city or be around regular people, Sufis like him should stay away from society and live in the wilderness where they can worship God alone. His death was indeed a tragedy and it was going to happen because Aurangzeb was very conservative and thus didn't understand Sufism like his predecessors did. Ofcourse if anyone walks around the city and shouts "There is no God" in a Muslim country during the middle ages, ofcourse they are asking to be executed...But Sufi Sarmad did not mean to say that "There is no God" he meant to say There is no God but God but since he never added the second part, people thought he was doing some sort of biddah. Not everyone can understand Sufis, Sufis are practicing Islam on a spiritual level that regular people can not understand. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2607:FEA8:5820:6A20:9930:B84E:6F08:5EE9 (talk) 07:14, 6 March 2021 (UTC)

Inal haq story is quite similar to Sufi Sarmad
There is another story of a Sufi who was executed, not sure if he was this same Sufi but there are similarities. My grandparents used to tell me the story as a child. Apparently there was a Sufi who used to go around town and shout inalhaq, inalhaq, inhalhaq, which I think means I am God. And basically the emperor had him executed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ironman993 (talk • contribs) 19:34, 6 March 2021 (UTC)

Sufi Sarmad was a great Sufi but he made some mistakes
Poor Sufi Sarmad, he should have never came into town, he should live in wilderness, that's where Sufis should be not in the public places because a regular person will not understand Sufis. Sufis worship God at a different level, regular Muslim can not understand it nor comprehend spirituality. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ironman993 (talk • contribs) 19:37, 6 March 2021 (UTC)