Talk:SaypYu

[Untitled]
I am not sure how relevant this article is (it was inspired by a British Broadcasting news item) nor how much of the alphabet is in the public domain, so I did not add material that is anyway on the company website Timpo (talk) 17:01, 23 February 2013 (UTC)

Notability
I'm a little concerned that this topic isn't notable enough for Wikipedia. People often come up with new spelling systems and similar for English and other languages. I'm not sure why this one, announced only a few months ago, deserves a full article. garik (talk) 00:41, 24 February 2013 (UTC)
 * After reading articles from the BBC I contacted Mr Jabbour by announcing this article on his his web. He has now responded by e-mail and telephone. He says the project is still SaypU.01 (PamD removed the word project from the original title) so it seems possible that this may become some sort of Wikiproject or maybe a separate Wiki ¿WikiSaypU? I will watch the project evolution, and suggest we
 * ''wait a few months to see if it fades or flies (¿Dec 2013?)

(Note for new users:Please add any delete/keep comments under this text but start with multiple indent colons) or use my link Timpo (talk) 09:22, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

International announcements
Various media outlets that have reported SaypU are linked below:

UK

 * [How to teach ... spelling? (Emily Drabble, The Guardian)]
 * [English - Fantastic fɘnetiks (Colin Hill, TES Times Educational Supplement)]
 * [Will a new phonetic alphabet catch on? (Anne Merritt, Anne Merritt)] — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.211.65.98 (talk) 17:54, 30 May 2013 (UTC)

Italy

 * [Rivoluzione “Spik inglish” E tu scrivi “come parli”? (Enrico Franceschini, La Republica)]
 * [Welkɘm! (annalisa pardini, La Magia della Scrittura)]
 * [L'inglese? Basta scriverlo come si parla (Valentina Crepax Leiweb, RCS Mediagroup S.p.A.)]

Greece

 * [Spik Inglish? Εχει νόημα να γράφουμε τα αγγλικά, όπως τα μιλάμε; (It makes sense to write English like talking?  Sakis Malavakis, The Sunday Tribune (Greece & Cyprus) Lambrakis Press SA)]

Turkey

 * [söylendiği gibi yazın text as it is spoken TRT-Turk news group / Haberdar.com)]

Russia

 * [New phonetic alphabet created (Leo Renolds, Voice of Russia]

Australia

 * [Some sound advice for a new alphabet (Greg Hurst, The Australian)]

China

 * [新拼音語言朗讀莎翁著作無難度 The new Pinyin language reading Shakespeare's writings without difficulty (Wen Wei Po, The new media center, Hong Kong')]

Timpo (talk) 16:48, 27 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Probably some of these above references could be incorporated within the article itself? I find La Republica (Italy) and The Sunday Tribune (Greece & Cyprus) articles very credible and reliable showing that the SaypU proposal is gaining international attention far beyond UK or USA.werldwayd (talk) 11:46, 15 August 2013 (UTC) werldwayd (talk) 11:52, 15 August 2013 (UTC)

help with Shwaa (ə)
Use this link:BBC Learning English: Shwaa it is already part of the International Phonetic Alphabet

Reverting possible vandalism by 66.25.64.92
 * ''The fact is you cannot raise literacy levels by making words easier, you make people dumber.

may be true, but it needs a reasonable sentence such as: There is no evidence.... plus a a reference to demonstrate why this may be. I rather think that the Arabic numeral system and modern romantic languages replaced the Roman models because of undue complexity?


 * Don't give up contributing because of a minor setback - register a user account and search for Help: :-)

Timpo (talk) 16:34, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

Phonetic?
The first major problem that any attempt to create a phonetic alphabet for English runs in to is the question "whose English?". English has many accents and dialects in England alone, let alone around the world. If one were to set the orthography according to, say, British Received Pronunciation, one risks alienating, say, American readers - and vice-versa. In order to maintain the phonetic nature of an alphabet, words would have to be spelled differently according to regional pronunciation. On the other hand, if spellings are fixed, and pronunciations allowed to vary, then the alphabet is not phonetic.(talk) 10:45, 26 February 2013 (UTC)


 * This is not the elegant International Phonetic Alphabet which addresses these issues in dictionaries but a quick and dirty script for penetrating foreign situations and pronouncing unusual place-names reasonably accurately with not too much hassle. Unlike many Romance languages English has no Royal Academy or Institute of English to determine spelling or pronunciation 'correctly'. This is project about finding a basic communication tool  despite regional variations (see also Basic English, Simplified English and  Special English). Timpo (talk) 17:00, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

The second major problem is the sheer number of vowel sounds in English. It is quite tricky to accommodate all of them using only five vowels even with combinations with each other or with modifiers such as y, w, r, h, without resorting to diacritics (accents).(talk) 10:45, 26 February 2013 (UTC)


 * There are about 34 IPA for the 26 Roman characters used in English. see: International Phonetic Alphabet chart for English dialects Timpo (talk) 17:00, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

The consonants are less problematic, although a decision must be made about compound consonants (sh, ch, th): should these be represented by digraphs (is that really phonetic, as letters change sound when in a digraph?) or by using diacritics (e.g. ć for ch, ś for sh, ź for soft j)? Voiced and unvoiced th should also be distinguishable. (talk) 10:45, 26 February 2013 (UTC)


 * for communication purposes it is often sufficient to substitute (as in socks = sox) so 'sh' may be 'z' 'ch' 'k' and for 'th' a single 't' will do in most cases Timpo (talk) 17:00, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

SaypU started out with a 24-letter alphabet (including a reversed 'e' to represent the schwa sound) and no diacritics. The spellings initially proposed often indicate that the creator leans more towards American pronunciation than to British. Alternative suggestions to some words already show disagreements caused by varying regional pronunciations. There are also suggestions to introduce diacritics and further letters (such as eth and thorn).(talk) 10:45, 26 February 2013 (UTC)


 * There are rather more American English speakers and teachers, and a great deal more films and other media, so for quick and dirty communication rather than elegant, sophisticated prose - its horses for courses Timpo (talk) 17:00, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

The introduction of new letters in SaypU, such as the reversed-e schwa (instead of the usual turned-e version) will also raise questions of availability in fonts and accessibility on various keyboard layouts. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 145.64.134.245 (talk) 10:45, 26 February 2013 (UTC)


 * This is lifted directly from the International Phonetic Alphabet. In fact the author points out somewhere on his website that an asterisk is a possible alternative Timpo (talk) 17:00, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

SaypU 'bot: Auto additions to Respelling /IPA?
It may be possible to write a 'bot to find articles with respelling or IPA, and add SaypU. These are early days, but anyone interested may want to look at these articles:
 * Bots (general introduction)
 * Help:Bot (Wikipedia policy for Bot approvals group)
 * Bot Approvals Group (how approval is obtained)
 * Manual of Style/Pronunciation (policy guide)
 * Pronunciation respelling key (when difficult words are written phonetically ¿fonetikli?)


 * Village pump (idea lab) (somewhere to fly ideas and get a discussion going
 * Canvassing (how not to do it - and some legitimate strategies)
 * Requests for comment (informal)
 * Consensus (how decisions are made)
 * Centralized discussion (where policy decisions evolve)

These are only a selection - doubtless I have missed something vital, but, since I'm not a software star, I just hope this may help you wizards do something generations of spelling reformers have failed to do (¿meyk Inglish speling fɘnetik?) Timpo (talk) 11:24, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Create a SaypU Wikipedia?
We have already have about 100 main-stream languages, why not start a wikipedia in SaypU-English, maybe milking some of the Simple English Wikipedia articles?
 * see: Simple Wikipedia start pageTimpo (talk) 14:47, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Official website
.. no longer exists. Delete article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A01:C22:C078:800:4C77:B8D6:279B:17EC (talk) 08:12, 16 August 2020 (UTC)