Talk:Scarface (1932 film)/Archive 1

Sex
was there some creepy sex stuff in this movie?
 * Since it was made in the 30's, likely not... 81.232.72.53 23:46, 28 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Well, it was Pre-Code. --Nelson Ricardo 01:56, 10 January 2006 (UTC)
 * No but there was creepy subtext. Tony is shown to love his sister in a not entirely brotherly way --213.155.214.19 19:14, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

Al Capone
Did he see this movie? I bet he did, as it is about him and all. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 172.143.232.224 (talk) 20:28, 27 January 2007 (UTC).


 * I doubt that "Al Capone liked the movie so much he owned his own copy of it". since Al Capone was known to kill people for calling him Scarface. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.202.233.100 (talk) 18:27, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

Pre-Code
I was wondering, what makes this film pre-code? Wasn't the code written in 1930? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.8.14.232 (talk • contribs) 06:03, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

The Production Code went into effect in 1934, and it compelled Hollywood to produce kinder, gentler films, historical biographies, adaptations of classic and modern novels and plays, and romantic comedies. Telegonus (talk) 10:50, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

Alternate Ending
The section on the alternate ending makes little sense because the original ending is not described anywhere in the article; I don't think the writers should assume most Wikipedia readers are familiar with a 1930's film. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.180.47.218 (talk) 12:46, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

Yo —Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.19.104.19 (talk) 15:38, 9 February 2009 (UTC)

This film was, for probably legal reasons, unavailable for showing on tv for decades. I did finally see it at a rep theatre in 1980. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Opusv5 (talk • contribs) 12:46, 7 August 2014 (UTC)

WikiProject Crime?
Since this is a crime/gangster film, shouldn't this be under the WikiProject Crime banner?--Paleface Jack 16:07, 29 March 2018 (UTC)

George Raft Image
I think that having a photo of George Raft from another film's trailer is irrelevant. He, specifically, is barely discussed in the article. This image doesn't add much to the article so I am going to get rid of it and replace it with something a little more applicable. Skyes(BYU) (talk) 20:19, 29 May 2018 (UTC)

Questionable information
I decided to, for the time being, delete the sentence stating that Capone's associates were hired on as consultants to the film. I asked professor of American and film studies at University of Warwick, J.E. Smyth (who has written journal articles and information in books on the subject of Scarface) about my issue finding sources to support this claim about Capone's henchmen. She said that this was a claim that Hawks made and can be found in some pressbooks, but that Hawks was not always the most reliable source. Due to the fact that I have read many books about Scarface and have yet to see this information included anywhere, I had gotten rid of it for now. If I come across it later in a reliable source, I will gladly put it back in. Skyes(BYU) (talk) 18:40, 30 May 2018 (UTC)

Removed category
I removed the recently added category "American black comedy films". This film was pre-WWII and not intended to be a comedy. The overacting in general in older films to us can sometimes appear comedic, because we are not used to that style of acting in modern film. All categories added must be backed up with a source. If you see a reliable source that says it was a black comedy, add it to the article, cite it, and add the category back. Thanks so much! Skyes(BYU) (talk) 16:23, 2 July 2018 (UTC)
 * I should clarify: yes, Hawks used some elements of black comedy, because that was his directing style, but the film itself isn't categorized as a black comedy according to the majority of sources. Skyes(BYU) (talk) 20:38, 3 August 2018 (UTC)

Thank you
A big thank you to anyone who has been making helpful edits to this page. I'm always happy to see edits for clarity and word choice as well as correctness, as sometimes it can be easy to miss the small things with your own writing. Skyes(BYU) (talk) 16:52, 22 August 2018 (UTC)

"Pre-code"
I'll do a thorough review of this article soon, but one immediate thought occurs: almost the first thing the lead mentions is that this is a "pre-code" film. The lead sentence is not the place for this information, and if it's important it should be spelled out exactly what this means in the lead - given a full sentence, rather than lumped in. A quick scan of the body of the article doesn't make it immediately obvious what it means either - it is mentioned but I think it needs to be spelled out more. Can someone just explain here what it means and what the significance is to the film? Popcornduff (talk) 08:47, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
 * , pre-code is a short era of film between 1929-1934, before the creation of the Production Code Administration (PCA) which served to screen and censor films. Films made in this short time period were a little racier, because although a Hays Code (precursor to the Motion Picture Production Code) was created in 1930, censorship wasn't strictly enforced until the creation of the PCA in 1934 and things such as crime, violence, sexuality, and innuendo were able to slip by easier. This explains why Scarface is a violent and racy film for the early 1900's, whereas the censorship of Scarface is explained by the existence of the Hays Office. If the PCA was in existence during the time rather than the Hays Code, it is unlikely that Hughes and Hawks would have been able to get away many of the things in the film they did, even though they were subject to some censorship which delayed the release of the film by about a year. I have been wondering for some time whether I should explain pre-code a little more in the article. After my explanation here, do you think the article would benefit from some extra clarification on Pre-Code Hollywood? Skyes(BYU) (talk) 19:26, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the explanation. I definitely think this needs some coverage in the lead (should be possibly to cover it briefly) and some better explanation in the body, as right now it's not clear. I can do that, once I understand it... But I'm still a little confused. If it was produced before the introduction of the production code, why was it censored, and who exactly censored it? You explain this above, I think, but I'm having trouble following it.
 * Hmm... maybe something like this (for the lead) is correct:


 * Scarface was produced before the introduction of the Motion Picture Production Code (MPPC) in 1934, which enforced regulations on film content. However, the Hays Code, a more lenient precursor to the MPPC, called for major alterations, including a prologue condemning gangsters, an alternate ending to more clearly reprehend Camonte, and the alternative title The Shame of a Nation.


 * Can you clarify? Popcornduff (talk) 07:04, 25 October 2018 (UTC)


 * I made some changes, let me know what you think. Skyes(BYU) (talk) 20:32, 25 October 2018 (UTC)


 * Cool, thanks. I've done a bit of copyediting. Popcornduff (talk) 06:57, 26 October 2018 (UTC)


 * , do you have any other suggestions for my article to make it more clear? I've done some more copy editing myself. Skyes(BYU) (talk) 19:14, 29 October 2018 (UTC)


 * I've made an initial stab at copyediting the article, but there's still a long way to go.
 * First impression is that this is very well researched, and clearly a labour of love. But from a writing perspective, it's extremely dense. There are a lot of needlessly complex sentences, and in some areas I lost the train of thought completely. The length and density might be why you've had some trouble attracting copyediting for the article. But there's definitely the makings of a great article here - it just needs trimming. I'll continue to work on it.
 * In the meantime, maybe you could take a look at the tags I've added - there are are a few points that need clarification. Popcornduff (talk) 05:29, 30 October 2018 (UTC)


 * I attempted to address the tags. I would have removed them myself, but I would rather you see if the change was adequate before removing them. Skyes(BYU) (talk) 20:53, 31 October 2018 (UTC)