Talk:Schwertbrüder

This article is a copy-paste duplicate of the article on Livonian Brothers of the Sword, which is the English name of that order. I wanted to simply redirect it there, but an anon user opposed, so I'm puzzled. What should be done? Halibutt July 1, 2005 11:02 (UTC)


 * Naming conventions (use English): Title your pages using the English name, if one exists, and give the native spelling on the first line of the article. If the native spelling is not in the Latin alphabet, also provide a Latin transliteration. Only use the native spelling as an article title if it is more commonly used in English than the anglicized form.. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 3 July 2005 14:24 (UTC)

Actually it only started by paste-copy, to be sure nothing gets lost and article History can be traced back be those concerned with it and possibly with credit; furthermore I find technical problems frequently cause my contributions to get lost ‘in the mail’ or even the whole connection broken off, not only when saving but even just using Preview. Then several minor changes -mainly additions- were already made, intending to do more, but as they got lost each time someone reverts, I froze work pending clarity under which name it would end up. But more to the point, the matter of the name (by the way, I'm a Flemish historian, not likely to be biased in this matter, nor am I in general). As the order was essentially German, and soon merged into the Teutonic Order, its official and authentic names are in German, and of course in Latin, these languages are the natural options, not English of any other anachronistic rendering. In my experience there is no single commonly established name, in English or any other language, and Sources (unfortunately as rarely included in articles as other References- here completely absent before my first contribution; that's a rarely observed fundamental scientific rule we should to well to devote more time to then relatively cosmetic conventions as naming) tend to use and/or quote various lists and forms in various languages, without a constant of grammatical structure or even of significant components. It would be interesting if someone could quote the official text of the order's rule. The element “sword” (with brother or bearer) seems the most constant and is the only relatively distinctive one; the element “Livonian” seems rare and is even rather an illogical anachronism : the order intended to work a far larger Baltic territory, it just ended up there as a regional wing of the Teutonic Order (which is almost a household name, so there every language has an established form). So I opt for the authentic German language, and -brüder as brother expresses the nature of an order, without further optional attributes. 193.191.210.10 8 July 2005 06:31 (UTC)