Talk:Scytale (Dune)

Copyright infringement
This entry is lifted verbatim and considerably abridged from "The Dune Encyclopedia" by Willis McNelly. I am reluctant to simply erase it, since I don't have anything to put in its place, but it really needs to be revised by someone more conversant with the Dune canon than I. -cwp —Preceding unsigned comment added by 131.241.8.250 (talk • contribs) 08:07, 15 June 2005


 * This entire article is copied verbatim from "The Dune Encyclopedia".  I don't think this should continue in it's current form. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.164.250.107 (talk • contribs) 14:19, 8 July 2005


 * I wrote my own entry and credited the former post to Dr. McNelly. jlk —Preceding unsigned comment added by 141.155.65.99 (talk • contribs) 07:03, 4 January 2006

Nullentropy tube
In the old canon, Leto II cells are NEVER mentioned. Leto II was the Prophet to the Tleilaxu, and there is no way Scytale could have just accidently forgot to mention them. That is a "new" canon addition TMB —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.35.104.139 (talk • contribs) 21:26, 8 March 2007
 * I put in a quote from Chapterhouse and separated out the Hunters info to make the designation; thanks for noticing the problem. TAnthony 14:14, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

Scytale in Heretics
One of the things that is mentioned in Heretics is that all of the most important Tleilaxu knowledge has been concentrated into one powerful goverment, and that Scytale had spoken with Muad'dib himself. Is this worthy of mention? (Note that "everyone of them" had been awakened in ghola flesh time and time again--so the present Scytale is a serial ghola) The quote from Heretics:

"There! Let them think on that! Every one of them here had been wakened time after time in ghola flesh. There was a fleshly continuity in this Council that no other people had ever achieved. Mirlat himself had seen the Prophet with his own eyes. Scytale had spoken to Muad'dib! Learning how the flesh could be renewed and the memories restored, they had condensed this power into a single government whose potency was confined lest it be demanded everywhere." —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Tleilax Master B (talk • contribs) 21:21, 3 April 2007 (UTC).


 * I did incorporate part of this quote and one from Chapterhouse because they seem to be the only ones that indicate that the "new" Scytale is a reincarnation of the one from Messiah and thus a Face Dancer-turned-Master. TAnthony 23:00, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

Scytale as face dancer
Scytale is a face dancer in Dune Messiah. Hower he is a Tleilaxu master in all the later box. From Dune prequels we know that even before that time face dancers were lower caste of Tleilaxu and servants to its masters. In Scytale we have a face dancer which became master. There are only to four possiblities which could fix this mess: --Čeha (razgovor) 00:06, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
 * That Scytale changed it's rank becaused of its accomplishments (he discovered formula for immortality of Tleilaxu, through first Idaho ghola).
 * That Scytale was specialy bio-engineered for toping Paul Attreides (similar way to Malky or Hwi from GEoD). He would have about ten years by that time, but as a face dancer he could gather experiance by coppying it from others (presumably T.Masters).
 * That most(or at least some) of the Tleilaxu masters (Ben Ajica been a nottable exception) at the time of DM where face dancers for the reasons of practising at least partly immortality (face dancers had abillities to copy parts of memory of the person they coppied. And when Scytale discovered the other, "more clean" and succesfull way to achive immortality for its people, they just stopped with previous practicies (considering them unclean) and devoleped technics to assure of total control of servitude face dancers, while erasing that abbility from it's own genes (hower Scytale itself is not considered T.Master in Dune Messiah).
 * that there were two Scytales, one a face dancer who died in DM, and other a T.Master which achived immortality throught rest of the serries...
 * Alas, all we have are the inconsistencies and our own speculation. And in Heretics it is noted that "Scytale had spoken to Muad'dib," which seems to eliminate your 4th point and make things more complicated ;) &mdash; TAnthonyTalk 01:45, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
 * If one takes only the original 6 books into account then it's pretty obvious that Tleilaxu society had changed since the days of Muad'dib. Also, remember that copying memories was something that Face Dancers only started doing later. Ciobanica (talk) 11:53, 9 February 2009 (UTC)

Pronunciation
Contrary to the audiobook, "Scytale" is not pronounced like "sky tail". It's a cryptographic term derived from Greek and usually pronounced in English to rhyme with "Italy". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.15.114.23 (talk) 11:13, 10 May 2010 (UTC)
 * The real-world scytale may be pronounced that way, but this article is about a fictional character with a different pronunciation. The audiobook is an officially licensed property while your personal opinion is just that. Thanks.&mdash; TAnthonyTalk 05:42, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

In-universe?
Not sure I agree with the "in-universe" tag on just placed on this article. The lead makes it clear that this is a fictional character and cites his appearances in the novels. The subsequent sections are by novel, with publication dates.&mdash; TAnthonyTalk 03:10, 6 July 2010 (UTC)
 * The tag says "primarily". Kenilworth Terrace (talk) 17:07, 6 July 2010 (UTC)