Talk:Sega Genesis/Archive 8

Pushing for FA
So what's next if we're going to push this article to FA? I've never written an FA before, so I'm not sure exactly what more we need to do (other than add a couple more citations, probably). And thanks for all your kindness everyone, I appreciate the barnstars and the comments you guys have left me. Red Phoenix flame of life...protector of all... 13:47, 28 April 2008 (UTC)
 * It definitely needs to use the Kent book. Fortunately, my local library had it in when I went there this past weekend, now I just need to find the time to read through the MD-related chapters again and write up some text. Anomie⚔ 03:15, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

After checking WP:FACR. I think the citations are the main thing that there is to worry about. Everything else an FA needs pretty much in place already. We could ask for someone to review it as if it were an FA attempt in order to pre-empt any problems.- X201 (talk) 12:35, 6 May 2008 (UTC)
 * I want to start by congratulating everyone involved in getting this article up to this standard. It has imrpoved greatly since the last time I looked through it. I have glanced through it and noticed minor problems.
 * Redundancy words have been spotted. e.g “some”, “a variety/number/majority of”, “several”, “a few”, “many”, “any”, “all”.
 * Referencing positioning needs some attention. They should be located right after a punctuation mark.
 * A quick reference check reveals a couple of dead links.
 * Nreive (talk) 14:19, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

I don't see any dead links, just some moved ones/ ones that were able to be found. Red Phoenix flame of life...protector of all... 02:27, 16 May 2008 (UTC)

As a bit of a progress report, I'm almost done with what I can get from Kent; someone thinks it needs to be "heavily revised" though. There is a good bit on the TMSS and the related court case I have to summarize yet. Anomie⚔ 01:21, 27 May 2008 (UTC)
 * I think we're a little undersourced in the technical specifications, too. And I'm worried about a couple of sources, since I never got good responses about their reliability (namely the ones you pointed out in your peer review, Anomie.)  I'll try to see what I can turn up in my local library, but I'm not hopeful since they didn't even have the Kent book in the whole city (and I live in  a fairly large city).  Red Phoenix  flame of life...protector of all... 16:52, 27 May 2008 (UTC)

Just checking
There were 3 models for the genesis, 2 versions of the CD, a 32X, and a CDX? Is that all or is there even more? I don't think the article does a good job explaining that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by SeQel (talk • contribs) 15:07, 2 November 2008 (UTC)

Corrections and other musings
>>The Sega Mega Drive's CPU is a 16/32-bit Motorola 68000

The 68000 is a 16-bit CPU. It has a 16-bit data bus and 16-bit ALU. Any 32-bit memory access takes two 16-bit accesses back-to-back, 32-bit logic operations require passing data through the ALU in two 16-bit units and the instruction timings reflect this - a true 32-bit CPU would have best-case timings for it's native 32-bit operations, whereas the 68000 has best-case timings for 16-bit operations only.

For comparison the Z80, a well-known 8-bit CPU, can do arithmetic and memory transfers with 16-bit units of data, but again using it's 8-bit data bus and 8-bit ALU twice. It is the same thing with the 68000.

Later versions of the 68000 are 32-bit and the 68000 was designed with a 32-bit upgrade path in mind, but the CPU itself is not 32-bit and should not be labeled as 16/32-bit.

>>"Instead, NTSC games use the 224-line resolution to free up more vertical blanking time to send more updates to the VDP"

This is conjecture. Typically all 240 lines of a NTSC display are not completely visible across your average selection of television sets; for this reason the NES specifications (a console that had a 240-line display) advised important information not to be shown in the upper 8 or lower 8 scanlines, indicating only the middle 224 were guaranteed to be visible. As further proof PAL consoles display more lines per frame, and correspondingly the VDP has a 240-line display mode that only works on PAL consoles. This is a visibility issue, not a performance one.

>>as the extra lines end up in the overscan of a 60 Hz (NTSC) signal.

Incorrect. The 240-line mode does not work on NTSC console at all, the text implies that it could work, but that it would be clipped. The VDP display timing for 240-line mode is hardwired for PAL display characteristics, and selecting 240-line mode on a NTSC console displays an unstable image with no vertical sync or blanking period that rolls repeatedly as the VDP never gets to a high enough scanline number to proceed to generate these signals.

>>The FM sound synthesis IC resembles the Yamaha YM2151

Incorrect. The YM2612 is a derivative of the YM2203 and is functionally identical to two YM2203's in the same physical IC, sans PSG and I/O ports and with some additional features. While the YM2151 is another popular FM chip, it's underlying technology (OPM) is different from that used in the YM2203/YM2612 (OPN). The only similarity the YM2151 and YM2612 have is that they are both FM chips produced by Yamaha.

>>The use of the digitized audio allows for stereo sound and is output only through the headphone jack on model 1 systems and through AV out on model 2 systems along with mono signal.[11]

Misleading. None of the audio output is digital; the PSG in the VDP outputs a single analog channel, the YM2612 outputs two analog channels. All audio mixing and amplification is done with analog electronics.

>>'''The Secondary RAM, which consists of 8 KB, is part of Z80 address space and is used as Main RAM in Master System compatibility mode. There are also 8 KB of audio RAM.[13]'''

These two statements are contradictory to earlier information. There is 8K of RAM used by the Z80 which could be described as "Z80 work RAM" which is used for that purpose regardless of Mark-III mode or regular mode. Secondary RAM implies it being secondary to the main RAM of the 68000, though the two are physically isolated on two seperate buses and it's really intended for the Z80. I would suggest deleting the last statement ('there are also...') and calling "Secondary RAM" Z80 work RAM instead.

>>'''"Majesco's Genesis 3 (single-chip and dual-chip versions) retains the Mode 4 support but has the Master System compatibility removed from the bus controller logic.[13] This renders the Power Base Converter or any other adapter useless. 68000 software can still enable and use Mode 4, however.[11]" '''

Both statements are not listed on the webpages cited as sources; furthermore I added the original text of these statements (first time they were published publically) to this article quite some time ago. If at one time the webpages had these statements and they were cited then, the authors almost certainly took them from an earlier version of this article. It's a circular reference, and as it stands the citations are incorrect. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.110.14.117 (talk) 02:19, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

Genesis
The Mega Drive is called the Genesis in the U.S. This is the english wikipedia. So I think we should change the title to Sega Genesis.76.195.7.95 (talk) 22:01, 27 June 2008 (UTC)


 * The United States isn't the only country in the world that speaks English, though, so that reasoning is a bit flawed. Anyway, this has been discussed to death previously. Here is the most recent archived discussion on it, which also contains links to other discussion on the same topic. Dreaded Walrus t c 22:04, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

http://www.googlefight.com/index.php?lang=en_GB&word1=Sega+Megadrive&word2=Sega+Genesis http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Sega+Megadrive&btnG=Google+Search http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Sega+Genesis&btnG=Search I still think we should change it. 76.195.7.95 (talk) 18:23, 28 June 2008 (UTC)


 * The name is actually "Mega Drive" (two words) rather than "Megadrive", which you used for your searches. A Google search for pages using either one or both of these terms yields over seven million hits. But there are better reasons than Google hits for the article having the name it has; see here for the debate that resulted in the change of title from "Sega Mega Drive/Sega Genesis" to "Sega Mega Drive".  Mi re ma re  19:40, 28 June 2008 (UTC)

Mega Drive gets more than Sega Genesis, But SEGA Mega Drive gets less because there is a tape player called the Mega Drive76.195.7.95 (talk) 21:39, 28 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Which oddly enough is the descendant of one of the devices that is believed to have caused the name change in the first place. - X201 (talk) 09:48, 29 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Well, in order to find out how many of those "mega drive" hits are not about the console, you can specifically exclude the word "sega" from the search... that results in under three million hits, many of which are still clearly about the console anyway.  Mi re ma re  16:51, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

Question
What was the primary reason the article title was directed to Sega Mega Drive? - A Link to the Past (talk) 06:33, 12 July 2008 (UTC)

Most likely created by someone outside of North America. freehunter 14:56, 26 March 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Freehunter (talk • contribs)

The console is called "Sega Mega Drive" in practically every country in the world, as well as practically every English-speaking country. This is "the English Wikipedia", not "Wikipedia for the USA". American names do not automatically take priority. AdamantBMage (talk) 00:59, 4 April 2009 (UTC)


 * "American names do not automatically take priority." They certainly don't, seeing as the site, despite claims of NPOV is incredibly biased against ever using American terms for things. Look if the system sold "World Wide: 29 million[1]" and "United States: 14 million[2]" nearly half were sold in the US. Unless there were less than 1 million systems sold in non English speaking countries, a ridiculous notion considering "Brazil: 2 million[3]" accounts for more than that, over half of the systems sold in English speaking countries were sold in the United States. It's clear from the cited data in this article's sidebar that the majority of English speaking countries' systems were Genesis branded, not Mega Drive branded. But that doesn't matter, because some UK/Aus people will get their panties in a bunch if a page ever goes to the American term, not theirs, even in cases like this were it was the dominant English language term.76.234.153.18 (talk) 23:28, 8 June 2009 (UTC)


 * There have been many long discussions about this, and the consensus has been for some time that the most widely used name world-wide should be the primary name for the article (in this case, "Mega Drive"). This is not directly tied to sales figures.  Your argument that nearly half of the units sold worldwide were American units under the name "Genesis" is easily countered with "That means more than half of the units sold around the world were called 'Mega Drive'."  However, it's not even so much whether the majority of units sold were "Genesis" - the name "Genesis" is only meaningful in the US.  The name "Mega Drive" was used pretty much everywhere else.  This is different from, say, Super Nintendo Entertainment System, where the original name "Super Famicom" was only used in Japan and a few other relatively minor regions. &mdash; KieferSkunk (talk) &mdash; 00:28, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

Sorry for being a bit opportunistic, but the same discussion has been going on for ages about the NEC PC Engine, and maybe it's time we need administrative support to address the current situation. Right now, the article points to TurboGrafx for the very same reasons that some North American people here have argued before: Wikipedia is in English, English is the language of the USA (duh) therefore the console should be internationally known as the TurboGrafx. The weakest and silliest argument I've heard was that "TurboGrafx" was an English name, while "PC Engine" was not. Hilarious! This machine was built by NEC (not TTI, which was only the US distributor) and widely known in Asia and Europe under the import name PC Engine. As of today, the PC Engine/TurboGrafx article is a mess. I know the Wikipedia motto is "BE BOLD", but so far it hasn't helped improve the situation nor reach a consensus there. Help requested! Kaminari (talk) 17:03, 17 June 2009 (UTC)


 * The discussion on that topic has been a complete mess for a long time. I think that there's a severe lack of consensus on the issue there, partly because nobody can seem to agree on what the system was called in the UK.  But I will say that arguments based on this being the "English Wikipedia" are fundamentally flawed: The rule about using English names applies to articles where there is both an English name and a direct foreign-language equivalent.  For example, "Brain Age" has a very long Japanese-only title, whereas "Mega Drive", "Super Famicom" and "PC Engine" are still written in English, but are the Japanese (and in some cases, other countries') titles for the respective products.
 * In other words, that rule is there to prevent the English Wikipedia from having pages with titles written in foreign languages. It does not mean that the titles of the pages must always reflect the title of USA or British versions of products. &mdash; KieferSkunk (talk) &mdash; 20:39, 17 June 2009 (UTC)


 * In the UK it was always marketed, sold and known as the Megadrive.86.168.10.214 (talk) 22:42, 6 July 2009 (UTC)

Requested move

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the proposal was no move. JPG-GR (talk) 04:44, 22 July 2008 (UTC)

Sega Mega Drive → Sega Genesis

Pro:
 * 1) Search engine test results as recommended by WP:COMMONNAME using Google, Excite.UK, and Yahoo produce fewer results for "Mega Drive" than "Sega Genesis"
 * Google:
 * "Sega Genesis": 4,030,000
 * "Mega Drive": 4,030,000
 * "Sega Mega Drive": 1,850,000


 * Yahoo:
 * "Sega Genesis": 7,530,000
 * "Mega Drive": 5,670,000


 * AltaVista:
 * "Sega Genesis": 7,520,000
 * "Mega Drive": 5,630,000


 * Ask.com
 * "Sega Genesis": 242,500
 * "Mega Drive": 96,800


 * Excite.UK
 * "Sega Genesis": 242,600
 * "Mega Drive": 105,400


 * Ebay:
 * "Sega Genesis": 2,990 items
 * "Mega Drive": 181 items


 * 1) Genesis name is used on GameFAQs, GameSpot, GameRankings and other CNET websites, as well as MobyGames, Ebay, and Amazon.com. These are sites a user new to the subject would go to, and are considered valid resources for Wikipedia articles within context.
 * 2) To date, no equal importance third-party websites shown using the Mega Drive name as a primary have been presented in this discussion.
 * 3) Sega continues to use Genesis branding for North America releases. See Sega Genesis Collection.
 * 4) Previous discussions did not include these arguments.
 * 5) Consensus was not complete, as confusion evidenced on this very page over the title exists.
 * 6) Per Naming conventions (use English), most English references used in the article use the name "Sega Genesis" or simply "Genesis".

Cons:
 * 1) Primary counter argument is Sega Genesis is a title only used in North America (the United States and Canada). Other English speaking nations received the console as "Mega Drive"
 * 2) EBay.UK uses "Sega Mega Drive", however the Sega CD retains its name as "Sega CD", and not "Sega Mega-CD". Amazon.co.uk lists it as "Sega Megadrive"
 * 3) Search engines argued as "US centric"

Neutral:
 * 1) Compromised title of "Sega Mega Drive & Sega Genesis" has been stated to be "impossible" due to naming conventions.

Results:
 * 1) People new to the subject are more common for English speakers to encounter it as "Sega Genesis" due to the primary hubs used for information on video games for said group.
 * 2) Genesis name is much more common to produce results in search engines over Mega Drive.

Thus I propose moving this article to Sega Genesis, in light of the findings. There is no evidence presented to show that the English speaking community on the whole finds "Sega Mega Drive" to be a more common title for the console than "Sega Genesis", and evidence to the contrary has in fact been presented with the reasons above.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 15:14, 15 July 2008 (UTC)

Discussion

 * Oppose. While it is inarguable that the majority of the world's (native) English speakers know the console as the Genesis (for the simple reason that the majority of the world's native English speakers live in North America), that all uses of this term are in North America means that moving it would be lending undue weight to a minority position, World wide, the console sold roughly equally under both names and was marketed under the current name in the vast majority of markets. Chris Cunningham (not at work) - talk 17:18, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
 * You yourself state "it is inarguable that the majority of the world's English speakers know the console as the Genesis", but you will find Naming conventions (use English). You'll note it clearly states the common name in English. To quote: "if one name is clearly most commonly used in the English-language references for the article, use it."--Kung Fu Man (talk) 17:34, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Have you read the previous discussions on this topic? It is called "Mega Drive" in England, and we speak English in England. You should also have a look at WP:ENGVAR. Wikipedia does not solely use American English, no matter how many people live in North America. Majority (if indeed there is one) is not relevant in Wikipedia. (I oppose this move.) 128.232.1.193 (talk) 17:45, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Did you read Naming conventions (use English)? If you notice the article itself uses English references that primarily state Genesis. And majority is the guideline to the most common name for a subject.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 17:48, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
 * The guideline Naming conventions (use English) is not relevant here. That is specifically about deciding whether to use an English title or a foreign language title. (OK, majority may be appropriate in that circumstance.) But neither "Genesis" nor "Mega Drive" are foreign language. They are both English and are both used in English-speaking countries. 128.232.1.193 (talk) 18:31, 15 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Oppose. 7.3 million google hits for Mega Drive. Also, the majority of the world's English speakers aren't in North America, just the majority of the native English speakers. The majority of the world's English speakers reside in regions (mostly Asia) where the console was known by its original name.  Mi re ma re  17:39, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Adding Sega into the search query in either sense produces far less results however.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 17:48, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
 * For what it's worth, the form "Sega Mega Drive" is as comparatively rare as the forms "Microsoft Xbox" and "Sony PlayStation". Most people just use Mega Drive, or Xbox, or PlayStation. With Genesis, this is slightly less the case, as the form "Sega Genesis" avoids the ambiguity that can occur from simply using "Genesis" (which commonly also refers to Genesis (band), and the Book of Genesis, for example). Dreaded Walrus t c 17:59, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Well the point being "Mega Drive" and "MegaDrive" are terms that have applied to other items as well, such as this, which would get clumped in any search.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 18:13, 15 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Are you even reading your arguments? fully 70% of the results on the first page there are on the console, with two driving instructors and one disk wipe utility. Chris Cunningham (not at work) - talk 18:27, 15 July 2008 (UTC)


 * And for me, it's one driving instructor, and one disk wipe utility. The driving instructor is 4th, and the disk wipe utility is 10th. The rest (on the first page, at least) are all to do with the console. Dreaded Walrus t c 18:33, 15 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Taking those seven million results and making google exclude pages that include the word "sega" results in 3 million pages that could possibly be about some non-Sega "mega drive" product. However, looking at these results reveals that most of them are about the Sega console anyway; they simply don't mention the manufacturer. This is a fairly common practise as Dreaded Walrus points out. For example, "sony playstation" gets 28.6 million hits whereas "playstation" alone gets 236 million.  Mi re ma re  19:13, 15 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Oppose - North America is the only region where this console is known as the Genesis. The intended name, and name used in other markets was the Mega Drive.  The nominator's reasoning that it should be moved to Genesis because there are more native English speakers in North America versus everywhere else in the world is unconvincing, as this isn't the Wikipedia for native English speakers only.  This move was also discussed at Wikipedia_talk:VG. - hahnch e n 18:11, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Oppose - This has been discussed the hell out of before, and consensus has not changed. We've established a "status quo" here, one that I believe fits, and we should stick to it.   Red Phoenix  flame of life...protector of all... 18:39, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Oppose - exactly per hahnch e n above. Fin©™ 10:37, 16 July 2008 (UTC)

So given what's good for the goose is also for the gander, shall Star Fox 64 be renamed to Lylat Wars? Star Fox 64 was a name used only in the US after all.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 00:05, 17 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Star Fox 64 is known primarily by that name by gamers throughout the English-speaking world, even though it was released under the title Lylat Wars. If you look on British websites/forums, they will almost without variation call it Star Fox. Likewise, Bully (video game) is known primarily by that name within gaming circles, even in the UK where it was called Canis Canem Edit. Dreaded Walrus t c 00:09, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
 * And in addition, it appears (according to the article) that Star Fox 64 was only released as Lylat Wars in Europe and Australia, and was known as Star Fox 64 everywhere else. That isn't a North America-only name like with Genesis. Dreaded Walrus t c 00:13, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Still it's a case though that the game was something else in Europe, a big argument here. The thinking that "Europe applies more" or "Asia applies more" gets wonky when applied to other games. Tossing out policy and fact aside, there's really not much to argue against such a move if enough people feel it should be moved, no?--Kung Fu Man (talk) 00:22, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I guess a better example would be the Final Fantasy Legend series. It's a game series released in North America and Japan, but only called FFL here, while it's known as SaGa, it's intended name as evidenced by later titles and the statement the rename was done to cash in on the Final Fantasy franchise. Similar point, but ask any non-Japanese fluent english speaker and to them, it's still FFL. See what I'm getting at?--Kung Fu Man (talk) 00:25, 17 July 2008 (UTC)


 * WRT Final Fantasy Legend, it's known throughout the English-speaking world (at least the English-speaking world where the game was released) as Final Fantasy Legend. It was only known as SaGa in Japan. Other examples would be the Shin Sangokumusou series, known throughout the English-speaking world as Dynasty Warriors, or the Chikyuu Boueigun series, known in English-speaking territories as Monster Attack (first game - doesn't have an article as it was very very rare and released only in the UK, I think), Global Defence Force (second game), and Earth Defense Force 2017. Of course, there are thousands of other cases where the game's name is changed from the Japanese market when bringing it to English-speaking markets.
 * To address your first paragraph, I agree 100% that if consensus forms for a move, then a move should happen. The argument is not so much "Europe applies more" as it is "the entire world outside of North America applies more". The majority of English speakers (not just counting native English speakers) know the console as the Mega Drive. Dreaded Walrus t c 00:36, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Yet if enough of a push on any of the other articles we've mentioned here existed to be moved to the European or Japanese name, what would you bring up to argue against a move? Policy has had little effect here, and primary sources someone completely oblivious to a subject would encounter a particular name as at first has none either. What I mean is, what actual facts to show one name is more common over another would you cite? (For the record, if this was a case where the majority of sources pointed at Mega Drive, I wouldn't be arguing this at all).--Kung Fu Man (talk) 01:23, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Simple. If I was involved in a move discussion on any of the other articles mentioned so far, I would reference WP:USEENGLISH. In the case of Star Fox (and Bully), which is known by different names in different English-speaking territories, I would reference WP:COMMONNAME. As for the reason the majority of sites on the internet use Genesis, this could be put down to the fact that internet games-related sites are much more prevalent in the United States, and United States-based websites are much more popular. And then there's the structure of these sites, too, and how these are picked up by search engines. For example, searching for "Genesis" on ign.com results in 57,300 hits, whereas searching for "Mega Drive" on Eurogamer results in 1,050. As WP:USEENGLISH suggests, when English usage is divided, Google hits are an unreliable test other than to determine whether a term is actually used or not. In other words, if a Google search for "Les Reed" + "Eggman" + "Charlton" comes up with just one relevant hit, it's fairly safe to assume that Eggman is not a terribly common nickname for former Charlton Athletic F.C. manager Les Reed. For almost everything else regarding divided English usage, the Google test is unreliable. Dreaded Walrus t c 02:01, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I could see that point, though there's still an issue bugging me: most of the references there in English use Genesis as a name, which would be an equal argument against the hypothetical moves mentioned above, no?--Kung Fu Man (talk) 02:19, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Look at it this way. Star Fox is there because it's the original name that is ALSO used outside Japan officially; similarly, Mega Drive is the official name ALSO used outside Japan. Saga ISN'T used outside Japan, it's only FFL. ♫ Melodia Chaconne ♫ (talk) 02:15, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
 * SaGa is used for later titles in that series (Romancing SaGa, Unlimited SaGa, etc). There's no guarantee that Square of today would re-release the titles using either name to boot. On the other hand, Sega does still use Genesis for Genesis titles, when there shouldn't be much reason according to the counterargument here no? (i.e. the changes they did with Eggman vs. Robotnik?)--Kung Fu Man (talk) 02:19, 17 July 2008 (UTC)


 * What are you using this page to talk about the titles of random Japanese SNES games? If you've got issues with the names of other articles, then take it up on those talk pages. Your Grand Unified Theory of page naming evidently isn't popular enough to warrant moving this page, so can we kill this thread off please? Chris Cunningham (not at work) - talk 09:34, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
 * For the hell of it, since you missed my point, I mean that the case of the name change is the same there with the US name being exclusive, and nobody would move it without citing facts over which was more common. Facts would be needed for both sides in that case at the very least.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 03:36, 19 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Support the vast majority of english language consoles sold under the Genesis moniker. 70.55.203.3 (talk) 03:08, 19 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I know this is going to sound accusatory for which I apologise but, how did you find this debate? Only it tends to look a bit odd when an IP user only has 3 edits and those edits are all in connection with a sometimes contentious thing like a name change. - X201 (talk) 10:22, 19 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I wouldn't say it's suspicious - some of my first edits were to a talk page. And if you visit a talk page by chance and see there is a discussion about something you care a lot about, then it may well cause you to make your first edits (just think of how many unregistered first-edits happened to the old "Football (soccer)" move discussions). Either that, or s/he may have a dynamic IP. Dreaded Walrus t c 17:56, 19 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Source? The article states 29 million worldwide, with 14 million in the US, which makes it about even. Dreaded Walrus t c 03:18, 19 July 2008 (UTC)
 * He/she might be looking at it as the non-NA sales split between Asia and Europe, which would amount to NA selling more per region (just something that came to mind).--Kung Fu Man (talk) 03:36, 19 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Oppose.Hahnchen has pretty much summed it all up. The fact that Mega Drive is the original name and the name that it was known by around the World, and indeed, was the intended name for North America until trademark problems prevented it. The common sense angle also appeals to me, to have an article at its original Worldwide name rather than a name that was used in just one region. - X201 (talk) 10:12, 19 July 2008 (UTC)


 * In case it wasn't already obvious, Oppose per my comments above. Dreaded Walrus t c 17:47, 19 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Support. All the opposition clearly comes from a Euro-bias with mostly British Wikipedians who like the article with the name they know while the American and Canadian side is clearly underrepresented.  This is the same problem with this article, it's unfair to all the Americans and Canadians who know this system as the Genesis.  It's written as if "Mega Drive" is the real name and "Genesis" is the wrong name used only by stupid Americans.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.192.36.120 (talk) 10:55, 20 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Wow. I didn't know I lived in Europe. And here I thought Ohio was in the US and I owned a plastic computer with "Genesis" on it. Guess I was wrong... ♫ Melodia Chaconne ♫ (talk) 12:41, 20 July 2008 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.