Talk:Seventh-day Adventist Church/Archive 5

SectNPOV tag on intro
What is the part of the introduction that is clearly not NPOV? Ans e  ll  00:14, 19 April 2006 (UTC)

DMOZ forum links
Wikipedia is not meant to provide a way for adventists to feel like they are a community by directing them to forums that they can use. Removing directory link again until a consensus is reached on this. Ans e  ll  00:14, 19 April 2006 (UTC)

Total length of External links section
I don't see why there should be more than one screenful of links, which is how many are currently there. I tried to remove the least notable links, however, there may be others that can be put back in or still more that can be taken out if they are sufficiently notable. I think that having an equal number of links pointing out issues in the church, and links rebutting the sites which point out the issues is a good idea. It is as close to the NPOV that is desired for wikipedia as we will be able to get. After trawling through the section in response to the sectNPOV accusation which doesn't seem to be formally discussed here, I didn't see why the tag still needed to be there, so I removed it. Ans e  ll  00:42, 19 April 2006 (UTC)


 * I don't see how Good News Unlimited is an opposing church position. MyNam e IsNotBob  00:57, 19 April 2006 (UTC)


 * Feel free to rearrange, large changes wont be perfect. Maybe we need to figure out an acceptable structure that wont be prone to bloat like the one I replaced was. There was a different category for everything you could possibly want to see and I didn't see a way to keep the total number under control with such a system. Ans  e  ll  01:09, 19 April 2006 (UTC)

What is the NPOV dispute?
At the risk of inflaming things again, may I ask why there is an NPOV tag on this article? As a neutral observer I see nothing egregiously unbalanced about this article. Can we get rid of some of those tags, or am I being too optimistic? --Rhombus 01:13, 20 April 2006 (UTC)


 * I have removed the tag primarily due to lack of explanation as to its existence. The article remains poorly referenced however. MyNam e IsNotBob  01:47, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

Anabaptist tradition & present truth
I've moved this from the main page, because I don't think these statements really fit at the opening of the "doctrine" section. Any ideas? Where would statements like this be more suitable? Tonicthebrown 11:16, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

Seventh-day Adventist doctrine is based on the Anabaptist Protestant tradition. The Protestant understanding of the "priesthood of all believers" is so central to the thinking of Seventh-day Adventists that members have always been encouraged to study the Bible to discover "present truth" for themselves guided of the Holy Spirit.

States all over the world
In witch states in our world are living some adventists? Perhabs in Central-Asia (Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan, Usbekistan, Turkmenistan), Israel. In the Former USSR are living a lot of Germans. They are Mennonite and Baptists, but are there Seventh-Day-Adventists, too? Shalom, Simon. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.169.215.238 (talk • contribs) 04:45, 29 April 2006
 * Have fun with the yearbook. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.241.140.121 (talk • contribs) 11:49, 27 May 2006

Creation Seventh Day Adventist Church


Persapicious recently deleted the CSDA (Creation Seventh Day Adventist) link from this article and vandalized the main CSDA article, but I want to clear up that the CSDA Church does have several members (there are around 100 overseas in Africa). Eugene (Persapicious) loathes the CSDA group because they preach against the SDA Church (not to mention Eugene's talked to some of the CSDAs and doesn't like them).


 * Is 100 members really notable enough for a mention in the main article. There have to be more notable organisations that have split off. The main article is not the place to put every congregation which have ever split from the church, it outlines the major splits. If you have evidence to show that the split is not just a small scale thing, having a few members overseas doesn't seem to be enough here, then bring the evidence and we can decide whether it fits or not. Ans  e  ll  Review my progress! 00:45, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

There are adventists in Latin America and in Africa and also in the Pacific.



The General Conference Corporation of Seventh-day Adventists has figured out that Walter McGill, a.k.a. Creation Seventh Day Adventist Church, is an obvious fraud. The WIPO Arbitration and Mediation Center has ruled that Walter McGill operates his websites "in bad faith". Pastor Walter McGill tends to exaggerate. He claims to be spearheading a great movement. Where is it? Principal Walter McGill's business address is listed as Creation Seventh Day Adventist Church and Academy and public records indicate that his academy only has three students. 1 2 3. I wonder if there's any false reporting going on there. We're just talking about his own kids, right? The picture of his church prominently displays a big flashy sign but it's doubtful that his church and side business is larger than the average repair area at a typical gas station.

McGill claims to have a sister church in Canada but his website there http://creationseventhdayadventistchurch.ca/ has no pictures of a church or even a Canadian church address and phone number, just a bunch of links to his main website http://csda.us/. Sure, McGill says that he also has church members in Africa and Australia, but they all live in the bush and it's virtually impossible to verify their existence. --E.Shubee 20:36, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

Check out crossseach.com's listing for The Association of Creation 7th Day Adventists. It says, "The unity of this voluntary association of sister churches in the United States demonstrates to mankind that God so loved them that He sent His only Son into the world." Who was motivated to lie like that for Walter McGill? CSDA has no association of sister churches. --E.Shubee 22:03, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

In speaking of his church in December of 2003, Walter McGill, a.k.a., Pastor Chick, on an internet forum for reform-minded Seventh-day Adventists, affirmed that “We have total, at the moment, 4 baptized members in the U.S, among others who profess but have not yet been / been able to be baptized.” 4. --E.Shubee 16:06, 15 October 2006 (UTC)


 * These observations have been updated at http://www.everythingimportant.org/Walter_McGill --E.Shubee 16:45, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

Promoted to GA
Why? It was fascinating to read, the prose is really good. The only thing that it misses in my opinion is inline citations (and I mean a bunch of them) to reach FA status because it is near it. Lincher 03:35, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

Quick question
Is this true? "They believe that Protestants and Catholics will unite to enforce Sunday legislation, and that those who observe Sunday will receive the mark of the beast. They believe that violaters of this law will be given the death penalty." Adambiswanger1 19:36, 6 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I don't know myself. I havn't seen evidence of someone saying that. It is highly possible however that Ellen G. White said something like that but I would not know where to look. We are planning a big drive very soon to reference the article majorly, so after that we can be more justified in removing non-referenced material like that. Ans  e  ll  00:40, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

I'm SDA. There are a couple of old SDA publications that say that. The belief is taught in prophecy classes, with those publications used as references. If only I could remember which ones. There are some things here I could shed some light on. But I forgot the publications they were in :( I myself have come to believe that the mark is not Sunday, but a system where the government dictates to the church or the church to the state.

I was reading this page cause I saw something on the main that seemed biased statement against Ellen White. And I felt that someone should note it was not a NPOV entry. Particularly the opening paragraph to the entry in question. I could reword to make it more neutral. Something like "Adventists believe Ellen G. White is a prophetess. But some non adventist groups decrie her as a false prophet." I think that would be more in line with NPOV but I didn't want to alter your work since it looks like you are putting a good attempt at this. I'd just like to see a more of NPOV in some sections than there is. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Vetobob (talk • contribs) 20:09, 1 July 2006
 * Yes, you will hear it taught in prophecy seminars, in Sabbath school lessons, and from the pulpit. I think though, you will hear Adventist scholars present a more cautious approach which expresses ideas similar to what you believe. -Fermion 01:04, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

I'm just curious. I've checked this page regularly. Two days ago, the artical oped with "is a christian denomonation" now it say "a christian cult" I'd like to know what and why the change was made. It's a very srtong change that one word makes.

Kaje

Adventist hospital articles
People who edit this article may be interested in Accusations against Adventist Hospitals and Criticism of adventist hospitals. --F a ng Aili talk 17:02, 14 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Thanks. It may have been left undiscovered for a while due to its lack of categorisation and lack of wikilinks to the topics it is describing. Ans  e  ll  07:12, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

Criticisms
I have commented out the criticisms section as it was being edited in an unproductive manner, leading to an increasingly POV result. I suggest a summary of Criticism of the Seventh-day Adventist Church be made, making use of the references used there. MyNam e IsNotBob  13:30, 22 July 2006 (UTC)


 * Having an empty section does not help. I uncommented it and will hopefully be able to watch it to see if it develops, will try to get references from the main article as it is relatively well referenced. Ans e ll  07:19, 23 August 2006 (UTC)