Talk:Shenmue (video game)/Archive 1

Musical Score
I was going add a paragraph on Shenmue's musical score, since it is an interegal and critically acclaimed part of the game. The game features dozens of fully orchastraded tracks. Also, as a little bit of trivia in regards to the budget of the game, Yu Suzuki himself (or other high-up developer on the game) has been quoted as saying the cost of hiring out a whole orchestra was very high. I can't find a source for this, but I remember it.

Shenmue in-depth
The recent news of Shenmue Online (www.shenmue-online.com) has sparked within me a more in-depth analysis of Shenmue as part of gaming pehnomena. Wikipedia's NPOV policy may aid in this understanding. I plan to completely overhaul this page with information from various websites, most notably http://www.planetxbox.com/shenmuedojo/.

However, my question to others is this: is it worth it to add this information to Wikipedia? Information on electronic gaming is so ubuquitous online, so what will one more page on a videogame serve?

I think a single page summarising a popular or important videogame (Shenmue obviousy qualifyng there) deserves a place in the history books just as much as that as a book or music album. --DamienG 23:57, 30 Aug 2004 (UTC)


 * The difference between Wikipedia and every other site filled with information on gaming is that our information is copyright free, in perpetuity. Also, as popular as gaming is, it's often very difficult to find good, hard information on games, especially if they're "old" (pre-1995), "foreign" (not American), or unpopular. Preserving the information here is a good choice when half the FAQ sites will charge you for their content, and the other half are written by Seanbaby clones. ~ FriedMilk 00:42, 2004 Aug 31 (UTC)

I think that for many of us gamers who have played Shenmue it is more than just a game. It is definitely deserving of more coverage here, especially with the leak of info about Shenmue III from http://games.kikizo.com/news/200508/141_p1.asp. The story comes from a reliable and respected writer from Kikizo.com. You can also view what many Shenmue fans are saying about this at http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~shenmuedojo/forum/viewtopic.php?t=25945&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0. Ryohazuki1987 00:51, 2005 Aug 25 (UTC)

Personally, the article must be heavily expanded, by example: information about people involved in programming, music, about Project Berkley and other SEGA programmers like Toshihiro Nagoshi. There are some videogame programmers that must appear on Wikipedia and they aren't mentioned. - Anonymous guy

Shenmue Online
Why is Shenmue Online redirected to Shenmue? &gt;x&lt;ino 01:27, 4 December 2005 (UTC)

Change to Plot Summary
I have again edited the summary and this time made far less changes leaving most of the original text intact. However, there were some points that were completely incorrect before and their change was necessary. Other points I elaborated on.

Dreamcast version?
I tried playing this game but my dreamcast kept freezing up. The problem only occured on this game. Does the game not work on some models?


 * Maybe you have a bad copy? --Golbez 05:36, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

Better
I think this article really needs more work! And needs to be really clearier! Because there needs to be more details for the gameplay, because the gameplay is really big. Notes need to be available, explaining about the game set in 1980 ect
 * &gt;x&lt;ino 18:06, 22 April 2006 (UTC)

Timex
Anyone actually have support for the idea that Timex helped make the game? I suspect the "Thank You" credit cited in the article is simply for allowing Sega to use the Timex trademark, not for any material assistance. 05:20, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

Yes, I wrote that. And I am 100% sure Timex helped with the game. It didn't actually say "thank you", but I can remember SEGA dedicating a thanks to TIMEX, because they wrote the name down!
 * &gt;x&lt;ino 18:54, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Xino, how about citing your source in-line with the page? Unless this point is verifiable, it's best to leave it simply as "his watch is a Timex". RandyWang 12:01, 26 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Furthermore, how would a corporation like Timex "help with the game"? Timex produce watches; this is a computer game. Call me ignorant, but I don't see how what experience Timex could lend Sega to help them develop this game... which is precisely why we need to find a source for this statement. RandyWang 12:07, 26 April 2006 (UTC)

RandyWang, you have pissed me off to many f*king time! Believe me, I have had it. Have you played this damn game!? You don't even know a damn thing about a damn article, you go around trolling acting as if you all it all.

Unreal Championship 2: Liandri Conflict, you come in, saying I added my own opionion, corrected the prefix and sufix as well as the grammar. But the problem is, changing the information! The wrost of all, saying the website "Unreal Engine: Unreal Engine 2X for the game" is all fake. When you havn't even played the game yet, all can you know all this.

ApeXtreme, lord knows how you found the article involving me. You came, posting about the damn release date and such, not even know any damn thing about the system!

Now you are here. HAVE YOU PLAYED THIS GAME!?

The problem about you is that, you think you know about a certain thing, or you think you have experinece in it! But you havn't! Contribute on what you know! That is what Wiki is about! That is why anyone can edit an article. So people who know about that certain subject can correct us wiki editor!

'''Xino, how about citing your source in-line with the page? Unless this point is verifiable'''HOW DA HELL CAN I STATE A SOURCE FOR THAT!? The watch was Timex and Timex is a real company. Why in the hell do SEGA just wanna put someone's name in their game for free!? OWNED!

it's best to leave it simply as "his watch is a Timex"Why do we wanna do that!? What is the point of that? That is what those first class editors do, putting down something that doesn't really matter. For an example. Mortal Kombat Deadly Alliance. In the Trivia Section. I stated that the font used for Tempus SAN. Some idiot kept on reverting, and saying where is the proof. HOW DA F*K CAN I GET DA PROOF? You want me to email Midway? That is exaclty what you are doing! Saying Timex didn't help in the game! If you go to there website, do you think they will have a info on Shenmue? And the edit I did was weak, saying the font used was Tempus SAN, but why do visitors wanna know that, it isn't importance. The same goes for that "his watch is a Timex".

'''Furthermore, how would a corporation like Timex "help with the game"? Timex produce watches; this is a computer game'''That is why I said, you dont know nothing! You havnt even played the game! Timex f*king helped with the design of Ryo's watch! Also if you have played the game, you will notice that the watch as a built in light, in case Ryo is in the dark.

Please, this is the last time, you are really really really trying my anger. And making me want to flame you hard. I am trying to put my stress and anger away! Because I know some of you wiki's are jerks and such. But it an't worth it to flame them. The people I should be flaming are forums posters and fanboys. Please! Just stay out of my way. Or if you want to say thing regarding me, please know what you are talking about and know about that subject!
 * &gt;x&lt;ino 16:54, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Ok, first of all, SETTLE DOWN. You are arguing a point that is probably the single most insignificant piece of information you could possibly dig up about this game.  The fact that Ryo's watch is a Timex, and whether or not Timex "helped with the game," is of zero practical value.  Readers of the page learn nothing significant about the game from this nugget of information.  Secondly, it's a bit of a stretch to say that Timex helped Sega make Shenmue.  The second reference link lists Timex as a tie-in, which means that Timex paid Sega money to put their logo into the game.  The first reference link doesn't say anything about Timex.  I guess what I am saying is that this is an incredibly stupid detail to argue about.  It is certainly NOT worth getting all angry over--there are much more relevant things in the world to apply your anger to.  --waka 18:03, 4 May 2006 (UTC)

No! It is best to mind your own business, this is between me and him! I am the guy starting to prove a point here and make something out! So...what is Timex did pay SEGA. The point is I was still right! Second I got the stupid source! And third I was right all along!

The first reference was for Shemue 2 game, and the second was for Shenmue 1. In the ending of Shenmue 1, the crediting, says a special thanks or something to Timex. That is why I added that info, and I know that Timex company was real! So you trying to tell me, because in the second link, Timex wasn't at the credit, which means Timex didn't sponor SEGA. If they didn't how come Timex was in this game!?:/

It is certainly NOT worth getting all angry overThis is between me and him, you won't understand.

And for that other idiot reverted that edit. Don't act like a smart @ss! I know what you are trying to do. All you damn wiki's think you are so smart, you try to outlaw someone with your stupid cheap excuss. How da hell is that unecyclopedia? Like I said, don't act like a smart @ss! The gamer will notice something different about the game. About that, the game as Timex as Ryo's watch. Ofcousre it as to be said. By the way, I still got more Trivia & Notes to put in!

This article even lacks information. If I was contributing to this article, I would have filled it up! No details about the QTE, Arcade, Town, Games ect...:/
 * &gt;x&lt;ino 21:08, 4 May 2006 (UTC)


 * I am going to simply suggest you read up on the guidelines contained at WP:AGF and WP:NPA. Calm down, please. --Golbez 22:22, 4 May 2006 (UTC)

And at least we got that false "Timex helped with the game" line out of there, eh? --Golbez 22:24, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
 * No kidding. The text seems accurate and now, and it's sourced so I am happy.  Xino, chill out already.  --waka 01:17, 5 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Based on Xino's conduct here, and in previous disputes, I've placed a request for comment on this argument. I'd appreciate it if User:Golbez and User:Waka would provide a statement for it, or better yet, endorse it so the request can proceed. RandyWang 12:34, 5 May 2006 (UTC)

Expansion of Shenmue on Wikipedia
As you may have noticed, I have been working on this article over the past week. I have added a great deal of information on various aspects of Shenmue that were not previously here. In doing so, I have also removed much of bad content that was previously included in the article (statements without strong basis in fact, for example) and have generally streamlined the article to make it more useful. One aspect I would very much like to expand in this article is that of the game's geography and culture. I have made a start to this, and I hope others will add to it.

If you have any comments do not hesitate to write them here - I greatly appreciate all feedback. I must also thank Waka who has been cleaning up grammatical errors and general sentance structure. Translucid2k4 10:10, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Your work has really improved this article, thanks! --waka 17:45, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I was going to correct the categories (Sega instead of SEGA) and fix the SegaAM2 link, but translucid was fast enough to notice those little mistakes :)
 * Although agreeing with it being one of the greatest games of all times, ... GOSH he also removed the sentence that said it IS the greatest game of all time... Fast indeed  Rhe br 22:36, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
 * BTW, Metacritic's page for Shenmue (Metascore: 89)
 * And for some bizarre reason, the interwiki to the portuguese article keeps getting deleted... Rhe br 22:43, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

Copies Sold
Does anyone know the amount of copies sold, and the amount of money it took to make the game? I think that would be a good addon to the article. --Elven6 15:29, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

According to the Wikipedia page Shenmue, "As of 2005, Shenmue has sold a total of 1.18 Million units worldwide." "The exact costs of Shenmue are the subject of much speculation. However, it is generally considered that the figure appearing in the Guinness World Records - USD$20,000,000 - is the most accurate." Dwayne Kirkwood 21:02, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Ah yea I remember the Guinness thing, is their any reason for the low sales? --Elven6 17:04, 30 July 2006 (UTC)


 * Because it was different. --Golbez 17:28, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

But the differents things are good things [and not like experimental ("different") things that we see on musics, movies..], and about people saying that this game doenst have too much action (its because its a ADVENTURE GAME, not action game like gta or others games), there are computers adventure games that doenst have any single part of fighting or another action part. People that say this are because they don't like adventure games and are expecting too much action on a adventure game. 201.58.99.210 14:28, 7 August 2006 (UTC)


 * What are you talking about? I loved it. Adventure games, however, rarely sell all that well. --Golbez 18:32, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

i am not talking about you, i am talking about the players that think that shenmue is bad because it was different. Like saying that GTA 3 was bad becase was diferent (has many things do to).

Shenmue is not a breaktrough hit for Sega?
Then,what is this? (note that in te U.S.A. ,Shenmue 2 was not released for Sega Dreamcast...)

Sega Dreamcast games that have sold more than one million copies worldwide as of 2005.

Sonic Adventure (4.47 million) Crazy Taxi 2 (2.34 million) Blue Stinger (2.27 million) Sonic Adventure 2 (2.18 million) Ferrari F355 Challenge (2.25 million) Resident Evil 3 (2 million) Power Stone 2 (1.98 million) Marvel vs. Capcom (1.93 million) Crazy Taxi (1.81 million) Ready 2 Rumble Boxing (1.67 million) House of the Dead 2 (1.54 million) ] NFL 2K (1.20 million) Shenmue (1.18 million)) NBA 2K1 (1.16 million)  Resident Evil: Code Veronica (1.14 million)  Power Stone (1.10 million)  NFL 2K1 (1.09 million)  Quake III Arena (1 million)) Soul Calibur (1 million)

It was one of the best seld games on Dreamcast,and one of the best games in the console,so don´t mess the article,please! --Tiago Heitor 14:07, 18 August 2006 (UTC)


 * Despite the sales, it didn't turn a profit because it cost too much to make. It did very well in terms of units, but I don't think Sega made significant revenue from it. --waka 05:31, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

Cola Drink?
I apologise for my anonymous edit earlier. I was just playing the game early this morning, and when I came down to look at the wiki article, I noticed that it states that one can see how many cans of "Cola drink" Ryo has purchased during the course of the game. I don't think this what with coffee and other soda drinks being available in the vending machines too. I thought the change was pretty insignificant, so I didn't bother signing in. I haven't actually got a passport disc with my copy of Shenmue, so I'd appreciate it if someone could check if it tells you how much cola you've bought, or if it tells you how much of all the cans of drink you can buy in the vending machines you've bought.

Thanks. --User:Ribshank07:01, 27 August 2006 (GMT)


 * Don't worry about it. I honestly never noticed the "cola drink" wordage.. all I saw was that the word "cola" had been changed to "soda", which, as far as I knew, was a term not often used outside the US. I realise that there are other drinks available from the machines, such as fruit-flavoured drinks, coffee, lemonade e.t.c, but at the time I didn't think about it. I apologise for acting so harshly (I didn't have anything against you, and didn't consider it as vandalism or anything like that), it's just it's 8am over here now and I haven't slept yet, so my thoughts aren't particularly poignant ;). I've now changed the section slightly so that it links to the soft drink article. If you feel there is an issue with this, feel free to reply on here :) --Dreaded Walrus 06:58, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

Shenmue: The Movie
Does Shenmue: The Movie really need its own article? It's now only few sentences long and I don't think it could be expanded in any substancial way. I propose that it should be merged with this main article. --Mika1h 23:05, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
 * It could be expanded in a way that any movie could be. It received release in Japanese movie theatres and as such should be treated as a movie with its own page. I, at present, reject any calls for merging. If it is proven that the article cannot be expanded meaningfully then I will change my mind, but until then, no. Nach0king 23:45, 16 September 2006 (UTC)

Errors?
I noticed two possible errors in the Shenmue article.


 * 1) is regarding the use of actual weather data from Yokosuka. I remember reading that the data was used in the game, but I don't remember there ever being an option to switch between the actual data and a random weather pattern as the article suggests.
 * 2) I had the Japanese version of the game and I'm pretty sure that it came with the Passport disc. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 152.1.168.63 (talk • contribs)


 * Hi there! Firstly, may I recommend that in future, you try to remember to sign all things you do on a talk page, by adding four tildes to the end of your post (like this: ~ ). This will make Wikipedia automatically sign your post with your identity, as well as the time and date you posted, thus making it easier for people to follow the conversations.
 * Now, on to the actual questions you pose. Unfortunately, I can't say anything with regards to your second point, but as for the second point, here is what happens in the game:
 * By default, and when you first play through the game, it automatically uses false weather data. Weather data that is not real. Upon completion of the game, on the options menu, the ability to select the actual historic weather data is available, so that your second playthrough (and any thereafter) may use the real data.
 * I hope that helps at least a little bit, and welcome to Wikipedia! :)--Dreaded Walrus 19:55, 12 October 2006 (UTC)

Phantom river stone
I just happened across this article, seems it could be much better included in the main Shenmue article, or just plain deleted. Rawling 22:50, 23 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes, I agree entirely. Merge it, or just don't include it at all. I have completed Shenmue many many times over the years, and I can't say "phantom river stone" sticks in my head much. Google brings up 168 results, 4 of which are from Wikipedia, many more are certainly from mirrors (pun not intended, and only noticed before saving). It's not exactly Lan Di or anything. --Dreaded Walrus 00:32, 24 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Support. Merge this into the main article. Nach0king 10:47, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Shenmue connected to Virtua Fighter?
In the main article, there are references to the cancelled Saturn version of Shenmue originally being connected with the Virtua Fighter series, and that Ryo was initially intended to be the character Akira, from that game.

Though Ryo does bear a passing resemblence to Akira, they are both fairly generic character designs. More importantly, I don't recall any statements about a connection between the two games ever being made, and there are no citations to back this one.

Personally, I'm convinced it's just a load of fanboy rambling, but can anyone else clarify otherwise, and possibly back it up with a citation? If not, it would be wise to edit it out.

Words of Ivory 19:40, 6 January 2007 (UTC)


 * http://dreamcast.ign.com/articles/065/065927p1.html "Yu Suzuki explains the genesis of Shien Mu, AKA Project Berkley, AKA Virtua Fighter RPG". --Mika1h 20:04, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Here is some more interesting links:
 * http://shenmue.planets.gamespy.com/shenmue_saturn.shtml
 * http://shenmue.planets.gamespy.com/timeline.shtml --Mika1h 20:15, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Stuff for a keen person to do

 * 1) Reference the article similar to how Final Fantasy X-2 has been referenced.
 * 2) Make the storyline more full, and make another article which covers the storyline in more detail, whilst remaining encyclopedic.
 * 3) More flowing grammar, etc

Biased
This article is in dire need of clean up. Sections detailing plot and gameplay elements are lacking analytical distance and are quite grating to read. I don't care how friggin much you enjoy this game, talking about how 'many players WILL' enjoy it is annoying and unecessary. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by OptionallySavage (talk • contribs).

New fansite
I have re-opened my shenmue fansite shenmue-uk, ive added my link on this page, check it out. thanks

Most expensive game?
The beginning of the article cites Too Human as being the most expensive game of all time now. The source references a feature on Shenmue that specifies it's development costs at $70 million, but it does not mention Too Human. I can't find Too Human numbers anywhere, so this either needs to be updated with another source that clarifies Too Human's expenses or that phrase should probably be removed, given no source for the information. Leshrac55 20:05, 19 July 2007 (UTC)#
 * I agree -- the game seems to have been in-production for a long while, and hasn't even been released from what I've seen. You can't really say "it's second to Too Human, but that hasn't been released yet" as Shenmue has already been released. Just remove it. ♥♥ ΜÏΠЄSΓRΘΠ€ ♥♥ slurp me! 21:13, 19 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Done. I saw it was added here, but there was no reference for it. --Dreaded Walrus t c 21:18, 19 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Cool, thanks. It's not that I don't believe that Too Human couldn't be more expensive (being in and out of development for 10 years), but I haven't found anything giving a number yet either.  One other thing I just noticed in an earlier discussion is that the development costs for Shenmue are closer to $20M.  The video cited definitely puts Yu Suzuki on record at $70M, but which number is actually accurate?  At $20M, it probably wouldn't be the most expensive game ever made any more... I'm guessing one of the Final Fantasy's that came out after it would have exceeded that by now. Leshrac55 22:40, 19 July 2007 (UTC)


 * I genuinely have no idea. The article itself contradicts itself on that, giving $70,000,000 at the top, with an interview with Suzuki used, and $20,000,000 in the section I just linked, with the Guinness Book of World Records used. But the page given comes up empty, or at least it did when I just tried it now. --Dreaded Walrus t c 23:12, 19 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Hmmm... GameSpot says $70m here, in a review from back when it was first released. Meanwhile, this (which has been used as a source in the past in this article) says $20m. It's quite confusing. --Dreaded Walrus t c 23:17, 19 July 2007 (UTC)
 * I really doubt that Too Human has a budget of $100m for an independant games developer, i really doubt that. Rockstar North is a large independant designer, and none of their profits have gone anywhere near that figure. Either their 6 hits were so ultra-popular that their part-share was excessively large or it's a gross overestimation. ♥♥ ΜÏΠЄSΓRΘΠ€ ♥♥ slurp me! 23:29, 19 July 2007 (UTC)


 * If it was 20$million it definately would be far from the most expensive game ever to produce. Final Fantasy XII for example cost 35$ million to produce, Lost Planet cost the same. Grand Theft Auto IV has a little over 150 game developers working on it plus voice actors, etc. In regards to the title Too Human, it is being funded by Microsoft per contract, so the 80 or 100million dollar production cost could feasibly be true. 72.49.194.69 07:21, 20 July 2007 (UTC) Joshua

Estimated costs
At the moment, i've found a few sites that reference $20,000,000 but they have again taken their information from the Guinness Book of Records, so if there was any ambiguity it has been mirrored. Stars and Stripes, MobyGames say 20m (quoting Guinness), whereas 8BitJoystick says it is listed in the Guinness Book of Records as being 40-60m. Strangely enough, the records themselves seem to have no validation of it, and the site doesn't even list anything these days. Such a quandary.. ♥♥ ΜÏΠЄSΓRΘΠ€ ♥♥ slurp me! 23:41, 19 July 2007 (UTC)


 * So we have those ones, essentially all quoting Guinness, and then, there are the other ones, for $70m, from an old Gamespot review (which obviously couldn't have used Wikipedia as a source, which is helpful here), and the aforementioned Suzuki interview, from around the same time, both of which state $70m. RLLMUK, back in 2004, are pretty much set on $70m. Comparing Google Results is pretty inconclusive, because the first few ones, at least, on the former list of results are comparing it with the $70m value.
 * So, to summarise, I have absolutely no idea, and am going to go to sleep before my head dies. :) --Dreaded Walrus t c 23:53, 19 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Here is a copy and paste of a thread I created for the article 'Too Human', as it also pertains to Shenmue. "Greetings, Editors. I wanted to point out that it is currently claimed the video game project 'Too Human' has between an 80-100 million$ budget, exceeding Shenmue, and is also claimed to be the biggest budget for any game ever. There are a few things I wish to point out, however. First, this information has been added and removed from the main article in the past, and has again been added. Secondly, the source of the information, I do not believe to be a reliable or viable one. We must also consider that Silicon Knights is a small, independent developer. We must also consider that, as difficult as information on budgets for movies is hard to come by, it is even harder to come by for video games. Most video game developers/publishers never anounce the a title's budgets. A good way to assume a high budget is based upon how many developers are working or worked on any given title. The budget given for Shenmue is contradictory, ranging anywhere from 20$ million according to the world record and as stated by one of the developers, to reports of 70$ million budget. If Shenmue were, as the world record states, produced off a budget of 20$, over the years it would've been passed up several times over by such titles as Lost Planet (20$ million), Final Fantasy XII (35$ million), Resident Evil 4, etc. Grand Theft Auto IV currently has slightly over 150 developers (not even including voice actors, etc.) working on that title alone, so it would be safe to assume a VERY high budget for that title, especially given that the previous titles (GTA III, Vice City, San Andreas) all hold positions in the Top 20 best selling console games of all time, and all selling 12 million copies or more. So Take-Two would be willing to spend an unlimited amount on such a profitable franchise. The upcoming PS3 title, Killzone 2, also has over 135 developers working on it, so it is safe to assume an extremely high budget for that title. It is also safe to assume high budgets, exceeding 35$ million for titles like Final Fantasy XIII and Resident Evil 5." 72.49.194.69 12:50, 25 July 2007 (UTC) Joshua
 * "So Take-Two would be willing to spend an unlimited amount on such a profitable franchise" - perhaps so, but they can't spend more than they are able to loan or actually have accrued. Again, from their works -- i've not seen something so unanimously HUGE that it's been able to take in over $80,000,000.. as that is usually more than most films make throughout their lifetimes. Judging from their annual profits and revenues it's extremely unlikely. ♥♥ ΜÏΠЄSΓRΘΠ€ ♥♥ slurp me! 13:08, 25 July 2007 (UTC)


 * I beg to differ. A great number of movies have budgets far exceeding $80,000,000 and an even greater number pull in far higher revenues. Spider-man 3 for example, which had a budget of over $200,000,000 has already raked in well over $900,000,000 in profits. The most expensive movie of all time, the 3rd Pirates of the Caribbean movie, had a budget exceeding $300,000,000. If we have a video game with an RRP of $49.99 and it sells 12 million copies, the profit from that alone far exceeds $80,000,000. Grand Theft Auto is unquestionably Take-Two's largest and most profitable franchise, excepting Pokemon and Mario it is the most profitable franchise in the console gaming industry. The most comparable thing in the PC industry would be the Sims franchise, of which the original sold well over 16 million copies, and the sequel far beyond 5 million copies. 72.49.194.69 14:43, 25 July 2007 (UTC) Joshua
 * I should also mention that even the Transformers movie had a budget over $147,000,000. Batman Begins had a budget over $150,000,000. It's sequel, the Dark Knight, also has a budget of over $150,000,000. The X-men 3 movie had a budget of $240,000,000. So on and so forth. So it's funny that a ton of movies have budgets far, far, exceeding $80,000,000 whilist you claim most films don't even make that in their lifetime. You have your facts all wrong. 72.49.194.69 16:43, 25 July 2007 (UTC) Joshua
 * Well, i have to admit that I'm wrong on the front of movies, I'm not an avid moviegoer but rather a mathematician and chemist, so i don't really watch films or follow their budgets and indeed have my facts incorrect on that front. I did some reading on both video game sales and movie sales and they are quite far and above those sums (quite to my chagrin), so you are indeed quite right. However, if i may move back onto what i was talking of before -- production costs.. there's no reputable sources that can pin down a reasonable range for Shenmue, other than Yu Suzuki somewhat nonchalantly talking about the production costs there's not much else around to say so.
 * From an analytical standpoint, i'd probably agree with a larger sum than 20m, but due to mounting losses for SEGA it's unlikely that at the time (2000), they would be spending excessive amounts of money on a game that seems to have been relatively under-marketed in the US and Europe. Although Mr Suzuki may have unusually been given the money beforehand I can't envision SEGA spending that amount of money at such a harsh time, but then i am reminded that sometimes gambles pay off for some companies.. which brings me to the beginning of my quandary -- perhaps it is true due to the increasing threat from the PlayStation 2? I couldn't say. ♥♥ ΜÏΠЄSΓRΘΠ€ ♥♥ slurp me! 20:33, 25 July 2007 (UTC)


 * I would also like to mention that I was WRONG on a couple things myself. I wrote the above in question of the game 'Too Human' because I found the budget for that game (100$ million) to be too high and questioned the source. However, the source of the statements regarding the project's budget stem directly from the Silicon Knight's president. So as it stands, the article on Too Human is correct, and indeed that title would exceed Shenmue as far as game budget. 100$ million isn't all that out there anyway, production costs for some MMO's have already cost 70$ million at this time, that doesn't include upkeep or maintenence costs either. So then, Minestrone, It appears I was wrong aswell. However, I still don't understand why the conflicting data for Shenmue, 70$ million is a far cry from 20$ million. 72.49.194.69 22:13, 25 July 2007 (UTC) Joshua
 * I think it's likely the "that can't be right" reflex from editors of particular media, perhaps? No idea. Still, to me, the game "Too Human" just looks far too niche and rough around the edges to be anything near that kind of money, but i guess for now a statement from the president of the company is the best we have at the moment. I just tend not to believe even those, though as there have been gross over/underestimations in that sense; e.g the finish date/cost of Wembley Football Stadium. Also, from personal experience in the commercial sector, sometimes the high-ups can be given wrong or inaccurate data from below; particularly if they go to the wrong people! ♥♥ ΜÏΠЄSΓRΘΠ€ ♥♥ slurp me! 22:39, 25 July 2007 (UTC)


 * I agree. 72.49.194.69 00:19, 26 July 2007 (UTC) Joshua


 * I was also wrong about the source of the budget, it wasn't SK's president. It was just a video game news editor, a Gamespy editor to be more specific. 72.49.194.69 01:41, 26 July 2007 (UTC) Joshua

External links modified
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Should the Shenmue Passport be mentioned in this article?
I'm not seeing any mention of the Shenmue passport. Is it not worth mentioning it as such a unique feature of the time of release?


 * First, find a reliable source that discusses it. We can go from there. Popcornduff (talk) 13:57, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

HD remaster
GamesRadar have reported that Sega Europe has registered domains ShenmueHD.com and ShenmueRemastered.com. Admittedly, it is still speculation, but I think it is certainly worth keeping an ear to the ground in case anything more official comes out. — Sasuke Sarutobi (talk) 18:27, 6 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Yeah, like I said if something is announced, it's definitely worth including. But unlike sites like GamesRadar, Wikipedia's job isn't to report every scrap of news and rumour that emerges. See WP:NOTRUMOUR: "Speculation and rumor, even from reliable sources, are not appropriate encyclopedic content." Popcornduff (talk) 18:33, 6 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Yeah, sorry, I'd forgotten about that. Cheers for catching it. — Sasuke Sarutobi (talk) 18:40, 6 January 2017 (UTC)

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Release dates
FourthLineGoon says the release dates he/she removed weren't accurate. That might be the case. But we need to have the release dates in the article, with reliable citations. Can anyone find any reliable sources stating the various international release dates for Shenmue? Popcornduff (talk) 06:37, 18 August 2015 (UTC)
 * Sorry for the late reply, I didn't see this until now. Famitsu says it was released on December 29, 1999, in Japan. For Europe, I don't know - guessing there might be some in relevant magazines from the time.--IDVtalk 09:02, 28 November 2015 (UTC)

Orphaned references in Shenmue
I check pages listed in Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for orphaned references in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of Shenmue's orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for this article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.

Reference named "Ages": From Sega Saturn:  From Dreamcast:  

I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. AnomieBOT ⚡ 01:08, 4 July 2015 (UTC)

Greatest games of all time
"Shenmue is considered one of the greatest video games of all time." is WP:PEACOCK and really needs to be put into a clearer context. I've edited it to "has been included in several "greatest games of all time" lists" to match what's said in the article body, but this could also be a quote from whichever of the top-X-games lists seems strongest, on balance. --McGeddon (talk) 09:44, 11 April 2014 (UTC)

Series' Developement status
As we can only assure that further developement of the series is currently haulted and not "Ended" it would be appreciated, for the sake of simplicity to simply state that "Further production on the series is currently haulted". And the use and inclusion of Killer App is, more or less useless, so don't add it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Florez411 (talk • contribs) 12:43, 23 July 2010 (UTC)


 * I find the spelling errors you keep introducing to the text under the false pretense of a grammar correction to be quite a lot more useless.--Atlan (talk) 13:20, 23 July 2010 (UTC)

I agree with the notion that using "killer app" is useless in this context. It is not that the term doesn't make sense, I just do not see a single person who had anything to do with making the game ever using or thinking "killer app". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.52.32.28 (talk) 01:35, 6 February 2011 (UTC)


 * Quite amazing, another IP coming out of nowhere, with exactly the same opinion as the blocked IP. It must be a coincidence! Anyway, since you now agree that the term makes sense, you really have no valid arguments. Unless you can convince me you're a mind reader, I doubt your point that you've never seen anyone making the game "think" the term killer app, is not grounded in reality. By your own logic, the makers DID say "let's make a must have game", right? Not that it matters, because the sentence is not a quote.--Atlan (talk) 13:05, 6 February 2011 (UTC)


 * To reply to the post above Atlan's Suzuki himself said earlier today that it was intended to be the Dreamcast's killer app ( http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/33329/GDC_2011_Yu_Suzuki_Sega_Will_Probably_Let_Me_Make_Shenmue_3.php ), but it's been said many, many times before by employees and reps of Sega anyway. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.39.36.171 (talk) 19:45, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

Quite amazing that even after discussing my viewpoint on the whole "killer app" thing, this page gets locked. Not only that, my comments on the subject get deleted. It is actually quite humorous, here you are - preaching the necessity of discussion, yet you block anyone with a viewpoint different of your from making changes and delete their arguments. Shenmue was not created to be the Dreamcast's "killer app". The fact that you have the page locked not says more than enough about you and the way you handle things on this site. - urem2


 * None of your comments have been deleted. Only your repeated vandalism to several pages related to me has (which, incidentally, is also why you keep getting blocked). Arguing falsehoods will get you nowhere.--Atlan (talk) 12:01, 23 February 2011 (UTC)


 * Yes they have. I made an edit to the Shenmue page and stated my reasons for doing so almost 2 weeks ago. What happened to those comments? Also, do not accuse me of vandalizing pages related to you, as I have only made changes to the Shenmue page, your talk page, and mine. If someone else on another IP did something, it is not fair to put that blame on me. Also, I do not understand the "arguing falsehoods" comments. Are you saying that you now have a citation of someone calling it a "Killer App"? If so, please show me and I will happily admit that I was wrong. Urem2 —Preceding undated comment added 21:29, 23 February 2011 (UTC).


 * What kind of idiot do you take people here for? It's painfully obvious you are the same person as the IP users and User:Uwright2. You even claim this yourself by saying you made comments here 2 weeks ago, even though the account you are editing under was only created less than a day ago. You are arguing falsehoods, in that you make several claims that are untrue and try to use those claims to your advantage. This will of course not work since the lies are so incredibly transparent. I'm done responding to your nonsense, so unless you have something pertinent to say, don't expect any more answers.--Atlan (talk) 22:58, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

After reading the article I find no mention from Suzuki referring to the game as a "killer app". If no one that worked on the game has ever referred t the game as a "killer app", then why is it in the article? This is my reasoning behind removing the term "killer application" from this article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.22.168.213 (talk) 14:24, 13 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Yes, this is the same argument you had last year. Of course, you randomly switch between this argument, saying that "killer app" makes it sound like an iOS game, and saying that the term "killer app" wasn't invented in 1999. Whichever suits your edit warring needs. They have been debunked last year and so far you had absolutely no new arguments to back up removal of the content. You just rehash the same crap over and over like a broken record, while you continue reverting. Your reasoning is just as flawed as it was over a year ago. Get over it.--Atlan (talk) 14:50, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

It was never debunked! I read the article and not one time does Suzuki mention the term "killer application". I am not the only person who believes the term isn't relevant, and I am not the user "Urem" you accuse me of being, but I do agree with his opinion on this. So once again, please show me anything from anyone who worked on Shenmue where they call the game a "killer app". Isn't that how this is supposed to work? Aren't good editors supposed to provide citations? I am not trying to be argumentative, I just think that without a citation the term "killer application" doesn't make sense. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.22.168.213 (talk) 21:38, 13 June 2012 (UTC)
 * No, that is not how it works. You have made up the rule that for this game to be called killer application in this article, someone from Sega had to have said it at some point. All it needs is a reliable source calling the game a killer application. At least you make a good point about citation. I will add a reference when I get home.
 * Furthermore, I never said you were user "Urem", I said you were User:Uwright2. Interesting that you would come up with a different name. Of course, it's easy to get your accounts mixed up when you use more than one. You either admit you are the same as User talk:Uwright2, User talk:Urem2, and at one time editing Shenmue under User talk:65.255.147.183, User talk:99.118.204.47, User talk:65.255.147.40, User talk:99.188.111.173, and User talk:24.52.32.28. Or you can try to convince me that you are not those users and IP's and that it is just an incredible coincidence that all these "different" people who all make identical edits to Shenmue and this talk page, all in the same time period, just happen to all be from Missouri. Please, make my day and convince me.--Atlan (talk) 10:13, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

So you are saying that all IP addresses from Missouri are secretly being used by me? That's very funny. Seriously, a friend of mine brought this page to my attention, and with us all being such big fans of Shenmue, decided that calling it a killer application was just...it just doesn't make any sense at all. Once again, provide that source where someone who worked on the game calls it a killer application and I will happily accept it. What is funny is that someone put a link to an interview, lying to people on this very talk page and you choose to ignore that fact. How is it right for that person to say "Suzuki says it's a killer app in this interview.", and then post a link to an interview where Suzuki NEVER SAYS KILLER APPLICATION? Please, either find a source or admit that without a citation you are wrong to include the term "killer application". — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.22.168.213 (talk) 07:59, 16 June 2012 (UTC)

The citations put in place for the term "killer application" aren't citations at all. They are just articles written about the game by people who didn't work on the game. Someone who worked on the game either in development or advertising needs to be quoted as saying the game was developed to be a "killer app". Please, to whomever made the citations, make sure you know that when something is inside a quotation mark it means that it was said. In the Suzuki article it is the person writing the article who says "killer application", not Suzuki. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.22.168.213 (talk) 12:05, 21 June 2012 (UTC)
 * That it is required to find a direct quote online from someone who has worked on the game, such as Yu Suzuki, is a "rule" you have created. Wikipedia doesn't operate by your rules, it follows policies such as WP:V, which these sources qualify for. Not that you give a damn about Wikipedia's policies, you simply want the statement gone for whatever reason and constantly switch from "this makes it sound like an iOS app" to "the term killer app wasn't invented back then" and now to "it must be a direct quote from a Sega employee". Either false or irrelevant points. --Atlan (talk) 12:22, 21 June 2012 (UTC)

The only one of those quotes from me is the last one. If someone who worked on the game has never said that it was being developed as a "killer application", why are you so insistent on putting the term in the article? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.22.168.213 (talk) 04:00, 22 June 2012 (UTC)
 * I'll quote this edit summary made by you with your current IP address: "Killer Application makes it sound like an IOS game.". There you go. Once again your BS attempts to pretend you are different people fails miserably because you can't remember what you said with which IP or account.--Atlan (talk) 06:23, 22 June 2012 (UTC)

You still didn't my question as to why the term killer app applies to this page when nobody from the game has ever said that. It boggles my mind that you put up fake citations. As far as who said what, I have been forward about being personal friends with people who have tried to get this page changed before. Just because one of them used my wifi doesn't mean I said it. But once again, this has nothing to do with the fact that nobody who worked on Shenmue has ever said anything about it being developed as a "killer app". I fail to see how putting 2 fake citations helps your cause either. Why don't you cite a page where someone who worked on the game calls it a "killer app"? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.22.168.213 (talk) 07:32, 22 June 2012 (UTC)

Removed the mention of "killer application" due to the citations being misleading. There is actually no quote from Suzuki in the article where he calls the game a killer application. Trumancox (talk) 07:42, 22 June 2012 (UTC)
 * I'm reinstalling it. Your socking has to come to an end here. The sources are clear, as is the fact that you are seriously disruptive. Drmies (talk) 09:49, 22 June 2012 (UTC)
 * For future reference, for you and your "friends", the sources say "killer app". That it is not said by the people who you think should have said it is entirely irrelevant. You don't seem to know or care how Wikipedia works, but it doesn't work the way you want it to. The article is protected, and future edits of the kind you made will simply be reverted and those editors will probably be blocked on sight. Thank you, Drmies (talk) 13:09, 22 June 2012 (UTC)

For future reference, Suzuki doesn't say killer app. You might get to keep changing the page back, but you know that he doesn't say it in that interview... why you continue to lie while still providing the link is hilarious. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.255.147.183 (talk) 09:14, 12 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Indeed he didn't, I never said he did. The only liar is you, in addition to being a vandal and troll.--Atlan (talk) 09:17, 12 July 2012 (UTC)

Pop Culture
seems like we should have something about affects on pop culture —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ngates87 (talk • contribs) 20:07, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Nozomi artwork.jpg
Image:Nozomi artwork.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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BetacommandBot (talk) 16:28, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

Pronunciation
What's up with that superfluous E? Shouldn't it be Shenmu? Since when does any romanization system have silent letters in it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.122.63.142 (talk) 18:12, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Probably did it for looks; "Shenmu" looks a little weird to western eyes, I'm sure if they tried it their focus group would have said it reminded them of Shamu. Romanization is not always ironclad. --Golbez (talk) 16:22, 8 February 2010 (UTC)


 * It's not uncommon to have some letter of the alphabet represent the "ー" in シェンムー. That symbol means the previous syllable (mu in this case) has a lengthened vowel pronunciation. It's understandable they opted for Shenmue instead of Shenmuu, which would be a more common romanization, simple for how the word looks.--Atlan (talk) 18:23, 8 February 2010 (UTC)