Talk:Single-8

Point
Is there really any point in this article. It seems everything that needs to be said is in 8 mm film. -- Egil 14:02, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Kodak Red Herring
"It was widely believed by Single 8 enthusiasts that this would offer superior film positioning, but the reality was that Super 8's plastic pressure plate could be moulded with far smaller tolerance than Single 8's metal version could be machined."

This appears to be a Red Herring from the Kodak PR department. The Single 8 system does offer better film positioning, but the flatness of the pressure plate is not the only issue.

The pressure plate in a movie camera does not actually press the film against the film gate but rather it is stopped by rails (or other stops) to form a channel with a depth slightly greater than the film thickness. So, what matters is the precision of this channel, not the flatness of the pressure plate. Actually, the film is stiff enough that the flatness of the plate makes little difference.

It should also be pointed out that the so-called pressure plate in a Super-8 cartridge is not even a flat plate.

There are other factors which include the mass of the plate, the length of the film gate, the friction between the plate and the film. design of the film claw, etc..

However, the main issue is that it is not possible to fit a film gate in the camera and a plate in the interchangeable Super-8 cartridge with as much precision as with Single-8 where they are both part of the camera.

I note that I was an assistant manager of a camera store while Single-8 was sold.

Tyrerj (talk) 06:34, 1 January 2012 (UTC)


 * This was not a red herring from the Kodak department but was in fact well known in the 8mm film fraternity. There was even an article on the subject in a popular (movie) camera magazine in the UK at the time.  They checked the the precision with which the pressure plates and film gates were manufactured, and discovered that the plastic parts between different cartridges were seldom more than 0.0002 inches (yes I got that right with 3 zeros) different.  The best machined metal parts could manage was 0.001 inch (and then only on top end cameras).  They also made the discovery that the plastic pressure plate was usually moulded specifically for the film actually in the cartridge.  In particular, on Kodak cartridges, the plate in the sound cartridge had 2 channels moulded into it to accommodate the 2 sound stripes on the enclosed film.  These were missing from the silent film pressure plates.  It was also found that other manufacturers whose film was of slightly different thickness also allowed for the change in the pressure plate mouldings.


 * I take your point about the use of the term 'pressure plate' as this is not the ideal way to position a film in a gate. It shouldn't really a pressure plate, but that is the term used to describe it and often that's what it does.  Some 8mm projectors used a pressure plate actually pressing against the film in the gate (notably Eumig in all their projectors).  These invariably resulted in londitudinal scratches on the film (for which Eumig were very famous).  Well designed projectors could actually avoid any contact with the film as it ran through the gate.  I ended up with a Bosch made projector (sold under the Agfa brand - and I still have it) with such a gate and the only films that I have in my not inconsiderable archive that are scratched are those that I made while still owning a Eumig projector. 109.145.22.224 (talk) 16:23, 11 April 2012 (UTC)

Konan
I doubt that Konan really means "the" Single8-system. Instead it sounds more like they've invented one of the many carts for "8mm wide film with Reg8-perforation" (as opposed to the cameras for the 16mm-wide Double8-film) as many of these systems have been referred to as "Single 8 m/m" in English, e.g. the ones introduced by B&H or Agfa. Another reason: It was Kodak that invented the "8mm Type S"/"8mm Type Super" used by both Super8 and Single8. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.220.3.26 (talk) 13:46, 4 October 2012 (UTC)