Talk:Sino-Vietnamese vocabulary

Renaming
At the talk page for Sino-Japanese, the following comment has been posted:


 * I agree the title is misleading. Not because of whether or not Sino-Japanese is a language or not, but because that phrase is often used to describe the relationship between Japan and China for various other topics. If you type "Sino-Japan" into google, you get topics like "Sino-Japan ties" and "The Sino-Japanese war". Nothing comes up about language.


 * I think Wikipedia's "Sino-Japanese" entry should merely be a small blurb saying "'Sino-Japanese' is a label for topics on the relations between Japan and China. Please see: Sino-Japanese War, Sino-Japanese Relations, Sino-Japanese Language"

I think that the same arguments apply to "Sino-Vietnamese". Perhaps we should consider renaming this page "Sino-Vietnamese vocabulary" or "Hán Việt". 'Sino-Vietnamese could then become a page redirecting users to Sino-Vietnamese (Hoa), Sino-Vietnamese relations, Sino-Vietnamese Conflict, etc. Bathrobe 06:01, 21 March 2006 (UTC)
 * If you can find a short, precise name, you've got my vote. DHN 05:51, 22 March 2006 (UTC)


 * "Short, precise name" - good point! At Sino-Japanese, the names "Sino-Japanese words (kango)" and "Sino-Japanese vocabulary (kango)" have been suggested. Precise, yes. Short, no! "Sino-Vietnamese vocabulary (han viet)" is probably too long. What do Vietnamese speakers/experts think?
 * Bathrobe 06:53, 22 March 2006 (UTC)


 * We Viet call it "Từ Hán Việt". Từ means term.  Why not call it "Sino-Viet Term"?


 * I think "Sino-Vietnamese vocabulary" would be better. Anyone for a move to that page (along with a link from Từ Hán Việt, maybe?
 * Bathrobe (talk) 02:35, 16 January 2008 (UTC)

My reply at the Sino-Japanese talk page -. Hong Qi Gong (Talk - Contribs) 02:57, 16 January 2008 (UTC)


 * My reply also at the Sino-Japanese talk page.

Bathrobe (talk) 03:39, 16 January 2008 (UTC)

Studying History
How do vietnam students read primary source historic vietnam history documents if they can't read their original Chinese language?86.176.191.137 (talk) 22:08, 22 August 2011 (UTC)
 * The same way that Italian students read primary source historic documents in Latin: by studying it or by reading translations. DHN (talk) 23:00, 22 August 2011 (UTC)

VANDALISM
This appears to be vandalized by anti Vietnam elements. PLEASE　Ｃｏｒｒｅｃｔ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.237.253.75 (talk) 02:48, 23 June 2012 (UTC)

Han-Viet
I have just seen this article creation from a redirect to Sino-Vietnamese at Han-Viet. The other Han Viet redirect is intact. This WP:FORK looks like WP:SYNTHESIS and is not supported in English or Vietnamese printed sources.
 * Kenneth A. S. MacLean The arts of disclosure: peasant-bureaucrats, historiography 2005 "Sino-Vietnamese (Han-Viet) is the general term for loan words — primarily political, religious, and literary in nature — derived from classical Chinese, but pronounced in accordance with ...
 * Lonely Planet Vietnam, Mason Florence, Robert Storey - 2001 p50 "Sino-Vietnamese literature (Han Viet) was written in Chinese characters (chu nho). It dates from 939 AD, when the first independent Vietnamese kingdom was established. Sino-Vietnamese literature became dominated by Confucian and ..."
 * A related WP:FORK and merge are under discussion at Talk:Chu nho. In ictu oculi (talk) 02:35, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

"close to their original spelling or pronunciation"
In the 'Names' section, there is a very vague and imprecise sentence: "[…] Vietnamese names for countries of the world are now close to their original spelling or pronunciation […]"

"Original" spelling is relative, since it does not say what is considered "original": most countries around the world have endonyms and exonyms, but the modern Vietnamese names are usually not the original endonyms. It would be more precise to say most country names are now borrowed from English/French/etc. and adapted to Vietnamese phonology. ImreK (talk) 08:43, 13 November 2016 (UTC)

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Chinese words of Austroasiatic origin
The fact that Schuessler proposes Austroasiatic origins for some Old Chinese words is not particularly relevant to their later borrowing into Vietnamese. These two are separated by a thousand years or more. By the time they were borrowed, they were simply Chinese words. The sources do not make this linkage, and neither should we.

The etymology of OC words is off-topic for this article, but note also that Schuessler's AA etymologies are controversial, as is the theory of a former branch of AA in Shandong, on which they are based. Kanguole 17:18, 9 September 2023 (UTC)