Talk:Skeleton key

Definition
Erm, how about some idea to what an actual skeleton key is? 86.10.86.139 10:02, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
 * Done. I'd like to know how a barely notable rock band has the main entry... &mdash; RevRagnarok  Talk Contrib 16:38, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

The third paragraph appears to misuse the term "skeleton key" in exactly the way noted by the first paragraph. A skeleton key is a device for opening warded locks for which one does not have the key; it is not the term for keys to warded locks in general.Lexande 05:29, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Conradiction
The second and third paragraphs contradict the first, and I have removed a sentence stating such. thegreen J     Are you green?  19:59, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Bump keys
I have removed the following sentence: "Today, this is also known as a bump key." A skeleton key is not a bump key. A skeleton key opens warded locks by avoiding the ward, a bump key opens levered locks by "bumping" the levers. They are superficially similar because they are both produced by grinding the key down to its minimal form; but they are different tools which achieve their goals in different ways. Rhebus 20:28, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Naming conventions
In America, "skeleton key" is usually used to mean bitted key.

I think we should avoid this usage, as it confuses things highly with actual skeleton keys, although I'm loath to say it's wrong as such.

Basically, lever locks and locks with bitted keys are hardly used in America, and tend to be disregarded. Hence the naming conventions used there aren't very accurate or useful.

I think we should stick to using "skeleton key" for actual skeleton keys and move the bitted key stuff to a separate article.

62.24.251.241 (talk) 01:54, 16 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Sorry but Im not sure what you are saying.English Lock (talk) 12:02, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

I have lived in the USA for over 50 years, and used many modern keys as well as old fashioned warded lever keys, and I've never heard an old-style key called a "skeleton" key by anyone born before 1995. This seems to be a new usage, derived from ignorance of actual skeleton keys, much like the way the young people call wrecking bars "crow bars" and all homeless people "hobos". Given the general state of humanity I imagine ignorance will triumph... as Horace said in 80BC, "Our sire's age was worse than our grandsire's. We, their sons, are more worthless than they; so in our turn we shall give the world a progeny yet more corrupt. And, get off my lawn." Nonetheless, I would caution Wikipedia from asserting that "skeleton keys" is a common American usage - it might be common among those Americans posting to the Internet today, though, since that demographic skews young and the American educational system is notoriously weak on both language and history. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 205.153.180.229 (talk) 16:55, 6 May 2014 (UTC)

Well, I'm American and I've only heard/read the term used as generic for a usually illicit passkey. Wschart (talk) 13:21, 30 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Ok, give it a go. I dont know anything about american conventions so Im not much help. Ω ENGLISH LOCK Ω 19:37, 5 May 2010 (UTC)


 * I've dealt with this today (over five years later!) by moving the alleged separate meaning out into its own section. I've also added some 'citation needed' tags, as I've been unable to find any easily-available sources for that meaning. I'd suggest deleting that whole section unless anyone is able to source it soon. --MichaelMaggs (talk) 08:57, 21 June 2015 (UTC)

Alternative type?
Making a conventional skeleton key can be difficult if you don't know the possible ward locations or where the key engages the bolt, but there's another way that works with many warded door locks (as they usually has the wards on the sides of the keyhole while the bolt mechanism is at the top). Start with a regular key, then file the end part of the shaft (the cylindrical part between the blade and the stopper) flat so it's the same thickness as the blade. Insert the key upside-down in the keyhole, push straight upwards (some springy resistance as you lift the bolt retainer) until the shaft is at the top round part and turn.

Since this is all OR I don't know if such a key is called a skeleton key or something else, or if they're used at all. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.149.149.213 (talk) 20:54, 30 October 2015 (UTC)

German: »Buntbartschlüssel«
The link to the German parallel is misleading. Switch to https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buntbartschloss please. (Sorry, I don’t know how to correct it). – Fritz Jörn (talk) 19:40, 16 April 2016 (UTC)

Definition
The part that said that a skeleton key is a term for a bitted key is incorrect. The rest of the article explains precisely what a skeleton key really is. Ω ENGLISH LOCK Ω 17:40, 1 February 2018 (UTC)

Spelling Conventions: U.K. or American
In which context was this article intended: American, or U.K. English? I happen to note that centre has U.K. spelling, while this is the article as it would be read in the US. Some articles are clearly about a U.K. topic, and so stick to U.K. English, while most other articles appear to be written in American English.  So, which spelling should this article be using: American, or U.K.? Christopher, Sheridan, OR (talk) 08:38, 1 February 2019 (UTC)


 * As the subject of the article isn't naturally tied to a specific variety of English, Wikipedia has no a priori preference, and MOS:RETAIN applies. We should keep whatever version is currently in use; in this case it's UK English (see spelling of 'centre', and the use of a UK dictionary as a reference). MichaelMaggs (talk) 11:54, 1 February 2019 (UTC)

Possible source of the American conflation of bit keys and skeleton keys
This is 100% original research plus some speculation, not usable, yada yada. But perhaps someone can find a source that confirms this, or maybe it will be a breadcrumb for a future researcher.

I've been reading through dozens of old hardware and lock/key catalogs from the late 1800s to early/mid 1900s and something jumped out at me in a 1941 Independent Lock Company catalog. I won't upload the page until my copyright questions are answered, but here is a link to the catalog (141MB): https://vintage-absupply-net.s3.amazonaws.com/independent-look-company-1941-catalog-12/pdf/independent-look-company-1941-catalog-12-ocr.pdf

On page 215 in the Bit Key section there are 10 keys, 2 of which are in a box labeled:

"SKELETON KEYS

Will fit most

ordinary door locks

27SK

(2 Skeleton Keys on a Card)"

To this day you can find keys seemingly identical to those 2 keys for sale, together, on a card, at Amazon and countless other stores, labeled as "skeleton keys" and nowhere does the term "bit key" appear. Perhaps the vast majority of Americans who have seen the words "skeleton keys" on a product have seen those 2 keys? And that's the source of why Americans conflate the term with "bit key?" Skintigh (talk) 19:51, 30 June 2021 (UTC)