Talk:Solar flare/Archive 1

Ellipsis in history section
There is an ellipsis, represented by 3 dots ..., between 'Optical observations' and 'Radio observations' in the Observations/History section. 86.53.56.45 (talk) 19:54, 8 October 2017 (UTC)

Jails of Monkeys?!?
I'm by no means an expert on this but is this even a real unit of temperature? It sounds made up and Google doesn't seem to know what it is. Even if it is, wouldn't it be better to always use the SI unit? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.25.44.35 (talk) 22:10, 25 January 2012 (UTC)

electro?
What is electro transmission?

Unhappy
I don't think there should be an image of a CME on the solar flares page, there is already enough confusion between these two phenomenen, when they are distinct events whcih are not directly related with each other. Any thoughs welcome. 13/02/2007 I totally agree. I think Coronal Mass Ejection, Solar Flare and Solar Energetic Particles should be better distinguished.USferdinand 19:08, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

Star Trek
Is the reference to the solar flare page on the Star Trek wiki really a relevant link here?

So how many REMs would a solar flare at, say X10, give you (or better yet a table/graph)? Or how much shielding would it take to protect an astronaut? How long are such events (ie: solar storms?) would an astronaut have to hide out in a protected area for 15 mins or 8 hours? How does electronics hold up? ~ender 2003-11-08 12:36:MST

The article says: Based on the January 20 event, they may have as little as 15 minutes to do so.

what event was that? the link to the day article does not help, since there is no special event mentioned.

=

End of the world?
The End of civilization article lists "Giant solar flare fries the Earth" as one of the potential scenarios for our doom. Is that really possible? TheCoffee 6 July 2005 18:44 (UTC)

Highly unlikely, based on past performance. Generally as stars age flares get less energetic, and there seems in any case to be an energy limit. References available.

This article needs major enlargement. While it starts at the beginning and arrives at the present, it skips all the good stuff in between. What to do? I am a Wikipedia novice.

84.43.122.159

Image Source?
What is the source of the images, and should there be a direct link to the it? According to the annotations on the large image, they are taken from SoHo's instraments. Are we sure that NASA and not the ESA released the images?

Reverting vandalism
Remember to make sure you are indeed going to the last good version; the categories and interwiki links got lost in the shuffle from around 1 March 2006. I'll get around to this unless someone else wants to first. --Christopherlin 00:43, 29 March 2006 (UTC)

Needed
Does anyone have a site that lists major sun events like flares etc ? It would be helpful to include...

From http://sec.noaa.gov/sxi/latest.html on there are lists reachable for all minor and major events in the past years.

I am surprised that there is not more info on the 1 September 1859 solar flare, which apparently was one of the most powerful in recorded history. It is a prominent historical event; I also noticed that there is spare mention of it on the "sun spot" page either. Dru007 02:01, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

List of doomsday scenarios
Could use votes to save this article, thanks MapleTree 22:35, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

Power
Nasa says the power of a solar flare is equivalent to a billion megaton nuclear bombs, not a million as the original article stated.

http://news.com.com/NASA+launches+twin+robots+to+map+the+sun/2100-11397_3-6129678.html?tag=nefd.top

The largest flares apparently involve an energy of about 1026 Joules. Since a Megaton is roughly 4&times;1015 Joules, the largest flares involve about 25 billion Megatons of energy. By the way, this is energy, not power. References available.

This raises another question, more general and important for any substantial expansion/rewrite of this article (which it does need - who has time?), and possibly others. Who is the intended reader? Should he or she be spoken to in Joules or Megatons or coal-fired power stations? Some Wikipedia articles on Maths subjects, for example, are accessible to few people. This one should presumably be accessible to most people, but should it also be useful to people who know something already? Views would be helpful.

BodachMor 15:21, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Gamma Ray Burst?!?!?!?!?!
I recently did a paper on Gamma Rays for my Physics class. Gamma Rays are emited during solar flares. What if a flare oringinating from the Sun emited a Gamma Ray burst? What if a nearby star, such as in the Andromeda Galaxy, was the origin of such a burst? I know about the catastophe that would result from such a cosmic incident, but how likely is something like this? In 2012, Solar Flare activity is supposed to reach a peak. Could a burst happen as a result of this? Please awnser!!! Thanks!!!

Is the first sentence right? What is the energy equivalent of a solar flare? I am not an expert, but it looks awfully high. I thought is was equivalent to millions of hydrogen bombs, not billions of nuclear bombs -- can someone check this?

The phrase Gamma_ray_burst refers to a particular sort of cosmic event, apparently producing most of its energy in the form of gamma-rays and apparently - so the Compton Observatory showed us in the early 1990's - at extragalactic distances and thus unspeakably luminous to be detectable at all. Solar flares emit gamma-rays but this doesn't mean we should call them Gamma-ray bursts and thus confuse them with something much further away and of a completely different physical nature. Flare gamma-rays are absorbed harmlessly by Earth's atmosphere. Don't lose any sleep over them! BodachMor 15:34, 6 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Alright, I think you are thinking of just Gamma Rays. The Sun is always producing gamma rays from the proton-proton chain. Gamma Ray bursts only occur when a massive star collapses on itself and creates a black hole. The energy from that black hole creates a gamma ray burst. IF ONLY THAT HITS US, then we are doomed. The sun can do bad things, but do not want to mention them. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Simmu1992 (talk • contribs) 07:09, 18 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Current models predict a GRB apprx. 600 or more light years away is no longer a lethal event if the Earth was in it's path. I'm sure as time goes on that figure will be reduced yet again, as the science improves.50.111.7.77 (talk) 02:48, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

Moreton wave
After seeing a news article about it, i created the article for Moreton wave, a wave caused by a solar flare, if anybody would like to see it and expand it. Thanks --AW 22:57, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Dictionary.com
the information on wikipedia is far less compared to google of dictionary.com. u think they should put the latest news on solar flares and update it now and then and make it more colorful —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.249.16.74 (talk • contribs) 02:45, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

"Dr. Hans Zarkov, speaking from the International Solar Center in Zurich, Switzerland, predicts an above average solar flare production for 2007. He forecasts seven Categories M, five Zs, and four Bs. He recommends that the world be prepared to go underground for four hours during the worst of these storms....." Something like that, maybe? :)Student7 20:30, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Solar flares can also cause blackouts, right?
Big enough solar flares can also cause power blackouts too. In northern areas like Canada, they have had blackouts because of solar flares.64.136.27.201 23:54, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
 * For future readers, IP is likely thinking of a coronal mass ejection, not a solar flare. The former can cause geomagnetic storms which in some cases result in blackouts (e.g., March 1989 geomagnetic storm). The electromagnetic radiation from solar flares cannot cause blackouts. CoronalMassAffection (talk) 21:04, 19 November 2021 (UTC)

Energy equivalent?
The article says the energy of a solar flare is equivalent of billion megatons. Of what? TNT? And the source is? This site says they are equivalent "only" to a million megatons of TNT. That's 1000 times less. ---Majestic- 09:41, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

The picture at the top of the page
Isn't the picture at the top of the page a Solar Prominence rather than a Solar Flare?


 * Yes, it is, a better picture should be put there instead. I've been meaning to give a clean-up to the article for some time, but I never got around to do it... as soon as I find some time I'll try and do it. Definitely the introduction should be improved a lot. Gringo.ch 13:44, 30 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I replaced the picture with one really showing a solar flare.Gringo.ch 12:04, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

I've removed the image at the start of the Hazards section. It was of a filament (see image source and the same image in Today'', not a flare. If I have that wrong, please restore. &mdash; Aldaron • T/C 02:06, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Terminology question
Does a "Solar Flare" only refer to flares on the Sun itself, or can it refer to a flare on any star? The article seems to imply that it does refer to any star, but in that case the word "solar" is odd. 72.236.6.82 (talk) 14:40, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

1859 Carrington super flare
Should'nt this topic mention the largest flare ever recorded, known as the 1859 Carrington Super Flare, named after scientist Richard Carrington who recorded this event, —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.35.137.68 (talk) 18:03, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

I'm curious as to how this statement "The most powerful flare of the last 500 years was the first flare to be observed" is supportable; if solar flares weren't observed until 150 years ago, how do we know it was the most powerful flare of the past 500 years? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Hilokid (talk • contribs) 04:49, 19 October 2009 (UTC)

height of flares
Can we indicate tne height of solar flares - perhaps "can reach a visible height of ...". Of course there are definitional problems but at the moment the article feels to be written by and for those with some scientific familiarity with the topic.

And then how about the temperature? It's not hard to find references to 20 million degrees, or tens of millions of degrees'. Would one of you folk who have crafted this boffiny article provide some bite-sized data for the rest of us? 219.76.166.227 (talk) 17:55, 21 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Although a little harsh on the writers, you are right. This article needs to be rewritten with a non-technical perspective in mind. It doesn't necessarily be stripped off the technical details but the content must be rearranged so that it facilitates the reader who wants to skip. We have to think what way should the information be presented in order to be less technical but more educative. To quote Feynman criticizing the standard way to teach what makes a windable toy dog move:

The answer was in the teacher's edition of the book: the answer I was trying to learn is that "energy makes it move." Now, energy is a very subtle concept. It is very, very difficult to get right. What I meant is that it is not easy to understand energy well enough to use it right, so that you can deduce something correctly using the energy idea--it is beyond the first grade. It would be equally well to say that "God makes it move," or "spirit makes it move," or "movability makes it move." (In fact, one could equally well say "energy makes it stop.") Look at it this way: that’s only the definition of energy; it should be reversed. We might say when something can move that it has energy in it, but not what makes it move is energy. This is a very subtle difference. It's the same with this inertia proposition. Perhaps I can make the difference a little clearer this way: If you ask a child what makes the toy dog move, you should think about what an ordinary human being would answer. The answer is that you wound up the spring; it tries to unwind and pushes the gear around.


 * There are crucial solar-flare related information that people really want to read about that this article doesn't touch.The article also now doesn't help the reader understand the relation to other solar phenomena like CMEs. I hope I will be able to help on this, I have done some preparation for this article and I'll work on it. Shadow mor ph  ^"^ 11:05, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

Vandalism
Some jokester put references to nachos and cheese in the "Classification" paragraph. Can someone please fix this? Also, until the hoopla for the "2012" movie is over, you may want to put this page until the semi-protected status.

Mtminchi08 (talk) 18:53, 24 November 2009 (UTC)

Mention magnetic reconnection model and increase in spectral line emissions?
Unless I missed it, there doesn't seem to be any mention of the increase in spectral line emissions, particularly H-alpha, that accompany solar flares. Should this be included? 212.84.101.12 (talk) 05:24, 20 March 2010 (UTC)

Arrg, there also doesn't seem to be any mention of the magnetic reconnection model put forward to explain solar flares. I'd try writing about both these apparent omissions, but this really requires someone more knowledgeable. 212.84.101.12 (talk) 05:54, 20 March 2010 (UTC)

SDO image?
I think this image, added to the article yesterday, is a solar prominence eruption as mentioned at http://sdo.gsfc.nasa.gov/firstlight/. Is it also correct to describe it as a flare? --InfantGorilla (talk) 11:11, 28 April 2010 (UTC)

Add SDO satellite
Should SDO be added to the satellite list? Looks like one of its mission targets is to observe solar flares. --88.130.193.98 (talk) 19:46, 3 August 2010 (UTC)

Classification math
The Classification section currently says "Each class has a peak flux ten times greater than the preceding one, with X class flares having a peak flux of order 10−4 W/m2. Within a class there is a linear scale from 1 to 9, so an X2 flare is twice as powerful as an X1 flare, and is four times more powerful than an M8 flare."

Is this correct? If I understand correctly, then an X1 is ten times greater than an M1, and an M5 is five times greater than an M1, so the X1 is twice as powerful as the M5. Thus the X2 should be four times more powerful than the M5, not the M8. Or am I misunderstanding the scales? Peristarkawan (talk) 20:49, 17 February 2011 (UTC)


 * I'm pleased to know that I' not alone wondering about the sentence....I went to the discussion page exactly for this reason. Strangely Wikiblame says the sentence has been there since 09:54, 14 March 2009. although I read "powerful than an M5 flare." and not M8 as you reported.--Dia^ (talk) 11:30, 9 August 2011 (UTC)
 * "an X2 flare is ... four times more powerful than an M5 flare" is a correct sentence. Ruslik_ Zero 08:12, 10 August 2011 (UTC)


 * Sentence had been removed, so have restored as above. - Rod57 (talk) 12:34, 6 July 2012 (UTC)

Merge Proposal
I propose merging Flare spray into Solar Flare. The information on Flare spray is small enough to fit on this article and is talking about a Solar Flare. JC Rules! (talk) 10:55, 17 August 2011 (UTC)

File:Sun - August 1, 2010.jpg to appear as POTD soon
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How many M and X class flares
How many M and X class flares do we see (per annum) at the peak and trough of the solar cycle ? - Rod57 (talk) 12:18, 6 July 2012 (UTC)

Inaccuracy
I am removing the statement "these are not visible from Earth's surface" in the first paragraph. It's not at all clear what "these" refers to, but solar flares definitely are visible from Earth's surface - Carrington and Hodgson's 1859 observations were clearly not made from a spacecraft. Plenty of information about solar flares and how they are observed from ground-based observatories here. HairyDan (talk) 08:46, 14 July 2012 (UTC)

Prominence vs. protuberance
Throughout Wikipedia and elsewhere the term prominence is used. And I know that the word "protuberance" in general applies to many things ("things that protrude from something else", see here), like for example there are occipital protuberances, mental protuberances etc.

But maybe should we create a redirect page (i.e. "Solar protuberance" redirecting to "Solar prominence" article)? Because Google search for Solar protuberance shows this article as the first/topmost result. Further, there is even an entry Solar protuberances on Free Online Dictionary. Also, searching Wikipedia for solar protuberance does in fact return some results. --Wayfarer (talk) 22:36, 22 October 2012 (UTC)

Hazards: Solar flare of January 20, 2005
The line "A solar flare on January 20, 2005 released the highest concentration of protons ever directly measured,[11] taking only 15 minutes after observation to reach Earth, indicating a velocity of approximately one-third light speed, giving astronauts as little as 15 minutes to reach shelter." has an incorrect assumption which is not validated by any article cited. The part "indicating a velocity of approximately one-third light speed" is provably false: Light from the Sun takes an average of 8 minutes to get to Earth, so a 15 minute journey from the Sun would be almost 1/2 the speed of light. Regardless, neither statement is reported as fact by a cited source, and therefore no assumption of the speed of the particles should be part of this Wikipedia article. I am removing that portion for the stated reasons. GeoffMossburg (talk) 16:12, 11 April 2013 (UTC)

I don't know if the event happened, but the math is sound. As noted, light from the sun takes about 8 minutes to reach the earth, so the observation is 8 minutes after the event. If it then took an additional 15 minutes for the protons to arrive, then the protons spent 8 + 15 = 23 minutes to travel from the sun to the earth. That would indicate that the protons were traveling at roughly 1/3 the speed of light. Jlwether (talk) 17:57, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

Reference for Classification
The reference for the classification of the solar flares (atm ref. 7) "Principal Regularities in the Distribution of Major Earthquakes Relative to Solar and Lunar Tides and Other Cosmic Forces" has actually no information about this classification in it, if I haven't completely overseen it.

The Space Weather page http://spaceweather.com/glossary/flareclasses.html may be a better source here, although it does not have the mentioned A class.

HappySka (talk) 23:10, 12 April 2013 (UTC)

Sun solar flares and public understanding
Headline: Sun unleashes monster solar flare, biggest of 2014. Interesting; fascinating; important to know. — IMO, Charles Edwin Shipp (talk) 16:35, 25 February 2014 (UTC)
 * http://www.foxnews.com/science/2014/02/25/sun-unleashes-monster-solar-flare-biggest-2014/?intcmp=features

Z class flare?
Can anyone provide a reference for the term "Z class" and its definition? I've never seen it before. If it is as defined in the table, then there have already been many observed, and the comment about the 1859 event being X40 is irrelevant. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.96.79.118 (talk) 22:07, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

Time delay?
"A solar flare on January 20, 2005 released the highest concentration of protons ever directly measured,[10] giving astronauts as little as 15 minutes to reach shelter."
 * This suggests that a solar flare's effects cannot be felt on Earth until about 15 minutes later, although light take 8 1/2 minutes. Can someone clarify this for the article please? Kortoso (talk) 23:51, 10 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Solar flares actually do not travel at the speed of light-the particles travel at sub-light speed.Joshualouie711 (talk) 00:11, 15 September 2016 (UTC)
 * Right, particles travel at speeds less than light, though some are relativistic. They tend to follow interplanetary magnetic field lines, and these are not straight lines, so their passage from the Sun to the Earth (if they are on a field line connecting the two), can take something greater than the 7.5 minutes (or whatever it is) it takes light to make the straight line journey. Isambard Kingdom (talk) 00:19, 15 September 2016 (UTC)

File:Magnificent CME Erupts on the Sun - August 31.jpg to appear as POTD
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Unit error in opening paragraph.
6*10^25 joules is not equal to 160 billion megatons of TNT. The comparison is off by an order of magnitude. This needs to be fixed and which ever of the values if incorrect needs to be changed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 11cookeaw1 (talk • contribs) 11:33, 31 December 2015 (UTC)

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