Talk:Sonic Team/Archive 1

Sega Technical Institute
If I understand correctly, Sega Technical Institute redirects merely because they assisted with Sonic 2 & Howard Drossin did some music for 3 & Knuckles? I think it's misleading - Sega Technical Institute seems so have been a distinct division of SOA, seems to have been comprised of mostly westerners with little staff overlap, & developed at least seven games not including their work with Sonic. I'd suggest the developer of fairly well-known games like Comix Zone, Kid Chamelion or The Ooze should have their own article, but if that's not appropriate then I think their summary would ideally be on a Sega article rather than here.

http://www.mobygames.com/browse/games/sega-technical-institute/ http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Sonic_Team&oldid=357180252

202.161.16.68 (talk) 15:42, 25 April 2010 (UTC).

Pictures
The article needs pictures--Cube b3 (talk) 02:46, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

Moving Information Out
The Sonic Team article was getting over crowded so the noteable members list was moved to a new article--Cube b3 (talk) 02:27, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

-- The Gameography has been moved to a Sonic Team Gameography article as well--Cube b3 (talk) 02:44, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

Question
Shouldn't the page be titled Sonic Team? - The T

English
Does Sonic Team have an english website? The link on the article's page goes to a japaneese website.
 * No, but you can use like Babelfish or have Google translate it for you. --Xeccos 01:43, 28 April 2006 (UTC)

Sonic Team in Japanese
The corporation, Sonic Team in Japanese is Sonikku-Tīmu (ソニク ティーム), because it's expressed in katakana. --PJ Pete

No, it's ソニックチーム in katakana. --Ja-tails 22:57, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

I'm sorry, to tell you this, "chi" that replaces "ti" is an ancient thing on foreign words and is now rarely used to replace it after the sound "ti" was borrowed from foriegn languages. --PJ Pete
 * Doesn't matter. They use chi, so we have to stick to that for accuracy. Check the official website. - Zero1328 Talk? 22:19, 5 May 2007 (UTC)

Sonic Adventure 2/Battle
Is it me or did Sonic Team also develop Sonic Adventure 2 and Sonic Adventure 2: Battle. --Xeccos 01:56, 28 April 2006 (UTC)

Nah, it wasn't you. You'd remember. 88.108.206.239 12:32, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

name
what's with name of this department? somewhere else in wikipedia (sorry, you have to search if you want to know where! ;P) i found they should be called Sega Studios USA, because this is the name they changed on from Team Sonic – here also such redirect leads. does mentioned mysterious article states wrong or this article is a bit out of date? 83.24.250.139 18:17, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

A lot of confusion between Sonic Team, Sonic Team USA and Sega Studios USA
I don't have clear if there are two Sonic Team groups (one for Japan and other for USA) and how they are being differentiated. What's Sega Studios USA then? This is a bigg mess.

I think this must be more clear and separate the article in more sections.

Some source that can help to understand this mess (or confuse even more): http://ghz.emulationzone.org/team.html http://everything2.com/index.pl?node_id=922778 http://www.mobygames.com/company/sonic-team/history http://www.mobygames.com/company/sega-studios-usa

Are there two studios actually? What's the final name of them? Please help explaining this mess, it's very unclear. I can help improving the article if needed.

-- Timofonic 09:25, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

Yeah there are 2 Sonic Team's. The original Sonic Team (Tokyo) and the San Francisco Sonic Team (Sega Studio USA or also known as Sonic Team USA) I already made an article for Sonic Team USA.S200048 14:24, 26 September 2007 (UTC)sonicteamUSA

--

They do not need to be diffrentiated as they operate together and take orders exclusively from Sega of Japan--Cube b3 (talk) 02:33, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

AM8?
It's not a fact that Sonic Team was called Sega AM8.

The department was originally named CS3 (第三CS研究開発部), and changed to RD8 (第八ソフト研究開発部) in 1999. And then it became a company SONICTEAM, Inc.

Now it's been taken over by Sega and restructured. The brand "Sonic Team" is shared among some departments: GE1, GE3, Studio USA and Mobile.

So there is no fact that Sonic Team was called AM8. --Ja-tails 23:34, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

There are 2 sonic team studios. One in Tokyo ( Sonic Team) and one in San Francisco ( Sonic Team USA ) Oh and to clear up the confusion..... Sonic Team USA = Sega Studio USA I already made an article on Sega Studio USA.S200048 14:54, 9 September 2007 (UTC)s200048

Sonic Team today
As it stands things are very confusing in this article. From Sega, Sonic Team Japan (AM8) are now G.E. Dept. #1 and Sonic Team USA are now Sega Studios USA.

So as there's now no such team as Sonic Team shouldn't we have seperate articles for G.E. Dept. #1 and Sega Studios USA? Sonic Team can redirect to GE1, as they are the historical Sonic Team. Also United Game Artists (who are now GE2) links to here at the moment, that should link to a seperate article about AM9/UGA/GE2. That way there would be a seperate article for each team and no confusion.Segafan2005 (talk) 19:45, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Actually, Sega Studio USA was originally a seperate article. But someone said that it would be better if we merged it into one Sonic Team article. So that's why it happened. If you would like to discuss this issue with someone, discuss it with a user named user:Doktor Wilhelm. As he was the one who merged the Sonic Team USA and UGA articles into this one. Also, G.E. Dept. 1 is only the technical name for Sonic Team Japan. They're still known as "Sonic Team". Same goes for Sega Studio USA. They're still the US branch of Sonic Team.--S200048 (talk) 14:07, 31 March 2008 (UTC)s200048

There should be an explanation of that because the Sega article names the main divisions as Global Entertainment Software, Amusement Software and New Entertainment. There are no articles or re-directs for those. If they are still officially called Sonic Team as well I don't have a problem with Sega Studio USA and UGA being in this article but I was under the impression that Sonic Team was just a brand name that can be put on anything now. I just thought it could do with being made clearer. Is there anything official from Sega written about the company's current structure? Segafan2005 (talk) 15:53, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

lol, actually Amusement Software and New Entertainment aren't part of Sonic Team. G.E. Dept 1, Sega Studio USA, and UGA are the only divisions that are part of Sonic Team. All the others such as AV, Smilebite, etc. aren't part of Sonic Team.--72.82.192.78 (talk) 21:31, 31 March 2008 (UTC)s200048

I didn't say they were, I meant the main divisions of Sega. Segafan2005 (talk) 10:35, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

When did Sonic Team became a company as opposed to a division of Sega?
This article is confusing with regard to the history. It appears that Sonic Team began as just that, a team, within Sega of Japan, and then most of the members moved to Sega of America, etc. (I didn't read really closely to disentangle this), but when did Sonic Team stop being a division of some corporate unit of Sega and become its own company? The article doesn't make that clear. It would appear that was after Sega got out of the console wars and focused on game production, at which time the article says Sonic Team was first officially made a company, but before that there is reference to Sonic Team as a company, where the article is talking about how success made Sonic Team more repsected within Sega. I wanted to edit that instance of "company" to "group" or "team", but then realized that "company" might mean that Sonic Team was actually an incorporated subsidiary of Sega of Japan or SOA, and not just an internal department. So which is is? When was Sonic Team a department, when, if ever, was it a subsidiary (a separate corporation wholly owned and controlled by Sega), and when was it first an independent company (not under the control of Sega, but partnering with Sega at will)?

Also, I notice there are few citations in this article; it needs more. Maybe someone should put a citations-needed or editing-improvement-needed-for-quality-standards template at the top of this page. On the upside, what is there is interesting, if true. 71.242.26.9 (talk) 21:56, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

United Game Artists and STI
Can anyone explain why UGA and STI are on this page? As separate teams from the Sonic Team, they should preferably have their own pages. Chopper Dave (talk) 01:15, 27 September 2009 (UTC)

Just because they eventually dissolved into Sonic Team doesn't mean the teams as their own properties shouldn't exist. Each had various achievements and could easily stand on their own. Chopper Dave (talk) 01:16, 27 September 2009 (UTC)


 * They didn't dissolve into the Sonic Team. STI existed before, and during, the Sonic Team's time there. In reality, the Sonic Team had their own space (suite), with separate access from the rest of the STI group. We helped on a couple of Sonic games, but also created several original titles apart from what the Sonic Team was producing. (I was a game developer at STI from 1990 - 1994). --Gschandler (talk) 17:51, 26 August 2014 (UTC)

Sonic Team games
Was there any consensus of Sonic Team having their own page for their games? I don't see it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tripple-ddd (talk • contribs) 12:34, 8 June 2015 (UTC) Do you have a good argument for leaving the status quo intact tough? Having a seperate page is inconsistent with other articles on Wikipedia - most have games and history on the same page.--Tripple-ddd (talk) 13:16, 8 June 2015 (UTC)
 * How have you still not gotten this, after all of these months? The status quo is the default consensus when it has generally been stable, and you've again made a drastic change without attempting to gain a consensus for it - or even attempting to properly explain what it was you were doing. Luke no 94  (tell Luke off here) 13:04, 8 June 2015 (UTC)
 * And, yet again, you're missing the point by a mile. You're proposing a change, so you're the one that has to justify things. You can't just throw content around willy-nilly without explanation. It's also worth noting that the separate list covers games that were not developed by Sonic Studios, but were developed under their supervision - so that page is not just a standard "games by" page, and a merger based on your above comment is not necessarily appropriate. Luke no 94  (tell Luke off here) 13:19, 8 June 2015 (UTC)
 * It is "games by" page due to Sonic Team being attached to it (visible logo and beginning of the game), even tough it is "just" supervision. --Tripple-ddd (talk) 14:50, 8 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Just having your name on something does not mean the game is by that company... Luke no 94  (tell Luke off here) 15:46, 8 June 2015 (UTC)
 * But what if that name is the most present and other partner companies are only present in the credits. They take the authority. Do you know any game studio on Wikipedia that has game list and History seperated? --Tripple-ddd (talk) 16:33, 8 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Off the top of my head? Not straight away. But there are plenty of mega lists that need splitting up in exactly this kind of way anyway (EA being one glaring example). Luke no 94  (tell Luke off here) 17:04, 8 June 2015 (UTC)

MOS and reason for removal of certain sentences
Read the MOS subsection on titles of major works, which video games fall into. They should not be listed as Sonic the Hedgehog or Sonic the Hedgehog, but rather as simply Sonic the Hedgehog.

As for the removal of certain sentences, I removed them because they were either badly written, unsourced, and/or irrelevant. If you can't see that yourself, that's not mine or another editor's problem. Either reword them or connect them as part of another sentence. For example:


 * "CS2 is currently headed by Takashi Iizuka, Shun_Nakamura and Mizu Hosoyamada."

For one, you have already linked Iizuka multiple times in the article, so you only need to list him by his surname this far into the article, while Shun Nakamura has an underscore right in the wikilink (really needed me to point this out?) ~  Dissident93  (talk) 23:49, 9 June 2015 (UTC)


 * Well I'm confused now, you don't talk about styling of parenthesis that you removed, and haven't removed the sentences that you removed prior. So are you okay with these or not? --Tripple-ddd (talk) 10:30, 10 June 2015 (UTC)
 * I'm fine with certain personnel being mentioned as the group director or whatever, but they should not include their role in parenthesis. Also, the if the sentence doesn't flow well with the rest of the paragraph, it should either be removed or re-worded. ~ Dissident93  (talk) 01:28, 11 June 2015 (UTC)
 * You still haven't answered why they shoudn't have their roles in parenthesis. I would be ok if there some kind of Wikipedia rule on this. And sentences that don't flow well. I understand some of the dredunancies that you removed like Naka and Mizuguchi related things. But explain why you removed these sentences? Explain each case, so someone can actually understand.

"which were promoted with the Sonic Team moniker on the boxart" I mean what is worng with this? Look it up, these two games were the first with the Sonic Team logo on the boxart.

"After arcade development he established CS4, which was an extension of CS3" "Both Sonic Team and United Game Artists during this period shared the same producer, Mineko Okumura[7]" This is information about Sonic Team and UGA are related...why does it need to be removed?

"Since 2009, the "Sonic Team" brand has diminished out of non-Sonic games, despite them being produced by former Sonic Team members or being made in the same CS2 department. Examples of this include Pole's Big Adventure,[9] Rhythm Thief & the Emperor’s Treasure,[10]Phantasy Star Online 2, and Project 575.[11] The Puyo Puyo franchise has also no Sonic Team logos, but is listed on the official Sonic Team website. CS2 is currently headed by Iizuka, Shun Nakamura and Mizu Hosoyamada."

Again basic information, that is sourced and hard to prove wrong.--Tripple-ddd (talk) 08:50, 11 June 2015 (UTC)

Clarify
The first paragraph begins: "Sonic Team is a Japanese video game development division of Sega." It ends: "Since 1996, Sonic Team has been a brand name of several divisions of Sega product development, as well as a subsidiary company of Sega."

This seems to contradict itself, or it's at least ambiguous.


 * Is it a development division? Or one of several divisions? Or several divisions?
 * Is it a development division or a subsidiary company?

Popcornduff (talk) 13:07, 24 March 2018 (UTC)


 * Maybe you can help me figure out how to word this, then:
 * It is a development division, but has had several identities as Sega has shuffled up their divisions over the years.
 * It is a development division now, but was a subsidiary company for a few years, noting that it didn't start that way and it isn't now.  Red Phoenix  talk  14:36, 24 March 2018 (UTC)
 * Ah, I understand now. The problem comes from the wording "has been", which could be used in two senses: eg "I have been to India" or "I have been in London since May". I'll see if I can clarify it. Popcornduff (talk) 14:48, 24 March 2018 (UTC)

Studio or Studios?
Hello, I've been looking at the Shadow the Hedgehog video game where it says the developer is Sega Studio USA, and yet this article calls it Sega Studios USA. I know that it is not very major, but I feel that the name could be better addressed.SoulSnow (talk) 05:23, 23 May 2018 (UTC)
 * To my knowledge, every source I've read on the matter call it "Sega Studios USA". Perhaps there is a discrepancy in the sources, or they published under both without being specific?  We can look into the matter further.   Red Phoenix  talk  10:49, 23 May 2018 (UTC)

I guess that it would probably help if the sources of this article that mention this developer by name were compared to the sources of the Shadow the Hedgehog video game (and any other game that has the developer be a major part of the development) article, and see with one is the technically correct name.SoulSnow (talk) 19:08, 28 May 2018 (UTC)

Comprehensiveness for later years
Hi all,

I need some ideas from editors experienced with Sonic Team. I've mainly slowed down this rewrite because I need a hand identifying what all needs covered from the Saturn era on, and to what depth. Retrospective sources get more and more fuzzy as we get to more modern times in Sonic Team's history, as does my personal knowledge of the subject. I've read through List of Sonic Team games to try and get an idea, but I still don't really feel like I have a good one of where to go next. Can I get some opinions of what we should expand on in the later sections? Thank you, Red Phoenix  talk  16:11, 23 June 2018 (UTC)


 * Maybe the lack of good sources for Sonic Team's later work is indicative of the fact that it's simply less notable. Their (and Sega's) "golden age" was pretty much 1991 - 2001 or so, after which Sega exited the hardware business, the quality of the games went downhill, important employees left, the brand became more and more nebulous, etc. Maybe there's simply less to write about. Popcornduff (talk) 17:41, 24 June 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm going to say both yes and no to that one, Popcornduff. Good sources have been harder to find, and I agree with your point that there is less to write about.  That's all true.  However, I look at what we do have and I know it's not enough.  I know we've at least got to talk about more of their games.  My question really is which ones, or are there more major points since 2004 that we need to still hit?  I need some more opinions from subject matter experts because while there will be less depth in these areas and less to talk about, there will still be more than what we have now.   Red Phoenix  talk  21:25, 24 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Billy Hatcher isn't discussed at all; the newer Puyo Puyo games aren't mentioned either. Those could probably give you a bit of information to put here. JOE BRO  64  21:31, 24 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Not watching this page, just saw this conversation. I just finished a massive rewrite of Phantasy Star Online. Didn't do the reception/legacy yet, but I found a lot of development and release information. I think one of the key things that should be touched on here are the circumstances surrounding the start of Sonic Team's development on PSO (it was mandated from Sega corporate), and its notability as the first online game in Japan, and the first online game for consoles. TarkusAB talk 00:58, 7 July 2018 (UTC)

Games section
Having reread the article, I actually feel pretty good about the history now. Thank you for your suggestion; I added in a sentence, and then I threw in a bit about Mania and Forces. The last thing I feel this really needs before a GA run is a good Games section, similar to what I did with Sega Technical Institute. STI, however, had so little in game development that I chose to just cite a bunch of reviews on their games individually, but Sonic Team has way more games than that. If you guys have some ideas of how to handle this or some sources about Sonic Team as a whole worth citing for a section on their games, let me know. This could be a GA-quality article here with only a little more work. Red Phoenix talk  00:41, 28 June 2018 (UTC)