Talk:Sonoma County wine

Attribution
Some of the content from the Winemaking and History sections are originally from the Sonoma County wineries article. AgneCheese/Wine 23:04, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

History
Currently, there is a title in the "History" section that reads as follows:

By the time of the Bear Flag Revolt in Sonoma and the subsequent annexation of California by the United States in 1854, wine grapes were an established part of agriculture in the region.

I'm not sure what developments in 1854 the author might have in mind here. As Kevin Starr describes on pages 67-73 in California: A History (New York: Modern Library, 2007), the U.S. declared war on Mexico (of which California was then a part) in 1846. Later that same year, U.S. military, lead by Commodore Sloat of the U.S. Navy, captured Monterey (then the capital of California) and Yerba Buena (later re-named San Francisco). Further battles ensued in other parts of California, but by February 1848 the U.S. had emerged as the victor in the Mexican-American War, and the U.S. and Mexico signed the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo - which transferred control of all Mexican holdings north of the Rio Grande (including California) to the U.S. Sonoma, by 1854, had already been recognized by Mexico as part of the U.S. for six years. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.5.77.49 (talk) 14:17, 19 July 2009 (UTC)

Proposed move
I propose that this article be moved to Sonoma County wine, as there is no "Sonoma County AVA" designated in CFR Title 27 Part 9 (see: Editing Talk:Sonoma County wine (section) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia;rgn=div5;view=text;node=27%3A1.0.1.1.7;idno=27;cc=ecfr http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr;sid=bff700d0bbb2a632948b70fe7e91d7d4;rgn=div5;view=text;node=27%3A1.0.1.1.7;idno=27;cc=ecfr). The title and opening sentence are both factually incorrect.--Kharker 20:24, 30 November 2007 (UTC)

I'd support that. Stepheng3 (talk) 23:01, 5 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Wow, you're right! This is so confusing.  There are numerous reliable sources referring to a "Sonoma County AVA" but they seem to be mistaken.  Could we get some clarification about what's going on?  Wikidemo (talk) 10:40, 7 December 2007 (UTC)


 * I'm not an expert, but I think that counties are automatically legal as appellations, so AVAs are only created for areas that are smaller (or occasionally larger) than counties. Unless someone objects soon, I plan to do the move myself. Stepheng3 (talk) 16:21, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

Notable wineries
As these wineries get articles and are established as passing WP:CORP, then they should be moved over to the main article. Right now it is a little too directoy style and the term "notable" is vaguely define. Having them pass Wikipedia's notability standards to at least have an article is more defined and give more weight to the term "notable". With the current list, anyone can add any winery they like even though it may never have a Wikipedia article. At least here on the talk page, people can add to the list without negatively affecting the article and some may be inspired to create articles on the wineries that are truly notable. AgneCheese/Wine 00:46, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm fine with that, even though on the old article we had settled on keeping them. I think moving unlinked wineries over to the talk page is a great idea because it addresses one of the main reasons for including them, to help people fill out the coverage.  I've taken the liberty of redlinking them all so that we can monitor them and move them over if we notice someone has created them, and also to make it that much easier for someone to get one started if they wish.  The below wineries may or may not be notable, and there may be notable ones that aren't on the list, but this was the best effort of a few people to guess which 1/3 or so of the wineries in the county are most important.Wikidemo (talk) 01:01, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Redlinking them is a good idea. I've moderated my position on them a lot since talking with you and I see this as a sort of middle ground between the extremes. AgneCheese/Wine 01:29, 5 January 2008 (UTC)


 * BTW, if you want to take a similar approach to other articles about different county and/or AVA wine producers I would endorse that. I know we may have reached a different result in deletion discussions and talk page discussions before, but I think this is a nice way to go about it, and consistency throughout California and perhaps the US in wine region articles is a good thing.Wikidemo (talk) 01:08, 5 January 2008 (UTC)


 * I added Sebastiani Vineyards to the list. Considering the historic importance of the Sebastiani family and the winery in the winemaking history of California, I'm very surprised there's practically no article on either in Wikipedia, save a biographical article on Don Sebastiani that mainly concentrates on his political career. Peter G Werner (talk) 02:02, 24 December 2012 (UTC)