Talk:Sour Candy (Lady Gaga and Blackpink song)

What type of release is "Sour Candy"?
I was looking through articles about "Sour Candy" and, while most of them don't say if it's a single, promotional single, etc., I found this article by Stereogum, which described it as "the new single". Are there any other articles which confirm that "Sour Candy" is a single or promotional single?

Thank you in advance. EnjoyingMyProblems (talk) 16:30, 28 May 2020 (UTC)
 * As far as I'm aware it is generally considered a promo single, but there are rumours on Twitter that it may be like "The Edge of Glory" and later become the third single. HeyitsBen talk 16:55, 28 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Also many hints which suggest a potential music video release. HeyitsBen talk 17:01, 28 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Thank you for telling me about that! I also have one more question: how can I differentiate between a single and a promotional single? EnjoyingMyProblems (talk) 17:04, 28 May 2020 (UTC)
 * I understand that promo singles have a sole purpose of promoting the album (in this case), so besides the fact that they are released earlier, they will be treated like a regular song off the album in every other regard (e.g. little to none radio play; no music video etc.). HeyitsBen talk 17:17, 28 May 2020 (UTC)
 * "Sour Candy" has been released to Australian radio (see reference in article), so I'd suggest it is the third single (at least in Australia - other countries may follow suit).Tobyjamesaus (talk) 01:35, 30 May 2020 (UTC)

There are conflicting reports as to the kind of release Sour Candy is. Multiple sources state explicitly that it is a promotional single only, in addition to an official Universal Music press release confirming "Rain on Me" as the 'current' single (thereby meaning Sour Candy is not an official single at all). It was also discussed how there have been cases of other promotional singles being 'added' on Australian radio stations in the past, most notably "Future Nostalgia" by Dua Lipa, and "Imagine" by Ariana Grande. In light of this, I proposed a criteria for what we would need in order to consider Sour Candy as an official single, which is as follows:
 * A Summary of What Has Been Discussed Regarding Sour Candy on the Chromatica Talk Page.
 * Evidence of a radio release in other countries, to prove the Australia situation wasn't just another "Future Nostalgia" or "Imagine" type-case.
 * Evidence of a substantial 'push' (in the vein of what LOVI explained) worldwide, or even just in Australia. This would most likely take the form of a sustained effort to promote it to radio (i.e. if it is getting heavy spins or is regularly appearing in UMG press releases).
 * Official confirmation from either Lady Gaga or Blackpink that Sour Candy is the 'third' official single from Chromatica. Artists often refer to promotional singles as 'singles' too (I believe there is evidence of Gaga saying this for "Hair", "Venus", and "Dope", despite all three being promo-only), so there would be a need for them to specify 'third official', or 'next' single, rather than just 'single', as obviously promo-singles also have 'single' in their name.

As this was still being discussed, we are keeping Sour Candy as listed as a promo single for now, until any of these fresh pieces of potential evidence listed above, become apparent. BenBowser (talk) 12:02, 30 May 2020 (UTC)

Great summary. Well done Tobyjamesaus (talk) 08:58, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

Sour Candy debut on Scottish Chart
The song already debuted on the Scottish Chart at #28 with only 1 day. Sour Candy #28 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.20.106.245 (talk) 17:37, 29 May 2020 (UTC)

Single or not?
Christ, it was stated "promotional single", and then I refreshed the page and someone reverted it back to "single". Nahnah4 (talk | contribs) 11:35, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Like "Dance in the Dark", "Sour Candy" was sent to Australian radios, which makes it third single of Chromatica. infsai (dyskusja) 11:36, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Per Talk:Chromatica – they are having a discussion there. Nahnah4 (talk | contribs) 11:38, 30 May 2020 (UTC)

Sour Candy - a single?
Gaga released this song unannounced on Twitter a day before the album release. This isn't a single so shouldn't be a part of single list.Alexblago (talk) 19:06, 29 May 2020 (UTC)
 * It was sent to radios in Australia, making it an official single. — Status  ( talk  ·  contribs ) 19:54, 29 May 2020 (UTC)
 * A strange decision considering that "Rain On Me" is still impacting worldwide but an independent release to radio means it should be considered a single. ≫ Lil- Unique1 -{  Talk  }- 21:32, 29 May 2020 (UTC)
 * What makes it even more interesting is the fact there are sources calling it a promo single, which are generally hard to come by. — Status  ( talk  ·  contribs ) 21:56, 29 May 2020 (UTC)


 * Consider, as of right now, it is being sent to Australia radio, it is leading me to believe that it is an Australian-only single, while other places it is being considered a promotional, pre-release release.  livelikemusic   ( TALK! ) 23:24, 29 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Yes, it's a single. Many times songs are given different releases in different countries depending on the genre, etc. In addition to Australia, sometimes songs are "only" released in Italy (or perhaps because there aren't a huge amount of sources with radio release dates we only know of one country) but it's no different than like a rap song only being released to hip-hop radio in the US or something. it just happened to previously be released as a promo single. Heartfox (talk) 00:23, 30 May 2020 (UTC)


 * My apologies Heartfox, I didn't see you were contributing to the discussion here. As per the message I left on your page, you will see that the link you have provided to indicate Sour Candy as an official single is broken, and leads to a page not found warning. So far, as multiple sources, which can be properly accessed explicitly state Sour Candy as a promotional single only, I believe it is best if we consider it as such for the time being. If you are able to find another source which proves it as an official, ideally one where the link works, then we can list it as an official single on here. For the time being until then, listed as a promotional single it should remain. --BenBowser (talk) 00:28, 30 May 2020 (UTC)

The page works, it's right here. I don't know why you'd be having trouble accessing it, but it works for me. — Status  ( talk  ·  contribs ) 00:31, 30 May 2020 (UTC)

Honestly, Australia radio dates are weird because many promotional singles are sent there, for example "Future Nostalgia" by Dua Lipa, but that is only when the artist has confirmed it is not a single, which has not happened. At this point, I would think It still classifies as a promotional single because Interscope Records nor Gaga or Blackpink are pushing it as an official single. LOVI 33  00:32, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
 * I am not familiar with the status of "Future Nostalgia". Does there need to be a larger community discussion about what inferences should be made from The Music Network's radio release dates? Also, what classifies as "pushing" a song as an official single? Heartfox (talk) 00:35, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Hey Heartfox, "pushing" as an official single basically means being promoted i.e. live performances, multiple radio dates, music videos, remixes, etc. LOVI  33  00:38, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
 * LOVI33 makes a fair point. I remember Imagine by Ariana Grande having a similar situation on Australian radio, where it was 'added' but never officially pushed, and therefore it was considered to still be a promo single. Since Sour Candy is not being pushed in any other way, and the overwhelming evidence is therefore that it is just a promo single, I think we should consider it as such for now. --BenBowser (talk) 00:35, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
 * When "Sour Candy" was released, it wasn't as like an unlocked track on the album—it actually received a separate release too (which I think is notable given the album would only be released the following day). I guess this could also be taken into consideration. Heartfox (talk) 00:45, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
 * However, there isn't even separate artwork for it... so yeah. That Australian radio thing is kind of confusing now lol. Heartfox (talk) 00:50, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Good find. If anything though, this proves that Sour Candy is a promo single only, as it's the only pre-release song with a different rollout. "Rain on Me" (a confirmed official singe) was only released as an unlocked track on the album - no standalone version. The same happened to "Stupid Love"; once the album pre-order was put up they actually deleted the stand-alone single version. This difference in their rollout could be considered additional evidence to Sour Candy being a different kind of release to the two official singles, i.e. that it's a promotional song only. What do you think? --BenBowser (talk) 00:53, 30 May 2020 (UTC)


 * Just because there is not artwork does not many anything; in the current day of streaming and little-to-no physical releases for singles, songs often will not get artwork. Same thing for music videos, etc.  livelikemusic   ( TALK! ) 00:53, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
 * The source clearly says " Singles to Radio". Unless Gaga or her label deny the song as a proper single (like Mariah Carey confirming "GTFO"). Then it should be a single, per WP:V and most of WP:SONGS articles of radio-only singles. Bluesatellite (talk) 01:44, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I agree the fact it says "Singles" to Radio (not "Songs") is notable. There is a Universal Music press release here; not sure if it gives any further info. Heartfox (talk) 02:04, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Heartfox the press release source you have given just further proves that its a promotional single, writing that "Rain on Me" is the "current" single of the album, meaning its the last released single, making "Sour Candy" a promotional single. LOVI  33  02:19, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Perhaps it only refers to its status as a promotional single in Canada as it's a press release from Universal Music Canada; it might not cover everything. Just trying to provide as much perspectives here. Heartfox (talk) 02:23, 30 May 2020 (UTC)

It seems from the discussion so far that the single arguments are:
 * Released on May 28 separately from the album on digital properties (not as an unlocked album track), despite the fact the album would only be released one day later.
 * Released on May 29 as part of "Singles to Radio" in Australia.
 * These Australian radio release dates are often used in other song articles for justifying them being official singles.
 * Songs getting different releases in different countries is extremely common; to be expected even.
 * Neither Gaga nor Blackpink's teams have denied it's an official single (it was noted that other artists have done so to delineate)

It seems from the discussion so far that the  promotional single arguments are:
 * Released on May 28 with no prior announcement (unlike "Rain on Me", etc.).
 * Some sources on May 28 explicitly called it a promotional single.
 * These Australian radio release dates have been disregarded in other articles as the songs were never "pushed" like an official single and as such, were kept as promo-only.
 * There hasn't been the same amount of "push" as would be expected from an "official" single. ->

I'd like to note that a song first being released as a promo single and then being released "officially" afterwards is completely normal... (A No No, I Don't Search I Find, etc.) I continue to be of the opinion it is a single, given the Australian radio release. Heartfox (talk) 04:52, 30 May 2020 (UTC)

Nice list! I think that considered, the fact it has been explicitly called a promo single by multiple sources, as well as the fact Australian single 'releases' have been discredited before, should mean we should class it as promo-only for now. Here's my proposition for what we would need to consider Sour Candy an official single:
 * Evidence of a radio release in other countries, to prove the Australia situation wasn't just another "Future Nostalgia" or "Imagine" type-case.
 * Evidence of a substantial 'push' (in the vein of what LOVI explained) worldwide, or even just in Australia. This would most likely take the form of a sustained effort to promote it to radio (i.e. if it is getting heavy spins or is regularly appearing in UMG press releases).
 * Official confirmation from either Lady Gaga or Blackpink that Sour Candy is the 'third' official single from Chromatica. Artists often refer to promotional singles as 'singles' too (I believe there is evidence of Gaga saying this for "Hair", "Venus", and "Dope", despite all three being promo-only), so there would be a need for them to specify 'third official', or 'next' single, rather than just 'single', as obviously promo-singles also have 'single' in their name.

Since all three of these factors are strong enough in their own right to prove Sour Candy as an official third single, we would not need all three to be met, only one with sufficient evidence would suffice. What does everyone think? BenBowser (talk) 10:19, 30 May 2020 (UTC)

Same applies to Drip by Cardi B, it used to be labeled as a promo single before it was sent to radio, then it was later changed to a single cause of the fact it was sent to radio in Australia

- User:Kidzbopkaren973 —Preceding undated comment added 01:39, 2 June 2020 (UTC)


 * ARIA Charts referring to "Sour Candy" as a single: "Chromatica includes the singles ‘Stupid Love’ (#7 Mar. ’20), ‘Rain On Me’ (#2 Jun. ’20) and ‘Sour Candy’ (#8 Jun. ’20), as well as collaborations with Ariana Grande, Elton John and South Korean girl group Blackpink." (source) Heartfox (talk) 19:33, 6 June 2020 (UTC)

Comment – Can we take this to Talk:Sour Candy (Lady Gaga and Blackpink song)? There have been a hell lot of disruptive editing over at that page and I don't think people are seeing the discussion here. Nahnah4 (talk | contribs) 11:37, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Yes fair enough. I just checked and the number of back and forth edits on that page is ridiculous! I've copied my proposed list onto that talk page, and have left a brief summary of what has been discussed here so far. BenBowser (talk) 12:04, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
 * I think its a case of wait and see. If there's no further promotion of the song e.g. video or mention of it as a single in the weeks ahead, then it should be referred to as a promotional single. Promo singles can be made available to limited markets. In the UK, we don't have formal radio adds but songs get "playlisted" when labels make them available and if stations want to play them/ ≫  Lil- Unique1 -{  Talk  }- 19:47, 30 May 2020 (UTC)

Success on the Hot Dance/Electronic Songs chart
https://www.forbes.com/sites/hughmcintyre/2020/10/19/blackpink-and-lady-gaga-tie-one-of-btss-biggest-feats-on-the-dance-chart/#5e09ad4f38c2

Leaving this link for further improvement on the Commercial performance section of the article. Kirtap92 (talk) 12:39, 21 October 2020 (UTC)

Is Kenh1r reliable?
Can anyone point out Kenh14.vn's credentials for inclusion as a reliable source? >> Lil-unique1  (  talk  ) — 15:47, 18 July 2022 (UTC)

Sample
@Lil-unique1 If the "Sour Candy" article doesn 't have the information about the sampling, shouldn't we also remove that from the Chromatica article? It' s included in the Music and lyrics section, but then the same rule should apply there. Sricsi (talk) 16:37, 17 August 2022 (UTC)


 * Its a good question - absolutely so. Unless it can be officially proven from the artist or credits its speculation/reported inaccuracy. You can't sample or interpolate without providing credit. >> Lil-unique1  (  talk  ) — 19:32, 17 August 2022 (UTC)