Talk:South Australia/Archive 1

Misc
Sorry, I shouldn't have used the rollback feature to revert 65.6.41.238's change of "Queen of Australia" to "Queen of England". Queen Elizabeth II has many titles. The proper one to use in this context is "Queen of Australia". See Queen of Australia and Elizabeth II of the United Kingdom. -- Tim Starling 01:53, May 19, 2004 (UTC)

Why is South Australia called "South Australia"? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.134.229.253 (talk) 08:47, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Addition of Ingenious Groups
Can we have links on this page to indigeneous groups of SA? I've added to the Kaurna article. I'm thinking about doing some more groups soon. Frances76 11:30, 20 October 2005 (UTC)

Sources for Proclamation Changes
There is no Murray River valley per se. Burden is on someone else to prove that there is and cite sources.

I added information about the establishment of the colony (otherwise how can the link between Europeans seeing the South Australian area and the modern state be made?), but more could be added. Sources for the Proclamation include: Troy88 03:28, 28 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Bay Discovery Centre (http://www.tourism.holdfast.sa.gov.au/site/page.cfm?u=112)
 * Advertiser newspaper article "Sport, history at the Bay's big day" (http://www.theadvertiser.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5936,17672823%255E2682,00.html)
 * Thank you for your changes.--cj | talk 12:42, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

"piping shrike"
I question the following sentence: While the term piping shrike in scientific circles is unknown it is colloquially referred to as the piping shrike in South Australia. It's more widely accepted name is the Magpie-lark.

The "Magpie-Lark", also known as the "Murray Magpie" (Grallina cyanoleuca) is a totally different bird to the larger Australian magpie. Official government descriptions of the state badge refer to the bird as a "White backed Magpie" (Gymnorhina tibicen leuconota).


 * I agree that the Murray Magpie and Australian Magpie are quite different birds However, it seems less clear exactly which is represented by the Piping Shrike. Even the department of Premier and Cabinet seems uncertain. State Badge of South Australia (copyright 1997) says "The Piping Shrike or White Backed Magpie (Gymnorhina tibicen leuconota) ...". Use of the Piping Shrike (PDF) dated June 2003 on the same website says "There has always been discussion on whether it is the common magpie or the Murray magpie and which ever it is, why is it called a Shrike?". I think most people on being asked to point to a "piping shrike" would point to the state badge. If asked to identify a bird of species "Grallina cyanoleuca" (by the questioner pointing at one or showing a picture), it would be called a Murray Magpie, and the same test on a white-backed magpie would get the response "Magpie", as we do not have black-backed magpies in South Australia. --Scott Davis Talk 23:41, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

For clarity's sake we must surely have just one or the other represented here. The South Australia page refers to the "Magpie-Lark" but the link to the flag refers to a "White backed shrike (Magpie)" and the link then refers to a page on the Australian magpie rather than the Murray magpie. If we must argue the point, that argument could be added to the page devoted to the flag. -- Unsigned.

The solution seems obvious to me. Someone should create the Piping Shrike page as a place where the controversy can be explained in full, and then pages to which the controversy has some relevance could simply link to it. Both of the complementary goals of Clarity and Truth would then be satisfied. (Incidentally, as I see it the primary evidence that the bird is a Murray Magpie is that it looks like one, and the primary evidence that the bird is a true Australian Magpie is that the name "piping shrike" implies a bird noted for the quality of its song - a pipe being a musical instrument - and Australian Magpie is indeed noted for its song whereas the Murry Magpie is not.) 203.63.92.110 16:09, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

"Essentially a city-state"?!
I was more than a little surprised to read this statement in the intro. Granted Adelaide dominates the state in terms of population and politics, but to claim this makes South Australia "essentially" a city-state is faintly ludicrous, especially if you read the city-state article and find it referring to places like Monaco and Singapore. A quick calculation using the population figures from Wikipedia's Adelaide and South Australia articles (which admittedly aren't from identical time periods, but close enough for these purposes) reveals that Adelaide can lay claim to just under 73% of the state's population, hardly the 90%+ I was expecting on the basis of this statement (even if I were willing to discount the problem of South Australia's vast land area). This is far from unique in the Australian context, as similar calculations for Melbourne's population as a proportion of that of Victoria and for Perth in Western Australia both yield just over 73%. In the absence of objections, I'll be editing this misleading reference out of the sentence in the near future. Thylacoleo 03:30, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
 * The proportion can be as high as 80% depending on which definition of Adelaide is used. Nevertheless, I've cut the reference.--cj | talk 06:35, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Thanks, nice to see someone agrees! Thylacoleo 07:31, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

rv war
I have been in a revert war on this article, the has been a discussion on it here and here, what do you think? Myrtone


 * You missed that you're also trying to hold a discussion via the edit history! My edit comment ((South) Australian English!) was connected to a range of spelling and grammar edits, and also removed the German translation from the intro, which appears to be the issue you are concerned about.


 * The point is that in both the language of this wiki (The English Wikipedia) and the official and common language of the place being described (South Australia), the name is "South Australia". Nobody disputes that we had German-speaking migrants early in the history of the colony, but the German translation of the name does not belong at the top of the article. Is it "South Australia" or "Sudaustralien" in Barossa Deutsch? FWIW, one or two of my grandparents were educated in German in South Australia, even though their parents were also born here. I don't know if any schools now teach exclusively in German—do you? --Scott Davis Talk 13:11, 3 July 2006 (UTC)


 * From User talk:ScottDavis:
 * The problem for me is that those "countless other languages" were/are each spoken by *much* less than ten percent of the population, wheras German was once spoken by "ten percent" of the population, this is why I disagree with User:Beneaththelandslide (talk • contribs) about whether it deseaves primacy (whatever 'primacy' is). Myrtone


 * It would be more appropriate for this article to provide the translation in Pitjantjatjara and Kaurna than German, Barossa Deutsch, Italian, Vietnamese, Cornish, or Welsh, all of which have also been spoken by significant groups of migrants in the past. The last two may also have achieved 10% of the population in the 1850s (I don't know).


 * Note that I am not proposing any of those other languages in the introductory paragraph, and probably not anywhere else in the article. It is possible that something like These migrants referred to their new country as "Sudaustralien" could sensibly be added to History of South Australia near the section that talks about bringing their culture and language rather than just learning English. --Scott Davis Talk 09:31, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

"...translation of the name does not belong at the top of the article." As a matter of clarification, do you mean that it is rejected by consensus? I know of no policy or guideline that suggests that non-official languages shouldn't be emphasised like that, in fact I added that after reading a number of articles on Canadian Provences (Yes, Canada and Australia have so much in common, actually much more that most people in either country think). Basically, English and French language are the two offcial languages, but in all provences except Quebec, where French is the sole official language, and Neubauschweig (New Brunswick) where English and French are both official. Despite this, it seems that both the articles on Nova Scotia and Prince Edward Island seem to have Galic notations in the lead despite it's lack of official status. Note however, I do not live in SA nor have I ever, I have been there a number of times and I have read about the history of it. Myrtone ( ☏ ) 01:21, 4 November 2006 (UTC)


 * Given the number of people involved in reverting that addition at the time, yes, I think that was a consensus decision.
 * In Canada, both "French" and "English" are official languages at the federal/national level. In fact, there are several distinct groups of French-speaking people, each with their own dialects and histories. I note that the article on Canadian Gaelic says there are still people on Cape Breton Island (the northern part of Nova Scotia) and P.E.I. who speak Gaelic as a first language. As far as I know, there are no communities in SA where the first choice of language in the street is German. In parts of New Brunswick, it can be quite disorienting for an English-speaking Australian (with a bit of very dodgy high school French from a long time ago) to go from being served in English in one shop to going next door and finding I speak as much French as the server does English. In Montreal restaurants, tourists are greeted with "Bonjour-Hello", and the conversation continues in whichever language the customer chooses to answer in. The equivalent does not happen in Tanunda or Nuriootpa. --Scott Davis Talk 09:22, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

Motto
Does anyone have a reference for the motto? I did a Google search, and almost exclusively Wikipedia mirros came out. The motto was added because it is listed at Goway.com, but I don't think that qualifies as a reliable source. PruneauT 20:52, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

4th largest state?
As only WA and QLD precede SA as larger states, SA should be mentioned as the 3rd largest state. The only reason i can think why its been listed as 4th is because of the Northern Territory. But the Northern Territory is not a state but a territory. --AussieBob 08:39, 22 December 2006 (UTC)


 * States and territories of Australia says 4th largest. The text in this article is "...the fourth largest of Australia's states and territories", which appears to be correct (smaller than two states and one territory). --Scott Davis Talk 13:33, 22 December 2006 (UTC)

WikiProject South Australia?
There is currently new state projects in development. See WP:WA. Perhaps it would be beneficial to your state. Fred 16:11, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Southern Ocean
In the Geography section reference is made to the Southern Ocean. Clearly from the definition of that ocean as well as the Indian Ocean, South Australia's coast is on the Indian Ocean. Perhaps a popular misconception? --Uxejn 15:47, 29 April 2007 (UTC)


 * It comes under general usage. The Antarctic treaty of 1961 called all waters south of 60°S the Southern Ocean and the International Hydrographic Organization made it official in 2000. The Southern Ocean Sancuary was established in 1994 and made the Southern Ocean "unofficially" all the waters south of 40°S except for where the Indian Ocean Whale sanctuary intrudes (where it is 55°S) and the waters between 50°W and 150°W where it remains at 60°S. Australian maps have always called the area south of 40° the Southern Ocean and the point where the Southern Ocean meets the Indian Ocean is "officially" Cape Leeunwin in Western Australia. Wayne 01:06, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
 * It's more than just popular perception, the sea is officially gazetted as the "Southern Ocean" in Australian jurisdictions.--cj | talk 02:21, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

Acknowledging and recognising famous South Australians
As the author of the section ackowledging famous South Australians, I must respectfully disagree with Cyberjunkie's deletion of this section, and their comment that the links of the persons referred to in the article are "tenuous".

I would welcome further constructive debate ragarding this issue.

From my perspective, the section is factually accurate, and it is fair to include reference to famous persons in an article about a particular place. Fitzpatrickjm 14:26, 5 May 2007 (UTC) Fitzpatrickjm 14:27, 5 May 2007 (UTC)

As a contribution to this debate, here is a section I have reproduced from the Wikipedia article for the town of Blackburn in the UK. Fitzpatrickjm 15:10, 5 May 2007 (UTC)

People from Blackburn The following people were born or brought up in Blackburn:

[edit] The arts Musician, singer and composer Tony Ashton was born in Blackburn on 1 March 1946.[citation needed] Actor Michael Billington, star of UFO, was born in Blackburn. Writer Josephine Cox was born in Blackburn, setting many of her novels in Lancashire.[citation needed] Kathleen Ferrier, Opera Diva and gay icon, born Blackburn 1912, died London 1953 Music composer Barry Gray famous for the Thunderbirds march was born in Blackburn.[2] Wilfred Greatorex, writer and television script editor, was born in Blackburn on 27 May 1922.[citation needed] Nez Nolan - the human pea. Alfred Gregory, official photographer for the 1953 ascent of Mount Everest by Sir Edmund Hillary and Tenzing Norgay, was born in Blackburn.[citation needed] Kathleen Harrison, one of the greatest British film character actresses of the Forties and Fifties, was born in Blackburn on 23 February 1892.[32] Broadcaster Russell Harty was born in the town on 5 September 1934.[citation needed] Fashion designer Wayne Hemingway spent most of his childhood in Blackburn, moving there after being born in Morecambe in 1961. He attended Queen Elizabeth's Grammar School, Blackburn.[33] Jason Kay of Jamiroquai, after being born in Manchester on December 30, 1969; moved to Blackburn before his singing career took off. Sarah Martin, violinist, singer, and songwriter for the independent Scottish band Belle & Sebastian, was born in Blackburn. Ruby Henderson (fashion connoisseur), spent her childhood in Blackburn but now resides in Paris, France. Currently contributes regularly to French Vogue. Attended Our Lady & St John Catholic Arts College. Actor Ian McShane was born in Blackburn on 29 September 1942 [3]. Sagar Mitchell and James Kenyon, pioneer cinematographers in the 1900s, were born here. Much of their film output still survives, see Mitchell and Kenyon. Actor Steve Pemberton was born in Blackburn in 1967.[34] Actress Wendi Peters was born in Blackburn on January 29th 1968.[citation needed] Lucy Quinn, famous for her contributions to the Feminist Art Movement, currently resides in the Little Harwood area of Blackburn. Alfred Wainwright, author of the Pictorial Guides to the Lakeland Fells, was born in the town. There is a plaque commemorating this fact at his former house on Audley Range. Actor Jon Walmsley was born in Blackburn on 6 February 1956.[citation needed] Film maker Michael Winterbottom was born in Blackburn, and also attended QEGS.[35]

[edit] Sports Everton striker James Beattie was brought up in Blackburn, attending Queen Elizabeth's Grammar School. Blackburn Rovers captain Ronnie Clayton was capped 35 times as an England international.[36] Keith Duckworth, motor racing engine designer. He designed the Cosworth DFV, which revolutionised Formula One in the 1960s. (1933-2005)[citation needed] Four times World Superbike Championship winner Carl Fogarty was born in Blackburn on 1 July 1966.[37] Bill Fox, chairman of Blackburn Rovers and president of the Football League until his death in 1991, was born in Blackburn on 6 January 1928.[citation needed] England Rugby union player Will Greenwood was born in Blackburn on 20 October 1972.[citation needed] Rock climber John Sumner was born in Blackburn on 13 March 1936. Sumner was the pre-eminent exploratory climber in his chosen domain of mid-Wales, climbing cutting-edge routes on the remote crags and cliff-faces south of Snowdonia starting in the mid-1950s.[38] The 1985 World Professional Snooker Champion Dennis Taylor moved to Blackburn from Northern Ireland in 1966 at the age of 17.[39]

[edit] Business The industrialist Jack Walker was born in the town on 19 May 1929. The steel magnate ploughed his fortune into his beloved Blackburn Rovers, leading to their Premier League title success in 1995.

[edit] Science Mathematician David Fowler was a leading authority on the history of mathematics in ancient Greece. Born in Blackburn on 28 April 1937, Fowler studied at the Russell School, near Morecambe Bay and Gonville and Caius College, Cambridge.[40] Arthur Maitland was a pioneering figure in laser physics research. At the University of St Andrews, he very quickly established a group working on gas lasers, recognising that the gas-discharge laser had enormous potential for practical use. He was born in Blackburn on 7 December 1928.[citation needed]

[edit] Politics John Morley, British Liberal statesman, writer and newspaper editor, was born in Blackburn in 1838.John Morley, 1st Viscount Morley of Blackburn, OM, PC (1838 - 1923), Liberal statesman, writer and newspaper editor. Barbara Castle was an MP in Blackburn for 34 years (1945-1979)as well as holding the positions of Secretary of State for Employment and Productivity, First Secretary of State and Secretary of State for Social Services during the Labour governments of the sixties and seventies. Former Foreign Secretary and Leader of the Commons Jack Straw is MP for Blackburn.


 * I'm afraid I agree with cj. The quote above looks like a good example of stuff that shouldn't be in the Blackburn article either (see WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS about deleting entire articles, but it applies here too). It looks slightly neater with the formatting in place at Blackburn, but still has far too much that is tenuous or requires reference. These kinds of information are OK for small towns where their main claim to fame is association with one or two famous people, but are unmaintainable, unverifiable and excessive for larger towns, cities or states. For SA, the list would need to have thousands of people on it, and still have arguments about who else should be in it.


 * Thankyou for being prepared to discuss edits in a mature manner. You might be surprised how often this doesn't happen. --Scott Davis Talk 23:19, 5 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I second what Scott has eloquently put above; that other articles have notable persons sections is not in of itself a valid reason to include one here – or indeed to maintain them elsewhere. --cj | talk 12:12, 6 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I suggest this matter can be resolved by adding a link to the list of Adelaide people- an existing section.Fitzpatrickjm 13:32, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

Geography expansion?
Should not the geography section mention Hallett Cove and Ediacara? Hallett Cove is designated a Geological Monument of world significance which should rate it a mention and Ediacara is a major site almost as sigificant. I wrote a paragraph for each (Hallett Cove 77 words and Ediacara 44) but thought I'd float it here first. Wayne 02:02, 6 May 2007 (UTC)


 * If you've written 44 words, they would probably benefit the Ediacara Hills article itself, and Hallett Cove Conservation Park article has links to it, but doesn't yet exist at all. I'm not sure whether either is really important enough to the state for this article. They perhaps would rate a mention in a Geography of South Australia article, which we appear not to have yet, but would be the partner for Category:Geography of South Australia. --Scott Davis Talk 13:18, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

Added Adelaide Festival of Arts
I have added Adelaide Festival of Arts under See Also Section. Kathleen.wright5 03:11, 15 September 2007 (UTC)

Football Crowds Comments
It is staed that of the South Australian AFL teams that both reguarly draw large crowds. The crows nearly always draw large crowds. While the power occasionally draw slightly above average crowds Squirrelflu 11:14, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

Largest crowd to an Australian Rules Football game in South Australia 66,987 spectators 1976 SANFL Grand Final - Sturt vs Port Adelaide, venue: Football Park, Adelaide I consider this noteworthy. ShearBlue (talk) 11:33, 18 July 2009 (UTC)

SA Flag
The original SA flag was a blue ensign defaced with a disc encompassing Britania meeting the natives. Should this be added to the article? Ozdaren 09:19, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

cringe factor? ShearBlue (talk) 11:00, 18 July 2009 (UTC)

Head of state
I have been directed to the current (July-August 2008) issue of Quadrant. David Flint writes in The Head of State Debate Resolved (p59) about "a hitherto overlooked High Court Case". This is R v Governor of South Australia (1907) in which the High Court in a unanimous decision described the Governor of South Australia as "the Constitutional Head of State" or "Head of State". The court also described the Governor-General as "the Constitutional Head of the Commonwealth". This case has been referred to on four occasions, most recently in 1998. It has never been appealed or overturned. Given that the High Court is the ultimate constitutional authority, it is therefore incorrect to refer to anybody but the State Governor as the Head of a State. --Pete (talk) 09:21, 19 July 2008 (UTC)
 * The case does not state that. It refers to the Governor “as the officiating Constitutional Head of the State” and adds “the Governor must be regarded as acting in the capacity of the Constitutional Head of the State”. The Governor "officiates" and "acts" on behalf of the monarch. See Govenors of South Austalia and Govenors of the Australian states. Also, the Australian Constitution does not deal with the appointment of States Governors - that is a matter for each State. Alan Davidson (talk) 06:56, 26 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Your interpretation does not square with the actual words of the High Court: We do not think that the Governor of a State in the issuing of a writ for the election of senators is acting as agent for the Sovereign in this sense, since the duty imposed by the Constitution is imposed by Statute law and not by delegation from the Sovereign himself. But, as already pointed out, it is a duty cast upon him as Head of the State.


 * The Commonwealth may not have anything to do with the appointment of State Governors, but the High Court is the highest competent authority to rule on matters of law, whether they are at local, State or federal level. You seem to regard other Wikipedia articles as having a higher authority, but you are in error on this point. --Pete (talk) 11:34, 26 July 2008 (UTC)


 * The case dealt with interpreting provisions on the Australian Constitution - which gave the Governor certain power. The appointment of a Governor is not a matter for the Australian Constitution. That is an intra state matter which the High Court was not considering. Clearly there are several comments in the judgment which that refers to the "officiating"; "acts" and "agency". But on this matter, in this case, there can be no precedent. Alan Davidson (talk) 07:00, 27 July 2008 (UTC)


 * I don't want to be rude, but you lost a lot of points with me in your earlier response. You're getting into overdraft territory now. --Pete (talk) 07:13, 27 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Pete - you're not being rude - this is just a debate. Clearly the Queen is the head of state. Section 7 of the Australia Act states "Her Majesty's representative in each State shall be the Governor." and "all powers and functions of Her Majesty in respect of a State are exercisable only by the Governor of the State." This legislation post dates the case. Also, the case interprets only the Australian Constitution. It did not discuss the South Australian Constitution - which among other things requires members of parliament to swear allegience to the current King or Queen and their heirs. (By the way I am a republican). In particular see section 8 of the SA Constitution which gives reserve powers to "his majesty". I am not being obtuse - but what does "overdraft territory" mean. See South Australian Govenor's site, SA Parliament and Parliament Education site. I should add my earlier response was quoting from the case - what was wrong with that? Alan Davidson (talk) 12:52, 27 July 2008 (UTC)
 * In your first response, you attempted to give the impression that the State Governor was merely acting on behalf of the Sovereign. Not only did the High Court not say this, they specifically ruled it out: We do not think that the Governor of a State in the issuing of a writ for the election of senators is acting as agent for the Sovereign. The High Court stated that the Governor is "the Constitutional Head of a State" and the Governor-General is "the officiating Constitutional Head of the Commonwealth". The sense of officiating here is "serving officially", and I direct you to various dictionaries:
 * To perform the duties and functions of an office or a position of authority
 * To perform the duties or function of some office or position
 * to act in an official capacity
 * Perform duties attached to a particular office or place or function
 * All the printed and online sources I can easily access give the same meaning, and none of them give the meaning of "acting on behalf of another", as you imply above.
 * Certainly a Governor or Governor-General is the representative of the Sovereign, but this does not mean that everything they do is on behalf of the Sovereign. They have other duties and functions. The Commonwealth Constitution gives the Governor-General specific powers in his own right, for example. Powers which the Sovereign may not exercise, nor give instructions on, nor amend or revoke. In fact, the powers of the Sovereign have been pretty much pared away to a few tokens, at least in the Commonwealth realm, and the Governor-General's role as representative of the Sovereign is now limited to symbolic or ceremonial functions, while his actual powers in his own right were significant at Federation and have been steadily added to ever since through Commonwealth legislation. As the 1988 Constitutional Commission noted, "Although the Governor-General is the Queen's representative in Australia, the Governor-General is in no sense a delegate of the Queen. The independence of the office is highlighted by changes which have been made in recent years to the Royal instruments relating to it."
 * Finally, please don't give sources of lesser authority than the High Court in pushing your own opinion. If you can find a High Court (or applicable Privy Council) ruling that the Sovereign is the Head of State, then please quote it here. Likewise any legislation explicitly stating the same.
 * I accept that obfuscation and misdirection are useful tools for a lawyer, but using them here will earn you no credits. You are already well into the red, in my opinion. --Pete (talk) 17:31, 27 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Actually we agree, now you have explained your position further. You say "Certainly a Governor or Governor-General is the representative of the Sovereign, but this does not mean that everything they do is on behalf of the Sovereign. They have other duties and functions." Thank you for the clarification. - The legislation is greater authority. And the High Court comments were obiter on this issue in any event. I will leave it at that. Your insults are not appreciated, and did not help this debate. Alan Davidson (talk) 01:41, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I don't think you agree with me at all, and pretending to do so is not helpful here. I stand by my comments. I'm sorry if you take them as insults, but they are my honest observations, based entirely on your contributions above. --Pete (talk) 02:02, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I disagree with user:Skyring(Pete), who as an official member of the Monarchist campaign in Australia, has been involved in changing many other Wikipedia articles to this line of thinking. The mainstream view is that the Queen is Head of State, both of the Commonwealth and the states, and that the governors and Governor General are her representatives.-- Lester  12:54, 3 October 2008 (UTC)
 * True. The Queen is at the top, whether you call that Sovereign or some other expression. The term head of state is an informal expression not used in the constitution (state and federal). Pete clearly states "Certainly a Governor or Governor-General is the representative of the Sovereign..." - but makes the point that the Governor has direct power given by the SA parliament (both points which I truly do agree). But this no more makes the governor head anymore than any of the direct powers given to the state ministers. As for the case - it has been expressed here and elsewhere that on this issue the comments were obiter. Unfortunately this attempt simply shows the inaccuracies of Wikipedia and will not impact the real position, better reflected by the Governor on the Governor's official site and proclamations. Alan Davidson (talk) 14:07, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

hi hamish and andy. how ya going —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.72.22.135 (talk) 05:42, 21 May 2009 (UTC)

Economy
This section seems hodge-podge.

Would someone like to go over and systematise it? ShearBlue (talk) 10:45, 18 July 2009 (UTC)

Native Title POV pushing is also inappropriate.
I am curious to learn how http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=South_Australia&diff=315191714&oldid=315170763 actually mentions Native Title & thus is inappropriate? Why not simply edit rather than undo everything? Seems as the baby is being thrown out with the bathwater?Mifren (talk) 22:36, 21 September 2009 (UTC)

politically innovative and culturally vibrant
Is this promotional text or are there sources? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.140.57.113 (talk) 09:30, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

Japan History
Japan lies of the coast of Asian landmass.If children their is sick their mother will go so the don't fuul behined on any thing.There are over 10,000 people in Japan. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.75.178.202 (talk) 08:36, 2 March 2010 (UTC)

Croweater
Any ideas on how / where to include an explanation of "croweater"? As I understand it, it came about as an eastern-state rumour that the early colony was so poor that the inhabitants had to eat crows.--Yeti Hunter (talk) 06:58, 11 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Never heard of it. When I saw it here I assumed it was somehow related to the demonymn for players in the Adelaide Football Club. Donama (talk) 07:16, 11 October 2011 (UTC)
 * It may also refer to the emblem on the state flag, which looks like a crow on a plate. The ABC website cites the term as first appearing in 1881. By that time the copper boom which had sustained the state was nearing its end with the closure of the Burra mine in 1877 - but I don't know much about the economic history of those times, or about the rivalries between the states prior to Federation. Cheers, Bahudhara (talk) 07:47, 11 October 2011 (UTC)


 * Having thought about it a bit more, it may be an expression of inverse snobbery, resentment or schadenfreude on the part of those in the eastern states regarding the establishment of SA as a planned and convict-free colony with very middle-class values (Adelaide then also being described as the "City of Churches" and as a "paradise of dissent"). The U.S. colloquial expression "to eat crow" means "to be forced to do something humiliating", so it may well have arisen during a time of economic difficulties for the new state - e.g. during the drought which brought a sudden end to the early overly-ambitions agricultural expansion (which in turn lead to the ultimate acceptance of Goyder's Line, first surveyed in 1865). Cheers, Bahudhara (talk) 03:14, 12 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Never heard either. Does this really belong to the infobox ? It seems to be history trivia. --Elekhh (talk) 03:20, 12 October 2011 (UTC)

The Adelaide FC nickname is derived from the common term "croweater" and not vice versa. The State Library of South Australia has some ideas here. The ABC has some ideas here. Further proof that one person's trivia is another person's encyclopedic information - contrary to Elekhh, I think the term merits an article of its own. It is one of a series of veneralble state nicknames (see also Sandgroper, Banana Bender) There was a term for Victorians as well "Gumsuckers" but it has since died. The term "Sydneysider" once meant all New South Welshmen and only later had its meaning restricted. -- Mattinbgn (talk) 05:37, 12 October 2011 (UTC)
 * The refs provided above are easily enough to merit inclusion in the infobox. I'm unsure as to whether a standalone article would be desirable - it would certainly pass GNG but might never progress beyond stub status. Still, there is probably enough information in the above sources plus other newspapers mentioned to make a short article explaining the term in detail that would be inappropriate for the SA article.--Yeti Hunter (talk) 23:03, 12 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Started here--Yeti Hunter (talk) 23:38, 12 October 2011 (UTC)

South Australian borders Section and New Page
Hello, whoever is interested, Have made a few changes to the page in breaking out the South Australian Borders into a new Heading within this page, as I have been working on the Western Australia border article. Hope this is ok and hope to get some other South Australians interested to expand on parts they know of, as I am just a Sandgroper. KHS-Boab (talk) 03:45, 15 January 2012 (UTC)

Free Settling not unique
"The state's origins are unique in Australia as a freely settled, planned British province,[5] rather than as a convict settlement"

I'd propose removing or rephrasing this line, Perth was freely settled in 1829, and there was a settlement at King George Sound (Albany) in 1826. Perth did eventually accept convicts as labour, but that wasn't until the 1850s, which is well after settlement.

JWPJ (talk) 10:10, 18 April 2012 (UTC)

South Australian of the Year Award winners
"Category:South Australian of the Year Award winners" is being deleted per this discussion. It contained the following articles Robert Champion de Crespigny, Rolf de Heer, Robert Gerard, Bill Griggs, Lleyton Hewitt, Janet Mead, Michael Turtur. I'm not sure whether this award is significant enough to be discussed on this article or to have its own article. DexDor (talk) 06:42, 28 April 2013 (UTC)

Australian rules football attendance.
Australian rules football attendance.

I looked at the ABS reference and can't seem to find any support that SA has the highest rate of attendance based off these figures. By some quick calc's it looks like Victoria has 26.1% attendance, South Australia has 24.15% attendance (And next, in order of percentages is Tasmania at 19.49%, WA at 17.53%, NT at 13.31%, ACT at 8.57%, Queensland at 4.56% and lastly New South Wales with only 3.23%). These calculations were performed using ABS derived populations for states from Dec. 2009 (Taken as being a suitable pop. as the attendance figures are supposed to cover 2009-2010) - http://www.abs.gov.au/AUSSTATS/abs@.nsf/allprimarymainfeatures/95D50E396E5AECFCCA2577AC00155848?opendocument.

Happy to be proved wrong - but at least use references that support the argument. If none can be found then I think we should just remove the statement.

Cheers, Kingy. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.45.43.79 (talk) 10:00, 12 October 2013 (UTC)

The State of South Australia
The info box links to States and territories of Australia but the article neither informs, nor confirms for, a reader that the State of New South Wales/ Victoria / Tasmania/ South Australia is the proper name of those states of the Commonwealth of Australia, per the preamble to the Australia Act 1986; and, while section 13 applies specifically to Queensland, and 14 to Western Australia, the other sections apply to all the states generally. States of a federal union may have different names, as in USA, and not all the constituent parts the Commonwealth of Australia are States. Qexigator (talk) 18:40, 23 October 2013 (UTC)

+Discussion continues at Talk:Victoria (Australia). --Qexigator (talk) 14:46, 24 October 2013 (UTC)


 * Note The above discussion is being undertaken at several talk pages. Since all discussions are essentially about the same topic, a centralised discussion has been started at Australian Wikipedians' notice board. Further discussion on this subject should continue there to avoid fragmenting the discussion. -- Aussie Legend  ( ✉ ) 17:08, 24 October 2013 (UTC)

Demographic Chart
Is it possible to get that in regular numbers? The n+03 or whatever it is there is confusing. 74.104.182.106 Busy Moose (talk) 20:28, 5 October 2014 (UTC)

"SA"
The usage and primary topic of is under discussion, see Talk:Sturmabteilung -- 70.51.202.183 (talk) 05:02, 8 June 2015 (UTC)

"SA" and "S.A."
The usage and topic of and  are under discussion, see talk:S.A. (corporation) and talk:S.A. for the multiple discussions. -- 70.51.203.69 (talk) 05:21, 17 June 2015 (UTC)

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Spell fix needed
File:SouthAustraliaRoads.png has Nullarbor spelled "Nullabor". Does anyone have the graphics skills needed to correct it? I don't think I have. Doug butler (talk) 08:25, 4 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Ugh, and Parachilna spelled "Parrachilna" and Lyndhurst "Lyndthurst". Even then, very average MS Paint graphics for what should be a prominent map. It's a raster image, so not easy to incrementally improve it, but making a freely-licensed SVG version from scratch would be a big job. Perhaps OpenStreetMap could be a good resource; does anyone know a good map generating tool to use with it?--Yeti Hunter (talk) 09:12, 4 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Nla.obj-234151847-1.jpg managed a few locator maps a year or so ago, but my computer was not really up to it then, and I haven't replaced it yet, so not ready to offer to do more. We could replace that map in this article with the historic railway map, which is more relevant to the exact placement in the text anyway, but the contrast is poor in the thumb size. --Scott Davis Talk 01:43, 5 July 2016 (UTC)

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