Talk:Southern Vectis/Archive 2008

Note: This is the first archive of Talk:Southern Vectis, and was created on 28 August 2009.

"Tours" or "Breezers"?
Now that the name of "Breezers" has been confirmed in the new timetable, I'm personally happy for the use of "Needles Breezers" etc. in the article. However, I queried Marc Morgan-Huws, the SV manager, with "I have noticed the use of "breezes" in place of "tour" on the timetables. Will this be extended to cover bus stop flags and other signs etc, or will it be limited to the timetables?" They reply was no.

So the question is, as there is a lot of other things to do with the tour other than the timetables, like these bus stop flags and even big signs (!!!) I found on Flickr, does the name stay as "Breezer" or go back to "tour" in the article. Also bear in mind the buses themselves will still show "tour" on their livery. (I don't know about the blinds). -- Thanks, Arriva436 shout!  21:54, 14 March 2008 (UTC)


 * The new website also shows them as "tours" -- Thanks, Arriva436 shout!  22:26, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Size of article
I have noticed that the article has got quite big recently, and according to article size, somethings should be done soon!! Does anyone have any ideas on what we could separate from the main article. Personally I'd move the history onto a new article, with the "Liveries and names" section going too. Does anyone have any other ideas? -- Thanks, Arriva436 shout!  22:46, 14 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Well, no one has said anything, so I have taken some action. The bus stations section has been scaled down, with the full information now on the Transportation on the Isle of Wight article. I think the info is more appropriate there, as Wightbus use the bus stations too, not just SV. -- Thanks, Arriva436 shout!  13:31, 16 March 2008 (UTC)


 * The next thing I have done is to remove the current routes table to List of Southern Vectis bus routes. A lot of big bus companies have separate articles for their routes, such as Transdev Yellow Buses routes. Each article still links to each other in a number of places. If anyone has anything to say, then please feel free to add a comment here, I don't want to feel as though I'm talking to a brick wall! -- Thanks, Arriva436 shout!  17:24, 23 March 2008 (UTC)


 * The changes all look good. I agree with 'History of Southern Vectis'. At the moment, the history is in two places with the main section as well as 'liveries names and previous network' which should all be included. There is a lot of material around on their history as well as a timeline of Southern Vectis through the ages which will also soon be appearing on the new website. Editor5807 (talk) 18:16, 23 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks! The problem with the SV history being in two places here is something I too have noticed, and hopefully it can be fixed! The final change I will make before doing the history is to move the information on the "open top tours" section to its own article, Island Breezers (which was previously a redirect to the section). The means that as well as the main history of all the routes (like the old route numbers etc etc.) each route can have its own history under its own section, as there is far more space to play around with!!! This separate history I got from the "liveries names and previous network".


 * I think that it is worth these being in a separate article, as they can be expanded on a lot but not within the massive Southern Vectis page! After all, if The New Forest Tour can have its own article then why can't four routes?!


 * Since I started re-wording parts of the article (to limit the amount of words used) and page the first separation of info (the bus stations bit), the size of the article has decreased from 54KB to 37KB, something quite impressive in my opinion.


 * To keep all the article together, I've created new category Category:Southern Vectis


 * This is what is says on article size so we're nearly done!
 * > 100 KB - Almost certainly should be divided up
 * > 60 KB - Probably should be divided (although the scope of a topic can sometimes justify the added reading time)
 * > 40 KB - May eventually need to be divided (likelihood goes up with size)
 * < 30 KB - Length alone does not justify division
 * < 1 KB - If an article or list has remained this size for over a couple of months, consider combining it with a related page. -- Thanks, Arriva436 shout!  20:58, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

It'll only initially increase the size of the article, but I've created Template:Isle of Wight Transport which can be applied to this and all related pages - hopefully that will make the article even easier to split up in the future (I'm thinking separate pages for the other 2 bus stations, for example).--Peeky44 (talk) 11:43, 2 April 2008 (UTC)


 * Good idea! I think that also the Newport bus station especially can have a lot of information about its history and the reconstruction (temporary bus lane...) etc. too! -- Arriva436 talk  15:27, 2 April 2008 (UTC)

Premature FAC withdrawn

 * Featured article candidates/Southern Vectis/archive1 Sandy Georgia  (Talk) 16:17, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Templates on route pages
I and Editor5807 seem to be in the process of creating an article on each of (at least) the main routes. Please feel free to contribute to, for example, Southern Vectis route 1. Routes 2 and 7 are also "done". However, they've had 3 templates at the bottom until now, which is a bit overkill as none of them (Template:Isle of Wight Transport, Template:Bus companies in South East England and Template:Bus transport in the United Kingdom ) are hugely relevant. I have followed the advice at Avoid template creep by deleting all the templates and replacing them with Template:Isle of Wight bus routes. We should probably review the templates at the bottom of this main article, but on first glance I'm not sure what could be removed. --Peeky44 (talk) 18:40, 9 August 2008 (UTC)


 * I've just done some changes with the templates. I have removed Template:Isle of Wight box, as it has no real relevance. That left Template:Go-Ahead Bus Companies, Template:Isle of Wight Transport and Template:Bus companies in South East England, which are all relevant. I reordered them so IOW transport goes first, and changed the sate of Go-Ahead to collapsed so it doesn't get in the way. Does anyone else have any other ideas? Arriva436talk 21:03, 22 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I definitely agree...It looks much better now. Editor5807 speak  19:39, 24 September 2008 (UTC)

Assessment
I reckon this is at least B-class, I've contributed a reasonable amount to the article but I think a GA-class rating is not too far off either. It was previously nominated for FA status, very prematurely, but perhaps given some work has been done this rather more meagre aim is reachable. Any feelings as to whether this should be listed at Good article nominations? --Peeky44 (talk) 23:47, 16 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I think it could get their one day. The main problem is the history section, it's too split up. Arriva436talk 20:59, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

The history section is definitely a problem. I think a new article, History of Southern Vectis could help to solve it. This could include all the previous network information, and past liveries. This could then leave a much smaller section on 'names and liveries', with information on the new two-tone green livery and the names of buses. Information on past vehicles could also be added to the new article.

As for the main History section, it should summarise the information in the History of Southern Vectis article. This could be done by moving the Citaro and Scania OmniCity information over to Southern Vectis bus fleet, deleting or moving the information on Ryde Interchange (probably to Transportation on the Isle of Wight) as it is used by Wightbus as well. The information under the 'Today' part of the history section could probably be worked into the summary, showing the present day company performance and growth.

Anyway...It would be good to hear other people's views on this. Editor5807 speak 19:37, 24 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Ok...I have now created the History of Southern Vectis article, and removed much of the split in the history section. The new article still has a few rough edges but I think it has improved the main Southern Vectis article. Editor5807 speak  10:50, 25 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Excellent. It is much clearer now. I may do some minor touching up, but all look great on first impressions. <b style="color:#FF0000;">Arriva436</b><sup style="color:#800080;">talk 15:13, 25 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Agree. This was on a mental 'to do' list, and I now see the bulk of the work is already done!  The main article flows much better now.  Obviously a standalone article on the company's history will need a bit more work, which I'm very happy to help with. --Peeky44 (talk) 18:42, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Good Article?
It was mensioned a while ago by Peeky44 that this article could be nominated for good article status and a lot has been done to improve the article since then. The History section has been summarised in one location, the references have all been standardised and I have been over the entire article looking for any other errors. Does anyone else have any ideas for improvement to the article or whether it could now be ready to be listed at Good article nominations? I've taken a look at the Good article criteria and think it largely meets this. Editor5807 <sup style="color:#4CBB17;">speak 18:49, 10 October 2008 (UTC)


 * I think that the article will soon be able to be listed as a good article. However, I think the sub-articles, especially History of Southern Vectis, may still need a bit of tidying and and more refs so as to make them stand alone articles with good notability, they can't rely on the main one!! Also, will the list of routes be notable enough to not attract attention to it if the main article's a GA. <span style="font-family:Zapfino, Segoe Script;"><b style="color:#FF0000;">Arriva436</b><sup style="color:#800080;><b style="color:#800080;">talk</b>/<b style="color:#800080;">contribs</b> 19:04, 10 October 2008 (UTC)


 * I've just checked, and the history article only has 4 refs! <span style="font-family:Zapfino, Segoe Script;"><b style="color:#FF0000;">Arriva436</b><sup style="color:#800080;><b style="color:#800080;">talk</b>/<b style="color:#800080;">contribs</b> 19:06, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

Bus Depots
There should be a section on the page giving the address of the two bus depots on the island. Does anyone know the addresses? Reply on my talk page Dennisman (talk) 17:03, 21 January 2009 (UTC)


 * No there shouldn't, see What Wikipedia is not. <span style="font-family:Zapfino, Segoe Script;"><b style="color:#FF0000;">Arriva436</b><sup style="color:#800080;><b style="color:#800080;">talk</b>/<b style="color:#800080;">contribs</b> 17:44, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

Sorry, my bad. Dennisman (talk) 10:17, 29 January 2009 (UTC)
 * That said, shouldn't we mention the selling-off of Freshwater garage for housing, and the disgrace that is Ventnor garage sitting empty while nobody wants to buy it? (Irrelevant POV: I can't help thinking that Wightbus should buy it as they start 2 routes in Ventnor...) --Peeky44 (talk) 09:43, 30 January 2009 (UTC)