Talk:Spider-Man: Web of Shadows

Seize Control
I was having a look on the Web of Shadows website & noticed the seize control section where people can vote for what they want in the game. I've added it into this article as well as links to the website, but if I've done something wrong, feel free to change any of it. InfernoSonic 18:22, 16th May 2008 (UTC)
 * Its not really important its more of a trivia thing, and trivia is not allowed on wiki.--Lbrun12415 15:21, 17 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Sorry, Didn't know! I'll try to be more careful next time! InfernoSonic 19:01, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

""Don't be sorry your only trying to help.--Lbrun12415 20:57, 20 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks. InfernoSonic 19:20, 22 May 2008 (UTC)

Speaking of links, the Official Website link leads to a vimeo site with an Unforgettable trailer... I'm not thinkin' that it's the right site.... Can we fix this? I don't know the URL for the official site though. 76.185.93.230 (talk) 19:18, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

Picture
I was thinking of adding a picture of the logo for the article, but I wouldn't know how to get one where I have permission. I thought I should ask in case anyone has any ideas InfernoSonic 18:24, 16th May 2008 (UTC)

New characters
IGN.com has announced the Luke Cage, Vulture and Kingpin, also Venom etc... and Blacked suit Spider-Man how do we add this information. http://media.xbox360.ign.com/media/142/14247561/imgs_1.html .--Lbrun12415 23:44, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

Cite
If someone doesn't begin citing the info within the article soon, i'm going to remove it all.  Skeletal S.L.J.C.O.A.A.A.T.R.  18:39, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Well you can't do that since we sited it before but some one took it off b/c citing the same web site gets confusing. http://www.seizecontrol.com .--Lbrun12415 18:49, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Long time, no see Lbrun. That aside, it's not confusing. Cite all the true info, or i'm afraid that i'll have to remove it. I'll give you 2hrs. K?  Skeletal S.L.J.C.O.A.A.A.T.R.  22:17, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I would do that but I need help with it as I show on many sites there something when you cite thing that go to abcd.... howdo you do that. heres the site http://www.seizecontrol.com . my labtopis dying so i'll try to do it when its charged.

Ok. I'll help.  Skeletal S.L.J.C.O.A.A.A.T.R.  03:39, 16 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm happy to see this article shape up a bit.  Skeletal   S.L.J.C.O.A.A.A.T.R.  14:01, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

Wolverine
He's kind of in the trailer >_>68.230.48.73 (talk)

New characters
Nightcrawler is one source http://forum.seizecontrol.com/us/topic.php?id=782. Also game play is different for PSP meaning its  more of a scolling game.--Lbrun12415 04:39, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Please note that most of the character there were not announced please don't add them unless you have proof, MDI the videogame cast list is not a source.Lbrun12415

Which Characters Are Playable?
Is Spider-Man the only playable character or are there others? 142.26.133.248 (talk) 18:38, 3 November 2008 (UTC) Spider-Man is the only playable character. It wouldn't be Spider-Man Web of Shadows without playing Spider-Man. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.104.186.42 (talk) 21:25, 7 February 2009 (UTC)

S.H.I.E.L.D. Public Service Announcement
Tom Kane recently did the S.H.I.E.L.D.'s Public Service Announcer for the Symbiote Infection in the recent trailer for this game. One of the Stark buildings is in it, so I am unsure if Iron Man will be in it also. Rtkat3 (talk) 1:22, 14 October 2008 (UTC)

Wii Version
I remember seeing somewhere that the Wii version would be a full 3D/freeroamer like the 360/PS3 versions. The fact that all three are coming from the same developer backs this up. Also, this link talks about how controls were translated from the XBox to Wii versions, so that gives even more proof. . 216.236.163.39 (talk) 21:50, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

Plot Summary
Perhaps we could get a full one up by now, its not that long of a game to beat twice. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.74.139.147 (talk) 12:32, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
 * It's not that, it's that Wikipedia isn't a game manual. The plot by Wiki standards should be a short synopsis without spoilers.  All games that have been Featured Articles have this format. -- Teancum (talk) 13:03, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Teancum is right about it being a short synopsis, but it is not acceptable to delete information from an article because you think it spoils the plot. We do not avoid spoilers, and we do not use spoiler warnings.Mr T (Based) (talk) 13:06, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
 * I've seen plenty articles on here with a more detailed plot summary. And a summary generally includes the ending, its a summary of the entire thing. Wikipedia only uses the synopsis(Plot summary designed to wet your tastes, and doesn't include the ending) while waiting for the actual thing to come out. Now that its out we should try and get a good summary out. Look to the Star Wars the Force Unleashed summary for a good example. Its not too detailed, but it gets the basic plot across. It also includes what happens depending on your choice. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.74.139.147 (talk) 13:08, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Also, take a look at These Featured Articles and how they describe the plot. That is what we need to follow, as that's Wiki standard. -- Teancum (talk) 15:18, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
 * And they all have a fairly detailed plot summary with "GASP" an ending and no spoiler tags. I haven't finished the game yet, i only just finished act one so someone else would have to write it up —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.74.139.147 (talk) 16:40, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
 * You got me there, but the bigger point here is that the original plot section was extremely long. 2-4 paragraphs is probably best. -- Teancum (talk) 18:09, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Well then it should still be a fairly detailed plot summary. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.74.139.147 (talk) 11:58, 29 October 2008 (UTC)
 * But that defeats the purpose of a plot summary. The whole point is to get an overview, not a script.  So long as it's kept short and doesn't go into every detail like good/bad choices, etc I don't care.  It just needs to be kept a summary. --Teancum (talk) 12:54, 29 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Does not a summary summarize the game's plot? Perhaps the endings could be a separate section, with the one that would be canon(AKA all red choose MJ) in the plot summary. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.74.139.147 (talk) 13:36, 29 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Works for me, but the issue comes in the fact that the game supposedly has several different endings. --Teancum (talk) 15:38, 29 October 2008 (UTC)

(Moved back to beginning to conserve space)Several games have different endings, and i've seen that some article creators move the non canon ones to a separate section of the article, that could very easily worked
 * The plot section is going to get really long and convoluted at the rate that we're going now. The whole plot shouldn't be any longer than it is right now.  This isn't GameFaqs. --Teancum (talk) 22:09, 29 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Well as it is now, it isn't anywhere near a summary. Also, this is far shorter than the Featured articles you keep boasting about.
 * There's no need to be rude. I looked through 15 of those articles just now and only two of them had long convoluted story sections.  Maybe it's better to make the plot section more like Bioshock's article.  It has the plot section divided into setting and story.  Since the setting is a big part of the game, that may help to break up the section a little more.  Thoughts?  --Teancum (talk) 12:31, 30 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Well first off, wipeout should be gone because that is now a sub par article. Also, i thought it was standard policy to section an articles plot into setting, story, and characters. The endings should still be in the article, albeit in a subsection of plot or their own section. Also Bioshock has a fairly long plot summary.
 * Granted, but Bioshock is a really long game. Really my only beef is to keep it Wiki-esque.  Earlier revisions had every choice in there and I'm sure we weren't very far along in the game at that point.  Maybe it'd be best to build out the section, then split it.  Thoughts? --Teancum (talk) 13:20, 30 October 2008 (UTC)
 * We really should only include the red choices, since Spider-man is a hero and will always choose red. We can put the other endings in a separate section. Before the ones that need black suit just put "If the player choose the black suit path, and did(n't) spurn Black Cat, then at the end of the game..."

We've been tagged. Maybe if we separate the plot/storyline into the acts (Act I, Act II, Act III) it'll be easier to read.

although it would be interesting to know all the possible endings, it would get kinda ridiculous to list all the different combinations of choices... Strobes13 (talk) 05:16, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

Citation for PS2 version
The character list for the PS2 version seems a little bit ridiculous. Can anyone confirm that's not vandalism?
 * I know that the PS2/PSP version has a lot of "Strikers" --> Characters that can be called on for a special attack. I've seen screenshots of about 15 of them total, though I don't know what they are.  It'd be nice to get a source, and even better to put that big fat list into a table. --Teancum (talk) 01:40, 30 October 2008 (UTC)

Reorganized things based on game versions
This helps a number of things:
 * Shortens the article, which kindof gives us more leeway on plot length
 * It keeps features organized per game "type"
 * It allows us to tailor future sections/paragraphs based on version

I'd say for now that we augtha keep the characters table as-is, since lots of those characters carry over to other systems and two tables would get sortof convoluted. --Teancum (talk) 14:34, 31 October 2008 (UTC)

The plot -- again
The size it is now is fine, we have both plots down to around 5-6 paragraphs and we have an alternate ending guide. Technically we probably aught to trim it some more, but at this point it's tough to do so. But please don't add all the red/black suit choices again Wikipedia is not a game manual. That's what GameFaqs is for. --Teancum (talk) 06:25, 9 November 2008 (UTC)

Reception
Of the 10 or so reviews given, 4 have 6.5 or lower, and one is a C+. It's only fair to say that it received mixed reviews, since in most cases a 7/10 is considered fair, so those lower scores are below fair. The game may be awesome to consumers, but the fact of the matter is that not all critics agreed. Even if an argument were made that more of the reviews were positive, it's still not a vast majority, and this can't be biased. --Teancum (talk) 13:35, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

Endings
Aren't there supposed to be 4 endings, because I know of the two already listed, but I'm pretty sure there are two more based on the last two path choices, like you get Black Cat to MJ on the hovercraft and kill Venom, or infect Black Cat with the symbiote and save Venom. The two listed are all red choices and black choices.12.37.71.171 (talk) 05:17, 11 November 2008 (UTC)


 * The final choice, as far as I know, has no influence on the end sequence. The 4 Wii endings are:

1. 100% Good: (Give Black Cat to MJ and finish game with Red Allignment)

Spider-Man is sitting on a roof narrating the events of the game to himself. MJ walks up to him and they go swinging through the city.

2. 50% Good: (Infect Black Cat with symbiote and finish game with Red Allignment)

Spider-Man calls MJ on his cell phone and apologizes to her for what he did before walking away forlornly.

3. 50% Evil: (Give Black Cat to MJ and finish game with Black Allignment)

Symbiote Spider-Man is standing on a rooftop angrily monologuing about MJ rejecting him, and then says he will take her back no matter what and that no one would dare say no to him again as the symbiotes roar up at him.

The Tinkerer, Black Widow, and Kingpin are standing on the roof of Fisk Tower. A VTOL arrives with a steel crate containing Symbiote Wolverine. Black Widow sends him to capture Spider-Man dead or alive, and Symbiote Wolverine decides to kill him.

4. 100% Evil: (Infect Black Cat with symbiote and finish game with Black Allignment)

Symbiote Spider-Man and Symbiote Black Cat are standing on a roof top talking about their plans for the city. Spider-Man reminisces about Uncle Ben's "With great power comes great responsability," speech and then says that he had no idea what true power was until that moment as the symbiotes roar up at them.

The Tinkerer, Black Widow, and Kingpin are standing on the roof of Fisk Tower. A VTOL arrives with a steel crate containing Symbiote Wolverine. Black Widow sends him to capture Spider-Man dead or alive, and Symbiote Wolverine decides to kill him. 75.157.122.154 (talk) 04:29, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

Endings and Spoiler Alerts
I think it's okay to list how many and how to get alternate endings, I don't think it's alright to list what the different endings are. At least put a spoiler alert. I'm going to edit this to say "there are 4 endings depending on the choices made, feel free to edit, but please, have the courtesy to at least spoiler alert people.Bridger.anderson (talk) 07:37, 13 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia doesn't use spoiler warnings.Mr T (Based) (talk) 07:39, 13 November 2008 (UTC)
 * How to get an alternate ending is game guide content, which isn't suitable for Wikipedia. This is an encyclopedia, not a place for help with the game. RobJ1981 (talk) 06:02, 14 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I agree, Wikipedia doesn't use spoilers nor does it contain game guide content. Looking around, I see no other games where it lists specifically what the alternate endings are. (i.e Fable, Shadow the Hedgehog) What makes this game so special that the alternate endings for this particular game get spelled out?Bridger.anderson (talk) 18:26, 14 November 2008 (UTC)

Yep, if endings are added the most canonical ending should be the only one. As Spider-Man is a hero, that would likely be an ending that's red-suited. --Teancum (talk) 18:26, 14 November 2008 (UTC)
 * There's 2 Red Suit endings, one with MJ and one without. 75.157.122.154 (talk) 04:30, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
 * It is true that there are 2 red suited endings, however only one of them is the result of being the most canonical.Bridger.anderson (talk) 18:47, 21 April 2009 (UTC)

Plot issues still
Are the versions that different, besides the plot? If they are: make a seperate page for the PS2/PSP games. Perhaps call it Spider-Man: Web of Shadows - Amazing Allies Edition. Otherwise: CONDENSE the plot. Talking about different versions is just fine, but when a majority of the article is just plot details, it's a problem. Plot summary: not a plot guide to much of the game. RobJ1981 (talk) 19:56, 21 November 2008 (UTC)
 * If we do that it'll get merged again anyways. All other articles that have two totally different versions of the same game ended up getting merged / never being split in the first place.  The harder part will be convincing people that the plot summary needs to be 1-3 paragraphs, explaining the general idea, not hitting every point of the story. --Teancum (talk) 20:38, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

Nomination for Good Article status
Since we have a complete Nintendo DS section I have nominated this article for Good Article status --Teancum (talk) 15:48, 30 December 2008 (UTC)

Shortened Plot
I tried writing my own plot summary, how's this?

Plot
During a flashback to four days earlier, Spider-Man retells his account of how his encounter with Venom ended with the symbiote partially binding to himself.

After the fight with Venom, Spider-Man meets Luke Cage during a gang drive by shooting. Spider-Man is then trained by Luke Cage and assists him in cleaning up the streets and in arranging a peaceful meeting between gang leaders.

Spider-Man discovers high tech assassins on the roofs of the meeting place of the gang leaders. He traces the assassins back to the Kingpin. After a few encounters with the Kingpin’s gang, Spider-Man and the Kingpin's henchmen are attacked by symbiote controlled citizens of New York City. The police soon arrive and Spider-Man is witnessed throwing a symbiote controlled person off of a building and is then considered to be a murderer.

Wolverine, thinking Spider-Man to be possed by a symbiote, tracks down and confronts Spider-Man. After a brief battle, the two begin tracking down infected citizens. Eventually Spider-Man finds Venom throwing people into symbiote pods. After the pods are destroyed, S.H.I.E.L.D. comes and quarantines New York and setups up quarantine camps. Electro attacks a camp, finds his sister who is symbiote controlled, and then Electro himself infected attempting to help his sister.

Spider-Man decides that the only way to save New York is to break the Tinkerer out of prison. Upon reaching the prison, Ryker's Island, Spider-Man frees the Rhino, disables the prison units, and escapes with the Tinkerer. The Tinkerer designs a device to be installed on the Trask building that removes the symbiotes from their hosts without harming the citizens of New York. After defeating symbiote controlled versions of Wolverine, Electro, the Black Cat, and the Vulture, Spider-Man activates the device, looses his own symbiote, and then responds to an attack on the S.H.I.E.L.D. Helicarrier by the remaining symbiotes.

After setting bombs to destroy the Helicarrier, a giant five headed version of Venom attacks. Spider-Man is able to destroy four of the heads, and calls on Brock to try and assist with destroying the symbiotes. Brock sacrifices himself, weakens the symbiote monster and the Helicarrier explodes.

Several days after the explosion of the Helicarrier, Spider-Man then reflects over the events of the last several days with Mary Jane Watson at his side.

The current version contains every last point of the story. I didn't even bother mentioning Moon Knight, nor did I think it was necessary to include Peter's phone calls to whoever. Bridger.anderson (talk) 22:08, 16 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Updated the plot, and included links to characters/places. I'm going to put up this version. It's 400 words, which beats the HUGE summary that is up now. Feel free to reword.Bridger.anderson (talk) 18:25, 21 April 2009 (UTC)


 * I believe that a more ending-neutral approach would be called for in such a game as this one. While you may be right that the previous plot summary was a little long-winded, yours only encompases the 100% good ending.  142.26.133.248 (talk) 18:53, 28 April 2009 (UTC)


 * It's pretty standard on Wikipedia to only include the canon plot line for a game. --Teancum (talk) 21:25, 28 April 2009 (UTC)


 * Especially when our character is "biased" in the sense that he is a hero and is on the good side.Bridger.anderson (talk) 17:31, 5 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Canon? How does a game with multiple endings have a canon ending.  The 100% is not confirmed as the canon ending, even though Bridger.anderson is right in that it is the most likely ending.  But then again, Peter and Venom merged to become Poison in What If: THe Other, didn't they?  And besides, look at the Soul Calibur franchise.  The majority of the games have multiple endings, and NONE of them are canon! While agree that the summary was too long, I still say we should use a neutral plot summary. 75.157.92.36 (talk) 04:09, 6 May 2009 (UTC)


 * 1) Um, well to get non-100% you have to do evil things, so I don't follow how "The 100% is not confirmed as the canon ending". I've beaten the game 4x, gotten all the endings, what do you require as confirmation? 2) So the current argument is that Spider-man is a hero and that's why we selected the ending that was the most canonical. I presume the different endings to Soul Caliber are from endings with different characters (I haven't played that game in a while, correct me if I'm wrong). Here we have only 1 character, and we picked the ending that most likely represented that character.Bridger.anderson (talk) 16:59, 13 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Fair enough. I give in.  You're right. 75.157.70.71 (talk) 03:25, 27 July 2009 (UTC)

Agh, I noticed every few weeks some new user comes along, adds back in the choices and every little detail of the story and completely ignors what has been discussed on this page. I guess I shouldn't be surprised, a big sign saying "Welcome to Wikipedia" is flashing in my mind. It'd be more helpful if they would actually take the time to rewrite the plot for the other platforms.Bridger.anderson (talk) 18:03, 14 August 2009 (UTC)


 * I added brief mentions of Moon Knight & Black Cat and a brief splurge on the game's intro. Nothing much, no details, just a quick mention, 'cause I felt they were important details to add. 75.157.107.206 (talk) 05:25, 8 September 2009 (UTC)


 * Looks great. Later on I'll add the links to Moon Knight.Bridger.anderson (talk) 17:31, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

ending no. 4
I know three of the four endings, but if I put them on, I should have all four at once. Does anyone know the black suit ending WITHOUT symbiote black cat? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Yu56lercvfuyijmhkyudyg (talk • contribs) 03:10, 23 January 2009 (UTC)
 * We aren't adding the endings since Wikipedia is not a game guide. That's why we leave it at Venom committing suicide. --Teancum (talk) 10:51, 23 January 2009 (UTC)
 * In the Black Suited choice ending Spider-Man kills him, so Venom comitting suicide doesn't fit with your prior statement. 142.26.133.248 (talk) 20:01, 3 February 2009 (UTC)
 * As we discussed in a section above, we aren't including all choices in the game, we're going with the most canonical ending, in which Venom kills himself, not the ending where Spider-man kills him. The endings were once listed in detail, but taken down because Wikipedia is not a game guide.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 153.90.112.83 (talk) 02:08, 8 February 2009 (UTC)

We should leave it with a neutral ending statement, the way it is currently. 142.26.133.248 (talk) 17:26, 16 April 2009 (UTC)

Even though it's not canonical, shouldn't we mention that the plot could be drastically different based on the player's choices? The 4th ending doesn't even MENTION Mary Jane.--70.171.13.13 (talk) 00:27, 12 June 2009 (UTC)
 * That the game has different endings is mentioned under features. Also see above discussion.153.90.84.212 (talk) 01:24, 28 June 2009 (UTC)

Someone added the endings in again... Keep or revert?
A lot of you seem to think that the article should not include a summary of the four possible endings, and a lot of you seem to think we should add a summary of the four possible endings. Well, someone's gone and added such a summary, so what should we do about it? 75.157.120.15 (talk) 00:48, 23 July 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep on removing it.... can we possibly revert back to a version that doesn't include all the choices and lock the page? I see that every time some throws alt endings in yet again, it's always from an IP, never an account. Let's lock it so they have to login.69.226.34.72 (talk) 10:12, 13 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Checked back here after about a year, it appears the "debate" about what to add hasn't gone anywhere, but someone just comes along and adds in every last detail of every possible choice w/o discussing.

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