Talk:St. Louis University High School

Assess
Good "start" but lacks references. For instance who knows if the alumni is correct (wiki is not a great reference). However påics are good. Welcome. Victuallers 11:33, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

What are "paics"? Patke@sluh.org 15:27, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

The Quizbowl Program
Someone needs to take out the stuff about SLUH's quizbowl program winning districts, because they are in a really easy district, their team is no good, and any time they play a decent team they get plain old spanked.

Sounds hostile! The quizbowl team has won medals in numerous events, however, including the state competiton and the Washington University High School Academic Challenge. Also, in 2005, they came within one game of winning the state title. M.manary 15:09, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

On that vibe, as I am unable to figure out who wrote the above comment, I will continue to contribute on the successes of SLUH's quiz bowl and math teams. If you want to discuss, please talk to me. M.manary 15:12, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

http://sugroups.wustl.edu/~collbowl/wuhsac.html and more specifically http://sugroups.wustl.edu/~collbowl/WUHSAC9_standings.html very, very strongly suggest that we were accurate in thinking Charles/NKC would be way too much for SLUH to handle. 490-140, that warrants the word spank. Oh, but SLUH, a Jesuit prep school, couldn't possibly lose something involving intellect to that urban sounding North Kansas City. (We actually forgot about this page until we saw the matchup on the stats page. Fun times!)SBI 09:37, 25 March 2007 (UTC)

Note - Played NKC for state this year, new we'd lose but still we can't be that bad, right? We were very close the first game, until the fourth round. M.manary 19:03, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

Dooley
Is Dr. Dooley a recipient of the Congressional Medal of Honor? His bio page here on wikipedia mentions only that he was awarded the Congressional Gold Medal. There is a significant difference in the awards and it should be cleared up if anyone has any info.

He was awarded the "Congressional Gold Medal of Honor" which is commonly referred as the "Congressional Medal of Honor".

No, the page was correct. A Congressional Gold Medal and the Congressional Medal of Honor are different medals. One is awarded for gallantry in combat and the other for being a great citizen of the U.S. Dooley was awarded the Gold Medal from Congress for his humanitarian work and not a feat of bravery in combat. 129.33.119.12 20:17, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

More on V2000
I added another dissenting viewpoint to the V2K section. I hope it makes the opposing side a little more legitimate. The paragraph seemed to blow off concerns over the project as trivial.

Verification
someone familiar with the subject, please verify all edits by 67.106.94.3 (has a history of vandalism) Jens Nielsen 14:45, 25 January 2006 (UTC)
 * I have looked at this user's contributions. . .the ones about noteable alumni all seem to be accurate, though I am unfamiliar with the soccer player. I have not been able to verify the edits about the ACT scores for the class of 2006, but am working on it.  TMS63112 16:20, 25 January 2006 (UTC)


 * I found an article in a Jesuit newsletter that confirms at least three memebers of the class of '06 scored a 36 on the ACT.   TMS63112 20:09, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

The ACT scores are legit. Look up the St. Louis Review and many other local television and print media sources. It is almost too impressive to be true, but it is... 129.33.119.12 20:19, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

The IP in question is from the school itself
The IP address that is the source of some of the vandalism is the public IP for the school. They may be students at a prestigious, selective private high school, but they're still teen-age boys.

I think the addition of the sports and rivalries section needs some cleaning up. Its a bit long and perhaps a bit too detailed. I plan to clean that up when I can get to it.


 * Seems likely that the IP is used by multiple students, some of whom are making useful contributions, some of who are vandalising. TMS63112 04:56, 27 January 2006 (UTC)


 * There is thus far much less vandalism from this school than I see from many when doing recent change patrol, but even one bad apple can do a lot of harm, and a handful can wreak havoc.


 * I did an initial cleanup of the sports stuff when it first appeared, but it looks much better now. Thanks.  --Kbh3rd talk  05:19, 27 January 2006 (UTC)

WikiProject Schools
Take a look at that project for ideas on improving this article. --Kbh3rd talk 04:44, 16 February 2006 (UTC)

Unsure of the "Uproar" over Vision 2000
The paragraph about the supposed "uproar" over the athletic facilities constructed through the Vision 2000 Campaign gives me concern. I work at the school, and I dispute that the construction has caused an "uproar." Some have been critical, true, but the complaints have hardly risen to the level of an uproar. Most of the complaints have been from students grumbling about the extra distance they'll have to walk from their parking lot to the school entrance. One faculty member called the campaign the "no athlete left behind" plan, but less than 20% of the money raised went to athletics. Those changes are simply the most visible.

I also dispute that the school's weekly newspaper, the Prep News, has taken an "anti-Vision 2000" stance as the article suggests. To the contrary, I believe their articles about the new expansion have been quite positive.

I plan to edit that portion of the article, but wanted to post first to offer others the chance to comment.

I go to the school and am a Senior this year. I would contend that there is a general disinterest or even disliking of V2000, but also that any contributions on the subject should wait till the changes are actually finished. M.manary 15:20, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

Buzz
I believe that the details of Buzz Westfall's tenure belong in the Buzz Westfall article. It should suffice here to simply state "7-term county executive" or something to that effect. The dates of his terms and even that he served the longest to date are not really germane to this topic. It's a matter of proper style and organization of information. --Kbh3rd talk 17:19, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

Sounds good to me. - Patke

Notable Alumni
Removed...issue resolved Patke@sluh.org 20:09, 7 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Are there guidelines somwehere for what constitutes "notable" when building a list of alumni such as this? In particular I wonder about those with no Wikipedia article, such as Jack Boehm and Keith C. Schwab.  I'm sure the alumni rolls include many, many corporate executives and college professors.  What makes associate professor Schwab more notable than, say, Bob Scherrer ('77), chairman of physics and astronomy at Vanderbilt, and author?  Not to pick on these two (Boehm and Schwab) in particular, but there is nothing to indicate what's notable about them.  Is the standard that they should be notable enough to warrant a separate Wikipedia article, and if so, should such an article be created first, at least as a stub?  Are all the tens of thousands of former corporate CEOs considered "notable" just for that, or is something particularly notable about their accomplishments in that position required?  Likewise, does the mere act of receiving university tenure make one notable? --Kbh3rd talk  17:19, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

I struggle with this issue myself. I placed many of the names on this list, but not all. IMO, being a CEO of a MAJOR public corporation (i.e., a member of the Fortune 500) is certainly notable. There are certainly not "tens of thousands" of these people...likely only 2 or 3 thousand in recent history. I think that's notable. What about elected officials? Where is the line drawn? Certainly a state governor or a U.S. congressman is notable...but what about a state senator or state rep? To address your examples, I support the inclusion of Boehm (former Valvoline CEO) but not the inclusion of Schwab. However, I did not object to Schwab's inclusion enough to remove him, and thus potentially offend an alumnus. I work in alumni relations at SLUH and so I am very sensitive to that. But to add every tenured professor at every university would perhaps "water down" the list. I dunno...no easy answers.Patke@sluh.org 19:50, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

As part of a cleanup today, I removed a couple of names that were recently added. Both were scientists. I removed them very reluctantly, but I did so in an effort to establish some consistency. One was a researcher in the field of sicle cell anemia. But he is an associate professor, not a full professor. So, per the above discussion, I removed him. The other is a marine biologist who is a supervisor of an aquarium in NYC. I'm looking into that a bit further. Please speak up if you have any suggestions for guidelines in this area. I'm really uncomfortable as the arbitor of who is "notable" and who is not...looking for some help. Patke@sluh.org 16:24, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

I find it striking that for a school which puts so much emphasis on scholarship and service, the wikipedia listings emphasize alumni active in media and athletics, most of whom are not so very notable. For a school that is nearly 200 years old, surely there must be more notable scientists, scholars, humanitarians, and others who could be listed.R. Nozick (talk) 08:14, 16 January 2011 (UTC)


 * came across this bio and saw he supposedly attended SLU until dropping out at 16 - could is be that he was actually attending SLUH instead? Just dropping off his name here but need to follow up with more research:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_R._Stettinius,_Sr. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.173.47.176 (talk) 15:04, 20 June 2012 (UTC)

Thank you for the recommendation, but I am not able to confirm that he is an alumnus. Perhaps someone else can do so. I have tried to make some improvements, here and there; a few other persons have as well. But I am still surprised that so much attention is devoted to entertainment and athletics. SLUH likes to present itself as emphasizing scholarship and service, but it comes across, in many respects, as giving the same degree of exaggerated attention to shallow and superficial adolescent enthusiasms as most other high schools.R. Nozick (talk) 10:14, 7 September 2012 (UTC)

Organization of alumni
I have made a working example of a copy of the notable alumni section organized by field at User:Kbh3rd/Alumni. See what you think, and feel free to edit that page. I'm not certain that doing this would be for the best and am interested in your others' opinions. --Kbh3rd talk 15:10, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Initial organization
I've gone and implemented the organization, having received positive feedback elsewhere from a respected editor of this page.

This classification scheme is probably not perfect. Please show proposed reclassifications on this project page. One problem that rather jumps out at me is Henry Hampton, who fell under Entertainment because of the "filmmaker" description. Entertainment probably doesn't fit him, but I don't think a Documentary Filmmaker section should be created just for him. Suggestions welcome. --Kbh3rd talk 21:00, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

I, too, am concerned about Henry Hampton's inclusion in the "entertainment" category. Perhaps a category could be created entitled "Humanitarianism/Activism" or something along those lines. The category could include Dooley, Hampton, and perhaps Harrington. The three of them are all notable because of they worked to help others...to bring attention to the plight of the poor and/or oppressed. They each did it in different ways (Harrington and Dooley, in particular, were at the opposite ends of the idealogical spectrum, but each was fighting the same basic fight in his own way). I suggest we come up with a category name that captures that idea and include these 3 names. Any ideas beyond "Humanitarianism/Activism"? Patke@sluh.org 15:50, 31 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I think "Humanitarianism/Activism" should work, though would like to see if anyone else comes up with something even better. Humanitarianism itself wouldn't cover it.  And I agree that would be a more accurate category than Medicine for Dooley.  (Do the freshmen still read his book?) --Kbh3rd talk  19:06, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Edits by 68.94.92.101: Schenkenberg & Clark
I meant only to remove the "'83" from Clark's mention as Dean of Students, but the revert button removed all of 68.94.92.101's edits. However, I can't find a dean of students on the school website, and Dr. Schenkenberg's retirement is not mentioned. Even if announced, it doesn't need a parenthetical remark in the infobox, IMHO -- just change the name after the fact. --Kbh3rd talk 14:41, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

I believe Mr. Clark's official title is "Asst. Principal for Student Welfare and Discipline," but he is often referred to as the "Dean of Students." Either way, I think the info box should list only the executive postitions of Principal and President. Otherwise, where does one draw the line? If we list Clark, then should we also list the other two Assistant Principals? What about the two Vice Presidents? Mr. Clark is simply the most visible to students, and I suspect that is why his name was added by a well-intentioned editor. Patke@sluh.org (talk) 15:04, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

Saint?
Is there any particular reason why this article is titled using "Saint" rather than "St.", whereas everywhere else within the article other than the title uses "St.", as does the school's own website? I'd love to move the page to St. Louis University High School and reverse the redirect, but I just had a weird sense that there's a backstory here ... Mlaffs (talk) 12:51, 21 March 2008 (UTC)


 * The only backstory I'm aware of is that the school is officially registered as a not-for-profit corporation with the word "saint" spelled out. But since it is commonly abbreviated, I think we should proceed as you suggest and re-title the article.  Even the official school seal says "St. Louis University High." Patke@sluh.org (talk) 21:58, 7 April 2008 (UTC)


 * I believe that the school takes its name from the university which takes its name from the city, not directly from the saint; the city, of course, is named after the saint. Because the high school takes its name from the university, it would make perfect sense for both of those articles to adopt the same usage.  Paradoxically, the university article uses "Saint", wherease the city article uses "St."  Given my logic it would make more sense for it to be the other way around, if different at all.  I believe that this issue has been hashed through on the talk pages of both of those articles; if so, the editors of those two pages came to opposite resolutions.  Perhaps a reading of those conversations, if they exist, could shorten the discussion here.  I do believe that consistency argues for common usage here and in the university article. --Kbh3rd talk  02:41, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

All of SLUH's literature uses St., including the web site and the official seal. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 18.139.6.114 (talk) 00:39, 8 May 2008 (UTC)

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Hyland
did Robert Hyland's father, the famous physician, also attend SLUH? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 140.233.137.186 (talk) 20:12, 19 July 2009 (UTC)

Fr. Hagan is rolling over
There are (at least, were) only 2 billiard tables not 20+. The others are (pocket) pool and snooker tables. Billiard tables have no pockets. 207.178.249.226 (talk) 17:30, 29 August 2012 (UTC)

Notable alumni listing
To answer the above question, yes there are standards for an alumni list. Anyone on it has to meet the Wikipedia standard for notability for biographical articles found at WP:BIO. That means either they have to have an existing Wikipedia article, which shows that they have met the standard, or, enough referencing to independent, reliable sources to meet the standard at WP:BIO and be able to create one. You don't have to create an article to include someone, you just have to have adequate referencing to create one. Note that referencing to the school is not enough (not independent). Who's who is not a reliable source. A corporate website is not an independent reference for an employee of the company. (note that most CEO's are not notable). Notability does not equal fame or importance. It means that reliable secondary sources are writing about a subject in detail. An encyclopedia is by definition a tertiary source. It only covers what secondary sources are writing about.

I have trimmed out all the ones without adequate secondary referencing. Warner may be ok, but I do not see adequate referencing (or in many cases, any referencing) on the others I have removed. Please do not replace them without better references. Gtwfan52 (talk) 03:40, 24 August 2013 (UTC)


 * I won't quibble about having a Wiki page. Strikes me as silly, since anyone can have a Wiki page, but I'll let that go.  Beyond that, now case by case: (1) So you now concede Jack Warner, which I guess means you didn't check this carefully the first time through.  Since you make sweeping eliminations, I suspect you haven't checked the others carefully.  I recommend that you eliminate one-by-one, state your rationale for each, and then we deal with them individually.  (2) The scholars and scientists could all be backed up with detailed resumes.  Not hard to do.  Some references already included, but you seem to have ignored those.  Of course they are not discussed as much as many others, e.g. pop entertainers, but then you seem to be taking fame as the measure of notability.  I suspect you do not really want to take that step.  Please eliminate, one-by-one, those that you suspect, and avoid the quick-and-easy sweeping elimination.  I'll then take a look at each one, as well as your rationale for elimination, and if it seems warranted, I'll check to see whether the reference section can be appropriately supplemented.Berthold11 (talk) 04:10, 24 August 2013 (UTC)
 * See your talk page, User:Berthold11. When you are ready to have a reasonable discussion and have learned what you need to know to have it, I will be happy to discuss the content of the article here. Gtwfan52 (talk) 16:27, 24 August 2013 (UTC)

Promotional and over-detailed
This article is beginning to  sound promotional  in  parts. To avoid more 'meat-cleaver' pruning, -  which  may  even come from  me, please see WP:WPSCH/AG. Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 11:18, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

Except for the unveiled threat, thanks. You seem like a well-intended person. As I see it, wikipedia is the problem. But then I made that point elsewhere. I tried to be constructive and found it frustrating that people who advertise themselves as editors eliminate indiscriminately. I believe you understand my objections, but I cannot spend any more time on this. So I hereby say goodbye to you and wikipedia. I suppose you have a vision of how wikipedia will somehow make the world better. For those reasons that I have recorded elsewhere, I respectfully disagree. But I wish you well. It would be a sin to wish the failure of any vision of a better world.Questpq (talk) 16:25, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

External links modified
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Logo is atrocious
can we get a logo that has better resolution? The one there now is pixelated. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 199.111.227.15 (talk) 14:22, 30 March 2018 (UTC)