Talk:St. Michael's College School/Archive 1

The Blue Herald
I have recently added some material about the Blue Herald that had been removed before. This information pertains to the lack of independence it has and it's notorious on again/off again status within the school. The point is that, having worked closely with the Blue Herald during my time at SMC, I wittnessed it first hand when certain staff members, who shall remain anonyms, heavily edited the articles or changed photos so as not to create controversy. I feel that this is important information about the school's newspaper. Please feel free to comment.

Non-Sport Related Events
Although the school has a superb history of sporting victories, as an alumnist I must say that other groups were hardly appreciated or given any focus to. Only recently have the Arts and Sciences clubs/departments received long overdue funding, facilities and administrative support. So let me make the intent of this comment clear: the sports are great but the school truly needs to expand its horizons and dominate other aspects of academia.

Too Subjective
I have deleted (a good) portion of article since it does not fit with the wikipedia standard. The article is WAY too subjective.

Re: Too Subjective
I agree, although you did tear out a large portion of information that should have been left. Someone also decided to remove the robotics description, which should be there. The robotics club (which had its name changed) should be described as it was one of the largest non-athletic programs the school supported.

Sick and tired of stupid additions
I'd ask that those who add information to the St. Michael's College article keep it strictly objective. In the past few days there has been a flood of rude and subjective comments that degrade the schools image. Since this is a public outlet, those people wishing to express their emotional distress should write them in this particular discussion page. The article itself is to remain purely a description of the school minus any current events, news updates etc. Please keep these in line with the Wikipedia standard.

To keep the article in line with Wikipedia standards I removed the following disclaimer:


 * == Article Editing Disclaimer ==


 * This article has recently had overly subjective/degrading changes in the content. We ask that before you modify anything that you understand the rules and guidelines under Wikipedia. As a general rule please keep all subjective comments in the Discussion page (located above the article title). Also remember that this page is only a description of the school not a news outlet regarding school events. If you wish please include those in the Discussion article as well.


 * We hope you will respect these wishes.

This disclaimer is both subjective and non-encyclopedic. The Talk page is where it should be, as it says itself. I'm not unsympathetic – vandalism is a constant annoyance here. However, this is not the way to deal with it. At least i don;t think it is – I'll go check. John FitzGerald 04:23, 18 November 2005 (UTC)

Oky, I checked – here's Wikipedia policy:

To: John FitzGerald
I agree that's much better than the disclaimer addition I made. I'm not familiar with Wiki syntax yet so I wasn't aware these tags were available - I guess I should have read the policy in full detail before posting. Either way this is much better.

When I have the time I plan on replacing the crest image once again - I have a high-resolution version on one of my hard drives. I'll reduce it and thus get rid of the fuzzy look.

If possible (and if there are willing Wiki editors) it would be nice to see the following sections added: a list of notable alumni (aside from the athletes), the school mascot, the schools relationship with the St. Michael's Majors etc. It would be nice to see a few more photos up there as well.

Also if you don't know UCC also has a Wiki entry, take a look.

Cheers,

Dave

Make a separate page for St. Mike's and the NHL
I agree that the "notable alumni" should include all notable alumni from different fields, not just hockey. Also, you do not need to list everybody with the main article, you can have a separate article. UCC's wiki page does that. It lists just a few of the very most prominent with the main article and then has a separate page for the complete list. We could have, for example, the most prominent NHL players, ie. Lindsay, Mahovolich, Red Kelly, Eric Lindros on the main page, along with other non-hockey prominent alumni, and have a separate wiki page like "St. Mike's and the NHL" with the complete list of St.Mike's players who went on to play in the NHL. Brett Lindros can be on that list. The list with the main article should be for only the most well known and accomplished. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.24.190.9 (talk • contribs)

re: alumni/Lindros
I thought Lindros only played for the hockey team, but was never actually a student at St. Mike's. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.49.232.10 (talk) 01:28, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

-update (Feb 28, 2010) - confirmed. Lindros was not an alumnus of SMC as he did not attend the actual school; he only played for the hockey team. Therefore removed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.204.19.77 (talk) 04:38, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

Added Cesare Maniago to alumni, possible others to add, Lindros
I added Cesare Maniago, He attended St Michael's in the mid to late 1950s, played in the NHL for 18 years. Thought he's notable.

I don't know if any of these attended the school, I know they played for the hockey team. If anyone can confirm and add as found:

Tim Brent, Arnie Brown, Ed Chadwick, Gerry Cheevers, Paul Conlin, Les Costello, Murray Costello, Kevin Dineen, Dick Duff, Ray Hannigan, Larry Keenan, Ken Klee, David Keon, Ted Lindsay, Barry MacKenzie, John McCormack, Jim McKenny, Gerry Odrowski, Mark Osbourne, Mark Popovic, Rod Seiling, Kevin Weekes, and Benny Woit.

Says above that Lindros didn't attend the school and was deleted from the article; I don't know if that refers to Eric Lindros or not, but someone added him. I don't know if he attended so I won't delete it.

I placed the names in alphabetical order, seems to be easier to find names and add/delete as needed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 154.20.13.137 (talk) 11:36, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

-ERIC LINDROS DID NOT ATTEND ST. MIKE's. HE ONLY PLAYED FOR THE HOCKEY TEAM!!! I will have to delete him yet again. If you don't believe this, you can ask any of the faculty at St. Mike's like Fr. Zinger. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.51.113.235 (talk) 03:22, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

Inclusion of school type, gender, and religious information for HNMCS
There have been repeated deletions by Mikeycanuck (aka 99.254.17.230) which remove pertinent information about Holy Name of Mary College School (HNMCS) from this article. The two schools are brother and sister schools, and as per the History section in the HNMCS article, "The Felician Sisters and St. Michael's College School co-founded the independent Holy Name of Mary College School". As such, it is appropriate to contain some basic information about HNMCS in this article and in the same way, to include some basic information about SMCS in the Holy Name of Mary College School article. The inclusion of the school type (independent), gender (all-girls), and religious information (Catholic) of Holy Name of Mary College School in this article, is meant to illustrate the parallels to the school type (private), gender (all-boys), and religious information (Catholic) of St. Michael's College School.174.89.27.124 (talk) 06:26, 21 June 2011 (UTC)

I don't agree that it is relevant information to give these details about Holy Name on the SMCS wiki. People reading the SMCS page quickly learn that Holy Name of Mary is the official sister school, and that it must be an all-girls school. That Holy Name is Catholic or private is also irrelavant in the SMCS article. If a reader interested in information on Holy Name wants to learn about it, he/she can go to the Holy Name wiki. I believe it should be removed as not necessary in an article about SMCS (and the same for St. Mike's info on the HNMCS wiki). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.254.17.230 (talk) 03:16, 22 June 2011 (UTC)

The point of including this basic information is to show how Holy Name of Mary College School and St. Michael's College School are connected by virtue of their school type, single-gender, and religious affiliation. The inclusion of this basic information is included to illustrate the parallels between the two schools. These parallels are part of the reason they are brother and sister schools, and therefore this information is relevant and should be included in the article. 174.89.27.124 (talk) 04:30, 22 June 2011 (UTC)

They are two separate institutions. If you want to write a paragraph describing the schools' connections, that can be done in sub-article within the main article. Readers can go to the other school's wiki for more detailed information and don't need to see it in the introduction, where it appears as self-serving PR. See Basic Navigation in Wikipedia -- "Wikipedia articles are all linked, or cross-referenced. When highlighted text like this is seen, it means there is a link to some relevant article or Wikipedia page with further in-depth information elsewhere. Holding the mouse over the link will often show to where the link will lead. The reader is always one click away from more information on any point that has a link attached." Mikeycanuck (talk) 04:50, 22 June 2011 (UTC)

So if understand correctly, the inclusion of a section on each wiki describing the links between the schools is an acceptable compromise in your view? 174.89.27.124 (talk) 05:09, 22 June 2011 (UTC)

I only ask Mikeycanuck for clarification because it goes against his reasoning for removing the very basic information previously included in the introduction that drew the parallels between the two schools. In removing that content, Mikeycanuck commented (see View History), "Removed superfluous information on Holy Name. Should be in HNM's wiki." So Mikeycanuck, you are adverse to very basic information included in the introduction, but you would welcome an entire paragraph within the article? I want to ensure we have reached agreement before I go ahead and add that paragraph. 174.89.27.124 (talk) 05:19, 22 June 2011 (UTC)

The detailed information does not belong in the introduction, which should always be concise and relevant. In a later section, a description of the school's links is acceptable, if it is relevant. If SMCS chose Holy Name as its "sister school" for certain reasons, and they are verifiable, I would not object. I am never opposed to compromise and reasonable discussion and discourse. Mikeycanuck (talk) 07:29, 23 June 2011 (UTC)

I never suggested detailed information should be included in the introduction, only that basic information, e.g. school type, single-gender, and religious affiliation should be included. These pieces of information demonstrate the parallels between the brother and sister schools. Mikeycanuck, would you agree with the addition of "an independent, Catholic all-girls school" on this wiki and "a private, Catholic all-boys school" on the HMNCS wiki? The addition of these very few words would be a very concise way of illustrating the parallels between the two schools, which I believe to be relevant to both articles. Specifically I'm suggesting: "St. Mike's is the brother school of Holy Name of Mary College School (HNMCS) in Mississauga." be replaced with: "St. Michael's College School is the brother school of Holy Name of Mary College School, an independent, Catholic all-girls school in Mississauga." 174.89.27.124 (talk) 04:49, 24 June 2011 (UTC)

That is fine with me.Mikeycanuck (talk) 05:16, 24 June 2011 (UTC)