Talk:St Ives, Cornwall

Cornish name in lead
FORLANG covers this use of a non-English language name in the lead. A requirement is: If the subject of the article is closely associated with a non-English language... What is the close association with the Cornish name being used? Cornish has been an extinct language for over 200 years so nobody speaks it or uses it. The revived version is just that, a revived language. The very name is question, 'Porth la' was chosen by the CLP and is not necessarily what was used in original Cornish. In fact, the citation given uses the name 'Pluwia', adding further to 'guessed' nature of this and other Cornish place names. Official status of modern Cornish? There is none: because, presumably, true Cornish is extinct and this modern version, although having a tenuous link with Cornish culture, is of no practical use to anyone beyond a very small interest group and some council employees who, due to the EU charter, have to spend a govt handout promoting the language in some way, such as a few road signs. Therefore, where is the 'close association' of St Ives with this Cornish word? Without that close association, we should not use it because it does not comply with FORLANG. This is not the same as when we use Welsh names, or Irish names, with English place names. They are living languages with official status that are extensively used and the Welsh and Irish names have close associations with the places in question. Being extinct does not automatically exclude a foreign language, such as Latin in Holy See articles, but the practical connection there is considerable, so Latin can be referred to. If we follow the logic used here for Cornish, why not include foreign language names in other UK articles? The Norn name for Stornoway? - Norn died out after Cornish. The inclusion of Cornish place names in WP is not justified under WP guidelines or policies. Even viewed from a non-FORLANG position, the use of Cornish place names here is not justified under weighting. There is a small group of revivalist enthusiasts who are promoting their cause. That is all well and good, but WP is not a venue for doing that. Is this my POV, DH? I don't think so. I am just trying to follow WP rules. The POV lies with those wanting to insert modern Cornish place names. Roger 8 Roger (talk) 20:25, 2 February 2019 (UTC)


 * I would most certainly argue for the inclusion of the Cornish translation. Not only is it approved by Akademi Kernewek (the Cornish language standards body), but Cornish also still holds an important place in the culture of Cornwall and St Ives and is most definitely "closely associated" with the English names. Although the point that the currently aprroved name may not be accurate is a valid one, the claim that the reference given does not translate it to 'Porth Ia' but 'Pluwia' is not (the translation can be found on page 44 of the PDF and also on the Cornish Wikipedia page for St Ives). Indeed, it is hard to find any language in a 'true' form - even Welsh has a modern standardised form. Therefore it is hard to say that modern Cornish has only a "tenuous link" to the current revived version. Turning to the case of the Norn language, although it may have died out after Cornish, Cornish was much more well documented over its demise, was originally spoken over a larger area and is currently spoken and used culturally by more people.


 * To be honest, I think the inclusion of native language names should happen wherever possible. I know that Wikipedia isn't just a collection of bits and pieces of information, but it does preserve knowledge - as such, as much knowledge should be preserved as possible (in my view). People are always going to discuss the cultural importance or merit of small or revived languages but for the space it's taking up, that piece of knowledge might help someone, interest someone or just inform them. I'd say that's worth it. Gazamp (talk) 12:00, 22 June 2019 (UTC)

Mondrian wasn't moving anywhere in 1968
The article currently reads "The town attracted artists from overseas, such as Piet Mondrian and Maurice Sumray, who moved from London in 1968". This, on the face of it, says that Piet Mondrian (who died in 1944 according to his Wikipedia page) moved from London in 1968. Can the author of this sentence check their facts and correct it? Thanks. ZoneAlarm5 (talk) 01:13, 26 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Moved comma. Ghmyrtle (talk) 07:39, 26 August 2020 (UTC)