Talk:Star Ocean: The Second Story (manga)

Relationships
I think the Relationships section should be removed. To arrange a list like that is stereotyping and it should be up to the reader of the manga to infer the characters' feelings on one another. It is also not that significant. -yumeko
 * Done, I also made an attempt to delete the more irrelevant character information - Tsunade 10:00, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Merge
Star Ocean EX has been merged into this article. Star Ocean EX is based on this manga seris, and there are not enough significant differences to warrant having them as separate articles. I've also done some basic clean up, and merged in Star Ocean EX's character list as it was better written. The article had far too many non-free images and these have been removed. Much more clean up and work is needed, however, to bring it up to part. As such, I've tagged it for clean up and for needing some expert attention. AnmaFinotera (talk) 02:56, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Were the genres merged as well? Regardless, it's going to have to be trimmed to two or three useful ones (see #4.); in other words, what are the main ones for this particular series? Lord Sesshomaru (talk • edits) 05:22, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
 * No, those were the same on both and I just left as is. I've dropped Action - doesn't really fit anyway. BTW, ELs do not count as references :) AnmaFinotera (talk) 05:25, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Do they count as sources? That's what I said in my edit summary, hence, the reason why I rearranged the tags. What was bad about citation-style? Lord Sesshomaru (talk • edits) 05:29, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
 * ELs dont' count as sources, as they are general links. If they are a source for something, a specific citation to the exact page in that site needs to be made. The only odd one is ANN, since most of its stuff is on that first page, but you still have to actually note it as a reference.  Listing as an EL alone would not count as a source when the article is being reviewed for PR, GA, etc. :) No worries though, as it now has a reference so changed to refimprove. I plan to work on it a few more hours, so when done, hopefully it will have several more references. The ANN articles don't have some of the info listed in the article, so searching for sources and more details. AnmaFinotera (talk) 05:38, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
 * So are you working on it 'til it's a candidate for WP:GAC? Also, I'd like to place hidden messages around the genres to let others know of the discussion here. May I do so or should it wait? Lord Sesshomaru (talk • edits) 06:04, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
 * I'd wait to see if it becomes an issue. This page hasn't had a lot of activity recently. Except for an automated image removal, before I touched it the last edit was in November. I'd love to get it to GAC, but not sure if I will be able to do to the manga being unlicensed, and a general lack of production info. I would at least like to get it up to B class though. :) AnmaFinotera (talk) 06:19, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Guess I can watchlist the page, though what I would prefer a simple hiding message like this. Think that would be a problem? I know it may be debatable ATPIT, but I have good intentions (mainly wanna prevent overcategorization). Anyway, I'm asking you because it'd be good to know if I'll be reverted if this edit is done. Thoughts? Lord Sesshomaru (talk • edits) 06:48, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
 * While I can understand your reasoning, I think we should avoid doing messages unless it becomes clear that it is a problem. Series like Naruto and InuYasha regularly have issues with it, so the notes are necessary.  Most, however, don't need it and unless it turns into an issue, just dealing with as it comes up is fine. I keep any articles I do significant work on in my watchlist pretty much forever, so if someone does try to change, I can just undo and point them to the MOS. Its kind of like the talkheader on talk pages. It should only be added if there is a big problem with people straying in their discussions. :) On an unrelated note...I'm working on the chapter list now...trying to get kanji from images...wee! AnmaFinotera (talk) 07:00, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Ah, I see. Hopefully you won't mind if the links are fixed:
 * I find it weird that it still turns up as "Star Ocean: The Second Story (Manga), should it not be Star Ocean EX, since the manga and the anime are both called EX? I don't know how to change section titles, that's why I bring it up here.. 99.238.219.207 23:40, January 09, 2009
 * No, the manga was released as Star Ocean: The Second Story. Only the anime is EX. -- AnmaFinotera  (talk · contribs) 04:43, 10 January 2009 (UTC)

Proposed genres

 * To proposal below

Thoughts? If not Fantasy, there a sub-genre which flows better? Science fantasy, I presume? Lord Sesshomaru (talk • edits) 07:25, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

Lord Sesshomaru (talk • edits) 07:25, 3 March 2008 (UTC)


 * I don't mind at all. I'm not to good with the genre links :) Science fantasy? If that's an accepted genre, then that would be accurate.  Its a space thing, and Claude has a ray gun for a short time, but also has magic, dragons, and other fantasy elements. AnmaFinotera (talk) 07:44, 3 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Yeah, I read the plot and that one came to mind. You really think it applies? Well, I'll get back to working on this in the morning or afternoon (sleepy). Lord Sesshomaru (talk • edits) 08:08, 3 March 2008 (UTC)


 * I think it would, at least for the anime. I think it sticks to the manga fairly well, though, so probably for both. AnmaFinotera (talk) 08:37, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

Okay. New proposal below


 * You're sure that action doesn't fit? Then again, if we stick to the new genres, it would be good if Category:Science fantasy was created. Thoughts? Lord Sesshomaru (talk • edits) 16:15, 3 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Hmmm...pretty sure from my memories of it. It does have some actions, but that isn't really the central focus as much as the adventure and journey. I debated romance as a genre, because of the thing between Claude and Rena, but if it doesn't fit for InuYasha, it sure wouldn't fit here.  Hmmm...thinking on it, though InuYasha is obviously longer (though just as lacking in ending LOL), maybe action could fit. AnmaFinotera (talk) 16:28, 3 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Thing is, is there as much prominence of action as there is in, say, Dragon Ball? BTW, please join in on the InuYasha discussion as well. Lord Sesshomaru (talk • edits) 16:40, 3 March 2008 (UTC)


 * As Dragon Ball? Hmmm...not a show I watch myself, but from what I have seen of it, I'd say no.  I rewatched the first five eps last night, and while there were a handful of fights, they are all pretty brief.  None of those four episode battles or the like ;-) I wonder if Sword and Sorcery would probably be a better fit than action?  Too many genres that it can kinda fit it.  AnmaFinotera (talk) 17:03, 3 March 2008 (UTC)


 * You lost me. Are you talking about Dragon Ball, InuYasha, or Star Ocean? And I wanted you to see if there are categories here which instead should belong on Star Ocean: The Second Story (manga). Lord Sesshomaru (talk • edits) 17:50, 3 March 2008 (UTC)


 * For Sword and Sorcery, I was talking Star Ocean Second Story. :) Hmmm...Space Odyseey fits most of the Star Ocean games, but I'm not sure if it quite fits this manga/anime, as there really is no space action beyond the first two minutes of the sequence.  Might have been intended for later, but alas, it is an incomplete story :P AnmaFinotera (talk) 19:13, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

Here's what I'm now visualizing (see box below)


 * That about right? Seems this series is a science fantasy somewhat like FMA. And I actually would like to know how it's sword and sorcery. Thoughts? Lord Sesshomaru (talk • edits) 21:08, 3 March 2008 (UTC)


 * AnmaFinotera, I'd like to get those stylistics updated ASAP. Think you could respond to the above concerns? Lord Sesshomaru (talk • edits) 06:23, 4 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Sorry, I missed your last message. I can't think of any similar anime series to compare to, but I think those three would fit. Sword and sorcery because we have quite a few swordsmen (though the battles aren't that violent), several romantic elements, elements of magic and supernatural events, and each character has their own personal issues to deal with (which in typical RPG fashion ends up being a world-altering thing). AnmaFinotera (talk) 06:46, 4 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Okay. I shall update the article per this discussion. Settled? Lord Sesshomaru (talk • edits) 06:49, 4 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Yep. AnmaFinotera (talk) 07:11, 4 March 2008 (UTC)


 * If this is a manga, what's it doing in a film category (i.e. Category:Sword-and-Sorcery films)? For that matter, what's it doing in "Sword and Sorcery"? I'll bring up the same point I brought up over at InuYasha: people associate "Sword and Sorcery" with Conan the Barbarian and Dungeons and Dragons. Star Ocean doesn't look like Conan or D&D. I think (if anything) Sword and planet fits better.--Nohansen (talk) 03:31, 22 March 2008 (UTC)


 * I gave a response here. Though for this one, sword and planet feels better, however, the content there looks ORish. Ideas? Lord Sesshomaru (talk • edits) 04:10, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

To Do
Mostly self notes, but of course anyone is welcome to join in. Things left to do to get this article to the best possible status, in a fairly random order:


 * Manga summaries (if possible) and perhaps move to separate list for length
 * Expand plot a bit - needs to go from beginning to end
 * If possible, find summaries of drama CDs to expand plot section, as they give stories end
 * Reception section - know it pretty much bombed in US, but need to write up, source, and attempt to find out how the manga and anime versions faired in Japan
 * Production - is it possible? Any sources for the move from manga to anime or discussing the canceling of the anime series' supposed 2nd season (and was there supposed to be one)? Will need to check offline sources and check manga for author's notes
 * Refs ref refs, try to find a ref for every statement

The biggest obstacles I see are that most sources on the manga, especially, are in Japanese, and Babelfish is not the best of translators, and is useless with Flash sites. There is no official site for any media, so quite a bit of info may just be lost or unsourceable from RS. Reception in US of the anime should be easily sourceable, but little to no production details seem to exist. Still, B class is certainly possible, and maybe with luck GA. AnmaFinotera (talk) 07:35, 5 March 2008 (UTC)


 * I do know that there WAS suppose to be a second season, though I need to find an exact article to back it up. I also have the second drama CD, but I do not understand Japanese, so I cannot translate it, unless someone else is up to it. Production is not very hard, I'm just unsure of what exactly in 'production' you are wanting. Release dates, and such? Very easy finds. I can also work on an extensive plot summary, though people will need to check it over for spelling.
 * My biggest iff is characters. They are all virtually the same anime and game. I feel linking to the same game page of characters would be fine. Just add a little extra to the end if there was a significiant change from their game to anime persona (but I cannot think of any off the top of my head.) cutepiku 23:45, 9 January, 2009 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.238.219.207 (talk) 04:47, 10 January 2009 (UTC)


 * No, release dates are not production info, that's media. Production info is the making of type stuff: manga creator's process and motivations, anime adaptations process, etc. All reliably sourced, of course. We don't need an extensive plot summary, just a fuller one: it should still be brief, hitting the major points, not excessively detailed. -- AnmaFinotera  (talk · contribs) 04:50, 10 January 2009 (UTC)

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