Talk:Steve Symms

Symms and the John Birch Society
I'm going to remove the comments about Steve Symms being a member of the JBS. I've found sites listing him as a member of the Society on other websites, but nothing about him being a member on the JBS website. I'm inclined to think that if Symms was a member of the JBS, it would trumpet that. It's not shy about telling which prominent people are affiliated with it. So I'll remove the reference but if someone finds some concrete evidence, by all means please restore it. MKilMKil

1988 campaign
Rewrote this:


 * In the 1988 presidential election, at the behest of Lee Atwater, Symms floated a false rumor that Kitty Dukakis, the wife of Democratic presidential candidate Michael Dukakis, had burned an American flag to protest the Vietnam War, as well as a claim that Dukakis himself had been treated for a mental illness.

No one has seriously suggested that Atwater was responsible for Symms's statement about Mrs. Dukakis. The rumor about Dukakis being treated by a psychiatrist(sp?) came from the LaRouche organization and got significant media attention when Reagan made the "I'm not going to pick on an invalid" joke. Ellsworth 14:30, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

symms civil rights
Srich (I'm pinging you as I don't know whether this is on your watchlist on not), original research is material for which no reliable, published sources exist – are you suggesting that the New York Times is not a reliable source? It's the paper of record, man. How is that not reliable. The Associated Press is a reliable source as well. Also, it isn't our opinion, it's the opinion of "liberal opponents" as I noted in my edit. I'll remove the "terrible" part and just put "criticized by liberal opponents for his civil rights record", if you believe that will make it NPOV. Also, it isn't synthesis if I'm stating material not published by one of the sources. Symms himself even gave a reason for voting against a civil rights bill because, in his words, "It's just another layer of the federal government that we don't need" and that free market should determine how many housing units there are for disabled. I didn't state anything not explicitly stated by the source. I stated "criticized by liberal opponents". Indeed, in one of his liberal opponents, Marilyn Shuler of the Idaho Human Rights Commission, stated that "I'm saddened that, once again, Sen. Symms has chosen not to support civil rights legislation." I believe my edits were entirely sound. I'd like to hear an argument for why they weren't, but I'd need to hear it quickly. Scaravich105nj (talk) 01:17, 26 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Okay. Let's look at the NYT story on the Civil Rights bill. Symms is mentioned as voting against it. But was there any criticism of him from any groups for having done so? None that I see in my quick scan of the article. So there is SYN gong on when the WP paragraph starts with the description of his "dismal/terrible" civil rights record (for which he has been criticized). But since the NYT article does not mention criticism, it is improper to add it to the paragraph. Moreover, saying "one of only five to vote against" is adding an editorial description.  – S. Rich (talk) 01:25, 26 April 2015 (UTC)
 * What about the Associated Press one? (The one with shuler). What's wrong with that? Scaravich105nj (talk) 01:28, 26 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Yes, he was one of three. But now we're getting into the area of WP:UNDUE when we have one person (not a group) saying she was "saddened" by the vote. Also, the particular vote comes under WP:NOTNEWS.  – S. Rich (talk) 01:35, 26 April 2015 (UTC)