Talk:Stockport/Archive 1

D'oh-Tess Daly is from Birch Vale,Derbyshire...9 miles away! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.19.6.71 (talk) 12:30, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

Any other wiki-ers living in Stockport? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.252.192.8 (talk) 12:30, 10 July 2005 (UTC)

Me! --Deskana 11th July 2005, 00:46 (GMT) from Stockport

Yes, my name is Scooter.

I do! (in Cheadle Hulme) Moitio (talk) 20th July 2005, 16:03 (GMT)

nice, that's where I go to college (CAMSFC) - do you know Peter Hulme by any chance?

What the hell happened to Ridge Danyers? Dmn / &#1332;&#1396;&#1398; 22:34, 26 July 2005 (UTC)

It was re-named "Cheadle and Marple Sixth Form College", no idea why.

i know yea i went there on a taster day ridge danyers sounds so much better. i'm sarah by the way and i live in Bramhall

cool, you started there this year then? ive just started the 2nd year. Kris from Reddish

I do. I live in adswood. Stockport is a shithole. Yes, yes it is.

Don't drag the rest of Stockport down with Adswood! CharlieT

Revert
I reverted it back to the version after the WCML was added as some of the notable people were lost after the vandalism. Also I have measured the crow flies distance from the Merseyway Shopping centre to Piccadilly Gardens on Google Earth. It came out at 5.75 miles so it can stay at 6 on the article. Phildav76 22:44, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

IS THIS MEANT TO BE SERIOUS?
"Stockport is a town in Greater Manchester, in North West England, within the traditional borders of Cheshire. The town of Stockport has a population of 136,082 (2001 census). It is the largest town within the Metropolitan Borough of Stockport."

Three sentences all containing the words 'Stockport' and 'town' Do we really need to be told for a second time that Stockport is a 'town' as in "The town of Stockport has a population of 136,082 (2001 census)." AND for a third time "It is the largest town within the Metropolitan Borough of Stockport."? And does it really come as a surprise to anyone at all that "It is the largest town within the Metropolitan Borough of Stockport."? Can life be any more boring in Stockport? Surely if STOCKPORT is 'a town in Greater Manchester', then it is no longer 'within the traditional borders of Cheshire'? (Local government reorganisation obviously put pay to Cheshire's "traditional borders", whatever those were!)

Anyway I have learnt a lot about 'Sunny Stockport' in those three sentences, but perhaps someone can now sub-edit them into better English, ie one continuous sentence which does not repeat the words 'Stockport' and 'town'? Try saying a suburb of Manchester!

NitramrekcapmpNitramrekcap


 * --Lord Deskana Dark Lord of YOUR OPINIONS 18:05, 29 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I have reworded it now. Any better and less repetitive? -- Phildav76 18:21, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
 * With the best will in the world, not better. I prefer it as it was.  I'm with his lordship; bring on the deathless prose, Nitramrekcap Mr Stephen 23:12, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

Please Note the Following:
Anyone who is wondering; the Police Force in Stockport is the Greater Manchester Police.

I recently noted someone mistakenly call it the "Manchester Metropolitan Police". (See History of article)

Please dont anyone make this mistake again.

Dep. Garcia 19:32, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

Notable Residents
To delete the whole section does seem a little extreme, however we do not want non-notables included.

I think that if the resident has their own wiki page they cold be classed as notable and a short paragraph/whole page could be written.

We should reinstate the section with resident included if they have their own page. Olive Oil 08:37, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

But what defines a "notable" compared to a "non-notable" - isn't this a subjective judgement? To the list on the main page you might add the following:- Joanne Whalley-Kilmer(actress); Davy Jones (lead singer, the Monkees); Freddie Garrity (lead singer of early 1960's combo Freddie and the Dreamers); Mike Yarwood (comedian and impressionist); Fred Perry (Britain's last male Wimbledon champion); Yvette Fielding (TV presenter).

I'm not even going to try to get sniffy and identify "non-notables" in that list... they all, I think, merit inclusion, because they're from Stockport, and achieved a degree of merit and recognition in their own chosen fields. Besides, Davy Jones' family used to run a bike/sports/fishing tackle shop in Reddish, which made the experience of watching that great Californian group The Monkees on TV quite surreal... (86.155.78.146 (talk) 20:46, 4 April 2008 (UTC))


 * It would be best to add these people to the List of people from Stockport article. From there (at a later date) the most notable people can be selected to go in the Notable people section in this article. Yes, arguably this would lead to subjective judgements, but unless you can suggest something else it will have to do; not everyone can be fitted in. Nev1 (talk) 21:00, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

Parliamentary representation
I have reverted (diff) some changes to the Parliamentary representation section, as the changes were not consistent with the definitions of the parts of ther town. What are the problems with the text we have had here for some time, ie There are four parliamentary constituencies in the Stockport Metropolitan Borough: Stockport, Cheadle, Hazel Grove, and Denton and Reddish? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Mr Stephen (talk • contribs) 09:24, 12 January 2007 (UTC).

More than a name
Some debate over whether to add this external site to articles covering each Stockport towns. Appreciate any feedback, at Talk:Heaton_Moor. --Oscarthecat 06:04, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

Etymology
I have used Adrian Room's Dictionary of English Place-Names and A.D. Mills' similar book, and both seem to cite Old English stoc-port "village with market" as etymology. Would this be an acceptable change?? --SunStar Net talk 13:04, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Arrowsmith gives a longer discussion than Mills, it would probably be worth your while reading it first. I don't know Room's book.  Mr Stephen 13:30, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

Source
Just a note that I found this interesting source. Looks very useful for the article. -- Jza84 · (talk) 02:56, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Extents
This article has been marked for attention and improvement to GA level, see WT:GM. For the avoidance of future controversy, this article covers the "Stockport" marked by the pre-1974 county borough. It is pretty-well covered by this map at A vision of Britain through time, and also by an early 1970s A-Z in my possession.

That is: north of the Mersey/Tame, all of the Heatons and Reddish; Inter Goyt et Tame, Brinnington; going round clockwise: Portwood, Offerton, Great Moor, Stepping Hill, Woodsmoor, Adswood (debateable?) and Cheadle Heath. But not: Romiley, Marple, Hazel Grove, Bramall, Cheadle Hulme or Cheadle.

If there is to be any debate, can we thrash it out sooner, rather than later? Mr Stephen (talk) 16:57, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Just to stir things up: Bramhall's postal town is Stockport, so (arguably) it should be included.--Jotel (talk) 17:20, 12 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Postal towns are very poor indicators of boundaries, for example, Stretford's is Manchester and Hale Barns' is Warrington. Nev1 (talk) 17:52, 12 March 2008 (UTC)


 * In the general, all of Stockport MBC except Gatley & the Cheadles are in the Stockport post town. In the specific, Bramhall pre-1974 was in Hazel Grove and Bramhall UD.  So probably no, Bramhall is out.  Mr Stephen (talk) 18:17, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Fine, I'm not going to declare edit war because of that :-) --Jotel (talk) 18:24, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Free-to-use images
There's a nice collection of free-to-use images of Stockport here. Some of these have commons-compatable licencing. Hope that helps, --Jza84 | Talk  17:07, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

A misleading phrase in the lead
I've just been bold and deleted a misleading phrase in the lead, as it seemed to oversimplify the true situation. The phrase in question is "Historically split between both Lancashire and Cheshire,", which may or may not have been the vcase, as the boundaries of Cheshire expanded at times to fit the extent of Stockport from time to time. I suggest that attention is given to writing the Governance section accurately, and, once that has been done, a more clear idea of how to introduce a complex history, not fixed but fluid in time, into the lead can be discerned. Any comments? DDStretch   (talk)  12:48, 29 October 2008 (UTC)


 * I agree completely. The Arrowsmith book should have something, I'll see if I can find a copy. Nev1 (talk) 13:00, 29 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Arowsmith has some stuff, but is annoyingly imprecise in parts. Several of his facts are referenced to the Victoria History of Cheshire; when I looked in the VicHist re Reddish, the information was limted to a footnote.  Mr Stephen (talk) 19:04, 29 October 2008 (UTC)


 * 300 pages and he still finds time to be imprecise? Infuriating. Nev1 (talk) 20:11, 29 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Youngs is a bit better, probably, as with a careful cross-referencing between different sections, one can work out what was changed and when. However, I've been busy all evening, and will only be able to write it down as far as my understanding goes tomorrow.  DDStretch    (talk)  22:54, 29 October 2008 (UTC)


 * I have information in Youngs book about the local administration over the relevant time periods, and it contains information about county boundary changes, borough and other local district changes, etc. Some of these can be found in an article I'm getting into shape on a subpage prior to launching (see Former local authority boroughs and districts of Cheshire which I am slowly getting into a kore complete form with references, filling out unfilled boxes, and so on.) I haven't summarized all the information there in that proto-article, but it does contain some bare outlines.  DDStretch    (talk)  13:14, 29 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Actually, looking at the article I'm writing, its more deficient in content about Stockport and its boundary changes than I thought: more work is clearly needed and is why I haven't gone live with it yet.  DDStretch    (talk)  13:20, 29 October 2008 (UTC)

Insufficiently refereced Notable People
This section is currently filled with a majority of unverified entries with some value-laden comments about at least one of them. According to WP:BLP, unreferenced material about living people should be removed immediately from an article, and for dead people, it may be removed. So, as a courtesy and not to cause too much upset, I've transferred to the unreferenced additions here pending their validation by citing appropriate verification by means of suitable table citations that they are (a) notable (usually easy), and (b) that they had a connection with Stockport that was (c) notable in its own right (perhaps more tricky). Once that is done for an entry, it can be struck out and transferred back into the main article. DDStretch   (talk)  23:21, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

Notable People (Residents): Insufficiently verified entries requiring verification

 * Dashing weatherman Chris Fawkes
 * Actor Dominic Monaghan, best-known for his role in the movie adaptations of The Lord of the Rings (who attended Aquinas College in Stockport)
 * John Amaechi, NBA Star and activist
 * Novelist Christopher Isherwood
 * Engineer Sir Joseph Whitworth
 * Tennis player Fred Perry
 * TV presenter David Dickinson
 * Judge John Bradshaw
 * Architect Norman Foster
 * Drummer Dominic Howard from The Rock Band Muse hails from Stockport
 * Steve Thomas who played 20 seasons in the NHL, most notably with the Toronto Maple Leafs was born in Stockport.
 * Joan Bakewell TV personality and journalist hails from the area. Once known as "the thinking man's crumpet" :)


 * I've started adding some references. There's no need to establish notability here though, that should be within their articles & if they aren't notable these should have be deleted. JMiall  ₰  00:56, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

Image
Could this image be worked into the article? It's a beautiful period image, and it'd be a shame not to capitalise on it IMHO. --Jza84 | Talk  00:05, 7 June 2009 (UTC)

Geographical limits- Scope
There is talk at the Greater Manchester Project of attempting to improve this article. Can I start with an impossible question. Just where are we talking about. Is Heaviley in Scope? Davenport? Do we include Heaton Norris or anywhere the Lancashire side of the river? Is Reddish included as this has a considerable effect on the way we talk about industrial history?--ClemRutter (talk) 09:57, 5 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Above! That is: north of the Mersey/Tame, all of the Heatons and Reddish; Inter Goyt et Tame, Brinnington; going round clockwise: Portwood, Offerton, Great Moor, Stepping Hill, Woodsmoor, Adswood (debateable?) and Cheadle Heath. But not: Romiley, Marple, Hazel Grove, Bramall, Cheadle Hulme or Cheadle Mr Stephen (talk) 10:11, 5 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Mmm yes. Two thoughts-1. that fits in with my concept of Stockport. 2. Shouldn't that elegant bit of prose be on the article rather than the talk? Under Division and suburbs could be not say.
 * "Stockport, as we discuss it now is made up from the following settlements. North of the Mersey/Tame, all of the Heatons and Reddish; inter Tame and Goyt, Brinnington, and south of the Goyt going clockwise Portwood, Offerton, Great Moor, Stepping Hill, Woodsmoor, Adswood and Cheadle Heath. It does not include Romiley, Marple, Hazel Grove, Bramhall, Cheadle Hulme or Cheadle  even though they were grouped with Stockport in 1974 to form the Unitary borough."
 * I have located the relevant A-Z it is edition 4. Edition 5 has dropped the Pre 1974 boundaries. I do question why the pre 1974 boundaries are the relevant ones but bow to you expertise and judgement!--ClemRutter (talk) 15:27, 5 July 2009 (UTC)

Rescued from history section
"During the English Civil War the town was supportive of Parliament and was garrisoned by local militias commanded by Majors Mainwaring and Duckenfield. Prince Rupert stormed the town in 1644 in a brief skirmish in which Colonel Washington's Dragoons led the Royalist attack. Rupert continued his march via Manchester and Bolton to meet defeat at Marston Moor near York.

In 1745, the Jacobite army of Charles Edward Stuart marched through the town on the way to Derby. Tradition has it they camped above the ford on what is now Heaton Norris Park.

One of the legends of the town is the story of the Cheshire farmer, who in an C18th demonstration against taxation, avoided Mr Pitts Saddle tax on horses by riding to market at Stockport on an ox!"

The above paragraphs were deleted as unsourced. I suspect they are mentioned in one of the history books in the bibliography, can anyone who has access to these check please? If not a quick search implies that this information is likely to be correct and a set of references to support wording along the lines of the paragraphs above can probably be found online. JMiall ₰  19:34, 8 September 2009 (UTC)


 * On 27 Nov. 1784 one Jonathan Thatcher rode his cow to and from the market of Stockport in protest against the horse-tax, Chambers, Book of DaySy ii. 627, where there is a copy of a similar print. http://www.archive.org/stream/catalogueofprint06brituoft/catalogueofprint06brituoft_djvu.txt
 * then http://www.england-in-particular.info/goods/g-case2-08.html
 * also Astle History of Stockport Stockport Advertiser p4 --ClemRutter (talk) 08:21, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

Stockport Sunday School
I have penned Stockport Sunday School which includes a world record and hideous murder. Would some one like to link it in. All of Stockport"s vast influence on the early nineteenth century was certainly downplayed by the 1950s and seems to be missing here. --ClemRutter (talk) 08:00, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

Area
In terms of area, Stockport is the largest metropolitan town in Europe.

Is there any reference for that? Calculating with 4.613 persons per km² and a population of 136.082 there is a result of an area of 29.5 km². There are many other towns in Europe which are bigger than Stockport. --Dionysos1988 (talk) 23:16, 2 March 2011 (UTC)


 * It was added here. Sounds unlikely to me.  Mr Stephen (talk) 23:35, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

Comments

 * "Stockport... is a large town": "large" is somewhat subjective. Is this a measure of area or population? And what's large for England may not be for other countries. I just checked the articles on Sale and Stretford: the first states simply "Sale is a town" and the latter opts for "Stretford (pop. 37,500) is a town". It's not a big issues, but if no one objects I'd like to remove the adjective "large" from this article's opening sentence. As the population is mentioned in the third sentence I don't think we need to follow Stretford's example.
 * The earliest bit of history in the lead is 16th-century, so it needs to be expanded a bit to more closely refelct the history section.
 * Can anyone work out the situation regarding the twin towns? I'm not sure if Béziers and Heilbronn are twinned with the town, borough, or both. The council's website doesn't make things particularly clear. Nev1 (talk) 19:11, 23 November 2011 (UTC)
 * Shall I try to work Landmarks into something less list-like?J3Mrs (talk) 21:51, 23 November 2011 (UTC)
 * I was going to say yes, but you've already done it. Good stuff. There's a quote box in the history section, what do you reckon of how the actual quote looks? I'm worried it may be too small for all readers, and while of course people can zoom in and out I think removing the tags might be the better route. Nev1 (talk) 23:30, 23 November 2011 (UTC)
 * Removed it and rejigged Landmarks, I can now see a few gaps.


 * Country parks, surely most of these are in the borough not the town, it could be copied to the other article leaving the relevant bits here if I knew what they were.J3Mrs (talk) 08:54, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

Arts
Does this need to be included ? --ClemRutter (talk) 09:58, 24 January 2013 (UTC)
 * The article is about Simon Stephens rather than Stockport. Mr Stephen (talk) 13:24, 24 January 2013 (UTC)

Semi-Protection until 2013-02-26
I have semi-protected this article until 26 February. I have done this to attempt the series of (now) anonymous editors, all from different IP addresses, who continually either remove the fact that Fred Perry was the past British person to win a Grand Slam, or else claim that Andy Murray won it to replace Fred Perry's record. Andy Murray did not fulfil all the criteria for a Grand Slam, as can be seen from the article Grand Slam (tennis). If people think this is excessive, let me know, but it would be good if the protection is removed, to have more people being more alert to this disruption. DDStretch   (talk)  12:43, 19 February 2013 (UTC)

Partially Protected for 3 months
Some vandal, using a variety of IP addresses, is continually adding disparaging remarks about people from Stockport. Given the previous pattern of disruptions that have led to the article being (partially) protected in the past, I have partially protected the article for 3 months in the hope that this person gives up, grows up, or both. I am not confident, though. This solution seems better than following them around and blocking the anonymous IP addresses they use, though this could change, depending on what happens next. If there are any problems, post a message here. DDStretch   (talk)  01:22, 8 October 2014 (UTC)


 * I see the rather childish vandalism is back, and, again, from a variety of IP addresses. So, rather than block each ip address as it crops up, I've just protected the page from anonymous editing, and from editing by new users for a period of 6 months this time.  DDStretch    (talk)  03:23, 18 April 2015 (UTC)


 * Nothing childish about enlightening readers as to the character of the natives. Ergo - a shower of drips ! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.29.77.158 (talk) 21:08, 30 April 2015 (UTC)


 * ddstretch, is this the only article vandalized by this set of addresses? Or should protection be added to relevant biographic articles? Dimadick (talk) 07:02, 15 May 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 27 June 2015
We should add a more up to date population statistic which is 105,878 according do the 2011 census

90.219.248.81 (talk) 14:42, 27 June 2015 (UTC)

Not done for now: I can only find figures for the Metropolitan Borough of Stockport not Stockport itself - can you provide a link to a reliable source Thanks - Arjayay (talk) 16:55, 27 June 2015 (UTC)


 * I've just been checking for those myself, there are no statistics for the town itself, just the wards of the Borough. i jave also removed the census detail from the Lede. The reference supplied does not support the figures and other links were to other Wiki articles. Richard Harvey (talk) 17:02, 27 June 2015 (UTC)

External links modified
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 * Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20080315201533/http://www.stockport.gov.uk:80/ to http://www.stockport.gov.uk/

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The etymology of Stockport is incorrect as published
Toponymy

The etymology given here for the two elements of the name of the town is broadly correct but it crosses over the meaning of each.

Stoc is a place or hamlet (perhaps specifically a secondary settlement on an estate)

Port refers to a market-place

Stockport is therefore a hamlet with a market-place.

The earliest reference to the name is Stokeport in 1154.

For reference see: Dodgson J McN (1970) The Place Names of Chesire Part One, English Place Name Society Volume XLIV, Cambridge University Press ISBN 0-948789-69-7

Henry Keswick (talk) 15:49, 7 July 2015 (UTC)


 * The two given references both have it as market place at a hamlet, not hamlet with a market place. Mr Stephen (talk) 17:08, 7 July 2015 (UTC)
 * ... and Dodgson gives "market-place at a hamlet", so the article is OK. Mr Stephen (talk) 15:52, 8 July 2015 (UTC)

External links modified
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20070116010601/http://members.aol.com:80/adstring/profiles.htm to http://members.aol.com/adstring/profiles.htm

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Ann Coffey MP
noting she is still listed here as a Labour MP. Avoiding any contentious or snarky comment that could be made about her current status, this is objectively inacccurate as she chose to leave the Labour Party whilst remaining - at least for now - MP for Stockport. Therefore she can no longer be described with any kind of accuracy as a Labour MP. Is there a way for the article to be edited to reflect this in a way all points of view might find to be a working compromise? vile woman — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.98.43.165 (talk) 16:29, 14 March 2019 (UTC)

Cheshire instead of Greater Manchester
I don't like it being described as being in Greater Manchester, Stopfordians are NOT Mancunians, nor do we want to be, postal address is Stockport, Cheshire and Greater Manchester Council ceased to exist in 1986. Thank you — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.28.56.217 (talk) 19:50, 7 January 2020 (UTC)