Talk:Subdivisions of Buenos Aires

[Untitled]
Huston, we have a problem. The city is divided first in 15 Comunas and then 47 in barrios. This is not explained and there's no map representing this. legislatura.gov.ar has some info about it. Mariano (t/c) 13:19, 8 September 2005 (UTC)

number of barrios
there is a tango "Cien barrios portenos" (cien = 100). maybe barrio-layout changed over time, mybe this is only poetic, maybe it also refers to all barrios in Gran BsAs, not only the ciudad. Tobias Conradi (Talk) 22:42, 9 October 2005 (UTC)


 * Tobias, it is only poetic. :) --Sebastian Kessel Talk 23:35, 9 October 2005 (UTC)


 * :-) . But I have heard (from a german friend) the layout changed over time. I will ask a porteno, then we now more. More about the real number and the distance between reality and poetry ;-) Tobias Conradi (Talk) 16:28, 17 October 2005 (UTC)


 * The layout changes from time to time, for example, the barrios are going to be regouped in some kind of zones in 2006. i dont know much, but surely there has never been 100 neibourghoods.


 * The traditional layouts don;t change (I am a pure-bred porteño). In 2005, the "Comunas" were created in the city of Buenos Aires. These comunas are an official administrative divisions, as opposed to the "barrios", which are purely historic and "for show". The critera to arrange the Comunas doesn't have the Barrios as a template; therefore there is no correlation between them. Sebastian Kessel Talk 00:46, 24 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Not exactly true. Each comuna consists of between one and six barrios.  Skinsmoke (talk) 22:15, 22 April 2012 (UTC)

article name
barrio is translated as neighbo(u)rhood. i would move the article Tobias Conradi (Talk) 22:42, 9 October 2005 (UTC)


 * "Barrio" for porteños is like "Boroughs" for New Yorkers... It is a very distinct word that conveys historic and traditional meanings... I would leave it, although a translation might be in order. --Sebastian Kessel Talk 23:36, 9 October 2005 (UTC)


 * on www.todotango.com in the english section it is allways translated as neighbourhood. I never saw bourough on any tango-related page. Of course translation would need explanation, because neighboudhood may have other conotations depending where one comes from. I will look in english-language tourist material Tobias Conradi (Talk) 16:24, 17 October 2005 (UTC)


 * It is the easiest translation, and does mean neighborhood. What I meant is that you would never hear a New Yorker refer to "Brooklyn" as a "neighborhood", it is a "Boro'" or a "Borough". --Sebastian Kessel Talk 17:29, 17 October 2005 (UTC)
 * That isn't the point. New York is in an English speaking country and borough is an English word. Barrio is a Spanish word. This is the English wikipedia. But it would be better to use "district" because neighbourhood is never used as an official designation in English speaking countries and can then be reserved for informal districts, which are often smaller than official subdivisions. Rhollenton 21:25, 3 December 2005 (UTC)

48 Barrios
Parque Chas is a barrio, since 8-23-2005
 * It's a good thing. Was there an official ceremony? Did they manage to leave? :-) elpincha 05:43, 27 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Reference Parque Chas: barrio N° 48 Mariano (t/c) 09:44, 27 January 2006 (UTC)

South Catalinas
Catalinas Sur is used (quite rarely) for the lowlands south of San Telmo (notably the area around Cosme Argerich hospital and at the bottom of Parque Lezama).

South Catalinas (Catalinas Sur) aren't in the south of San Telmo. Is in the North of La Boca. Lezama Park (Parque Lezama) divided 3 neighborhood: La Boca, San Telmo and Barracas. San Telmo at the north, La Boca at the Norh-west y Barracas at the North-east. So, Catalinas Sur it's like a "closed neighborhood", in other words, a small section of La Boca, as if it were a neighborhood-satelyte.

Another thing, Once -eleven- (for September 11th -Once de Septiembre-), is the comercial district in Balvanera, why only use Balvanera for the residential part. Palermo and other neighborhoods they have "small districts", how Oldest Palermo (Palermo Viejo), Palermo Hollywood, Palermo Soho.

For any questions, i'm a citizen of La Boca, Capital Federal (Buenos Aires City)

Sorry for my english201.250.56.40 (talk) 03:32, 28 March 2011 (UTC)

Interactive Barrio map
...is missing Parque Patricios, south of San Cristóbal. I don't know how to fix it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.190.185.246 (talk) 00:32, 8 April 2013 (UTC)

Article is bad
There is no such thing as "Barrios and Communes" of Buenos Aires.

I split it, now matching the real items and the articles in Spanish Wikipedia.
 * Communes of Buenos Aires (Spanish: es:Comunas de la Ciudad de Buenos Aires)
 * Neighbourhoods of Buenos Aires (Spanish: es:Barrios de la ciudad de Buenos Aires)

I also created Category:Communes of Buenos Aires.

Eldizzino (talk) 19:56, 28 May 2015 (UTC)


 * The problem, is your cut/pasting the article, and blanking this one which is against Wikipedia policies. From what I can tell, Barrios (Neighbourhoods) exist, as do Communes, and due to the relevence to each other, were included in the same article for clarity.
 * Constantly reverting multiple experienced editors has now progressed to you disrupting Wikipedia, and you are at a high risk of being blocked.
 * If you think the article should be split, then this talk page is where you can start the discuttion, HOWEVER, the way you have gone about this in a stubborn way, ignoring other experienced editors is the WRONG way. - Happysailor  (Talk) 20:02, 28 May 2015 (UTC)


 * , there are several routes available to address your concern; you could try WP:AFD, or WP:RM. There is not an ambiguity here that requires a disambiguation page. bd2412  T 20:04, 28 May 2015 (UTC)
 * This current page is also sufficiently clear, having 2 separate articles makes no sense. Just because something is done in Spanish Wiki doesn't make it right for English Wiki. Joseph2302 (talk) 20:24, 28 May 2015 (UTC)
 * It is not clear at all. First of all, it is not clear what the sources for all the claims are. Eldizzino (talk) 23:02, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

Article title is bad
"Barrios and Communes of Buenos Aires" - this is a complete fake. There is no such thing as "Barrios and Communes". There are either but never ever Eldizzino (talk) 23:01, 28 May 2015 (UTC)
 * neighbourhoods and communes
 * barrios and comunas
 * this is one combined thing, as indicated by upper case "Communes"
 * the mixture of English and Spanish will gain a price in English text writing

Split proposal

 * Barrios and Communes of Buenos Aires → Neighbourhoods of Buenos Aires
 * Barrios and Communes of Buenos Aires → Communes of Buenos Aires


 * Note: Barrios and Communes of Buenos Aires could be moved to Subdivisions of Buenos Aires. This
 * solves the problem of what to do with "Barrios and Communes of Buenos Aires" after the split
 * the new target can become an overview article about all other subdivisions
 * Eldizzino (talk) 17:18, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

Background
User:Eldizzino has been trying to split this page, so I'm going to set up the discussion the proper way. Please feel free to discuss and vote below. If I've set this up incorrectly, feel free to fix it. Joseph2302 (talk) 23:03, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

Discussion
To me, a Barrios/neighbourhood and a Commune seem like completely different things. Whilst the article as whole needs better sourcing, I think a split isn't going to make the articles worse, and currently it's just 2 separate tables and no interlinking anyway. Joseph2302 (talk) 23:14, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

I think it will make the English Wikipedia better. In general different sets of administrative entities are presented in different pages in the English Wikipedia, especially if they are on different levels. I created a match table: * CREATION was reverted ** conversion into disambiguation page was reverted Eldizzino (talk) 23:36, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

Votes

 * Support. The two sets are on different levels. It is like having U.S. states and U.S. counties in one article. The neighbourhoods are several decades older, at least in 1968 the barrios seem to have existed as administrative entities. The communes are only a creation of the 2nd millennium. Eldizzino (talk) 00:23, 29 May 2015 (UTC)
 * It seems a bit more like having counties and cities in the same article. I would suggest that since the bulk of the article is the neighborhoods, this page should be moved to Neighborhoods of Buenos Aires, and the "Communes" split out from there. bd2412  T 00:32, 29 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Support As above and my discussion, these 2 are clearly not the same thing. Don't mind which way round the move happens, but a mild preference for this becoming the neighbourhoods article. Also, how long does this discussion have to go on for? Is it 7 days like for AfDs? Joseph2302 (talk) 00:37, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

Further discussion
Comment - User:Eldizzino, Joseph2302 and User:BD2412 - While this is probably a good move, it's left a huge mess which needs to be tidied up pretty urgently and should have been planned before making the split. The individual neighbourhoods point to different articles and there's no clarifications or distinctions between the three articles which now exist explaining the difference between the three. Basically, users won't be able to find the articles they're looking for or if they do find an article they won't really know what they're looking at. SegataSanshiro1 (talk) 03:02, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
 * "left a huge mess" - any example? Eldizzino (talk) 03:09, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
 * , this is standard practice for Tobias Conradi, there's a lot of stuff that might just be better moved back as it's unlikely that incoming links have been cleaned out. &mdash; Spaceman  Spiff  14:56, 26 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Eldizzino - It is unclear what is meant by "subdivisions" and the distinction between barrios and comunas, while there is only a disambig link to barrios. There is also no explanation made between Buenos Aires, Greater Buenos Aires and the Province of Buenos Aires (as is the case with almost any article on Buenos Aires) - though for Argentines this difference is obvious, it is not easy to understand for other people. Just try and put yourself in the position of someone who is not from Argentina or Buenos Aires and who is trying to find out more and you will realise that these articles would leave those people more confused than they were before they read them. Also, after the split, there are many links pointing here which should be pointing to the barrios page and vice-versa, which would obviously cause further confusion. Like I said, try and imagine that you're from another country and then all the issues will become apparent. SegataSanshiro1 (talk) 15:42, 26 July 2015 (UTC)
 * If I can make a suggestion: the use of a sidebar-type template showing the different articles showing divisions in the City of Buenos Aires, Greater Buenos Aires and Province of Buenos Aires and then within each of these articles, a more clear explanation specifying what type of division they are referring to and where (province, city or conurbation). That way if someone finds themselves on an article that they were not looking for, they can realise that straight away and then find the appropriate article using the sidebar. SegataSanshiro1 (talk) 18:24, 29 July 2015 (UTC)