Talk:Sunda flying lemur

Scientific Name
What is the source for the given scientific name? The external link uses Cynocephalus variegatus. Since I've seen that elsewhere, I've made it a redirect here. Rigadoun (talk) 16:20, 26 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Most of the modern texts split the two colugo species into two genera, including the primary source for many of our mammal articles, MSW2. - UtherSRG (talk) 10:41, 19 March 2012 (UTC)

Flying Lemur or Colugo
Since the group is known as "colugos", shouldn't this page be titled "Sunda Colugo"? Admittedly, MSW3 gives "Sunda Flying Lemur" as the common name, but it is becoming dated. Personally, I think consistency trumps Groves, but that's just my opinion. –  VisionHolder  « talk »  05:46, 10 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Frankly, I think I was previously in favor of using "flying lemur" because of Groves, but looking at the large list of references in the article, I think we should change this and the other species to use colugo, and mention the inaccurate term "flying lemur" in the articles. I'll do so either later tonight or tomorrow. - UtherSRG (talk) 10:41, 19 March 2012 (UTC)

reverted per common name. Make a formal move request if so desired. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 > haneʼ 06:16, 20 March 2012 (UTC) no consensus to move. From the discussion below, it appears that usage is divided, that there may be a trend toward Colugo, and that Britannica uses Flying lemur. The usage by Britannica gives a small edge to the lemur name. This can easily be revisited if usage of Colugo keeps increasing but there is no consensus to move at this time. --regentspark (comment) 20:20, 28 March 2012 (UTC) – "flying lemur" is an incorrect term. "colugo" is used extensively in the literature UtherSRG (talk) 08:07, 20 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Sunda flying lemur → Sunda colugo
 * Philippine flying lemur → Philippine colugo


 * Oppose &mdash; "flying lemur" is the WP:COMMONNAME, please do the "google-hits test"; while both names can be mentioned in the text, the article's title should reflect common usage. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 > haneʼ 08:10, 20 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Support &mdash; The name "flying lemur" is misleading, plus since 2005 on Google Scholar the word "colugo" has nearly caught up with "flying lemur" (202 vs. 240). Also, the more recent we get with those searches, the more "colugo" starts to take over.  From from 2009 until present on Google Scholar yields 94 "colugo" and 87 "flying lemur".  –  Maky  « talk » 15:08, 20 March 2012 (UTC)
 * There still is WP:COMMONNAME which is more important. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 > haneʼ 10:43, 24 March 2012 (UTC)
 * WP:COMMONNAME still does not solve the problem. The name, according to the Google search results, has been in the process of changing for the last 3 or 4 years.  All that's said about this is: "If the name of a person, group, object, or other article topic changes then more weight should be given to the name used in reliable sources published after the name change than in those before the change."  Otherwise searching Google without restricting date ranges will always bias the results in favor of names that have historically been used longer or even just slightly more.  WP:COMMONNAME goes on to say: "When there is no single obvious term that is obviously the most frequently used for the topic, as used by a significant majority of reliable English language sources, editors should reach a consensus as to which title is best by considering the questions indicated above."  One of those questions involves "Precision"—the term "flying lemur" is absolutely not precise.  As for "Recognizability" and "Naturalness", most people have never heard of a "flying lemur"—I know because I frequently ask visitors at the Duke Lemur Center if they've heard of them, and I've never had a person answer "yes".  Therefore going by WP:COMMONNAME, I think we need to reach consensus, and IMO the important questions per that guideline suggest we should use the word "colugo". –  Maky  « talk » 16:05, 25 March 2012 (UTC)
 * I know more people who are familiar with "flying lemur", therefore it's the common name, and according to the guideline, it should be used. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 > haneʼ 17:08, 25 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Are they more familiar with "flying lemur", or more familiar with "lemur", and therefore "flying lemur" would "make more sense" than some obscure foreign word? Unfortunately, I don't think it's possible to argue for or against the "more familiar" argument with hard data because no one has ever conducted a formal survey.  What we can talk about reliably is precision and recent trends in the academic literature.  But ultimately, just the two of us cannot decide this issue alone. –  Maky  « talk » 17:22, 25 March 2012 (UTC)
 * (ec) Well, I might know more people who are familiar with vliegende katten, so that's the common name. In seriousness, I'm not really decided on this one. If I had to choose on my own, I'd certainly use "colugo": these animals do not fly and certainly are not lemurs, and their uniqueness is better reflected by a unique name. But on Wikipedia we also have to take into consideration what the common name is, and historically "flying lemur" certainly seems to have been used more. However, "colugo" has recently been used more in reliable sources, but I'm not sure whether it's become common enough. Ucucha (talk) 17:31, 25 March 2012 (UTC)


 * Comment Common usage does appear quite divided. Personally I am far more familiar with the term Colugo than Flying Lemur. Would it be a good idea to look at how other tertiary sources treat it, both general encyclopaedias and perhaps encyclopaedias of mammals? The online Britannica (which I'm assuming as online as being up to date) uses Flying Lemur. CMD (talk) 17:50, 25 March 2012 (UTC)


 * Comment Note WP:FAUNA. Specifically: "When what is the most common name in English, or the veracity of that most common name, is so disputed in reliable sources that it cannot be neutrally ascertained, prefer the common name most used (orthography aside) by international zoological nomenclature authorities over regional ones. When no consensus can be reached on the most common name, use the scientific name." ENeville (talk) 16:30, 28 March 2012 (UTC)
 * And based on that, ENeville, what do you think should be done? - UtherSRG (talk) 17:06, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Wall of text
Wow, Wall of Text. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.110.173.190 (talk) 03:29, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Reference not found in the library
I'm very concerned because the reference below is not found in the Universiti Malaysia Sarawak library; Is this person trying to boost for personal interest and faking the data?115.133.58.142 (talk) 01:58, 13 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Dzulhelmi, M.N. (2010). Behaviour and Ecology of the Sunda Colugo (Galeopterus variegatus). MSc. Dissertations. Universiti Malaysia Sarawak, Kota Samarahan.


 * I believe this is because it is a dissertation. You may have to find it by asking for it specifically from the librarian, or find out from the department head where dissertations are stored. - UtherSRG (talk) 10:41, 19 March 2012 (UTC)