Talk:Sunnyside, Queens

Redirect needed? Should the articles be merged?
Sunnyside_Gardens,_Queens article also exsists, same subject. Should there be a merger or redirect? 74.178.203.117 (talk) 05:00, 25 June 2009 (UTC)


 * NO! This is NOT the same subject.  Sunnyside is a neighborhood in Queens County, NY; Sunnyside Gardens is a specific world-renowned historic district within that neighborhood.  The fact that the wider neighborhood takes its name from the famous garden city movement development it overlays does not make it the same subject anymore than New York City, which likewise predates and lies within New York State, is the same subject as the state.  The Sunnyside Gardens entry is, surprisingly, only a stub at this point.  But given its significance in urban planning and suburban development history, I think we can assume it will be expanded upon. TheCormac (talk) 21:16, 11 July 2009 (UTC)


 * I agree that they should not be merged for the same reasons. Sunnyside Gardens is not a recognized as a "town" i.e. it doesn't have its own postal code or other public services but has significant historical importance as an early planned urban space. I think that should be the emphasis of the Sunnyside Gardens article, along with any other information that is specific to the Sunnyside Gardens complex. Sunnyside is the town that encompasses Sunnyside Gardens and should reflect all the facts and information about it as a neighborhood in New York City. Dialt0ne (talk) 17:33, 19 July 2009 (UTC)


 * I agree to WP:BOLDLY merge. Epicgenius (talk) 15:01, 4 November 2014 (UTC)

Sunnyside's borders
Dear folks: The borders of Sunnyside are very precise: 36th St. (west border), 50th St. (east), Barnett Ave. (north), and Greenpoint Ave. (south). Addresses south of Greenpoint Ave. and toward the Expressway, cemeteries, and Maspeth have always been "Woodside, New York." Addresses north of Barnett Ave. read "Long Island City, New York." Thus, Sunnyside does NOT border on Astoria and Maspeth neighborhoods.


 * Phipps Garden Apartments is just outside the 50th Street border you mention - it goes from 50th St. on the west to 52nd St. between Barnett Ave on the north and 39th Ave. It was South of Barnett but had a Long Island City address (11104 later on)  According to Clarence Stein in his book "Toward New Towns for America" Phipps was built on "the property originally purchased for Sunnyside."Revmoran 16:04, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

You're quite correct that in some cases one or two blocks just outside the boundaries mentioned above are still officially Sunnyside (mostly for historical reasons). But there is a recognized boundary for Sunnyside. The overall point I wanted to make was that Sunnyside does NOT touch the Maspeth and Astoria neighborhoods of Queens (which one contributor claimed). That is impossible.


 * The Queens Library page on Sunnyside disagrees with the borders mentioned above. To quote "The Sunnyside branch serves the area bounded by Skillman Ave. to the north, the Queens-Midtown Expressway to the south, 30th Street to the west, and 52nd Street to the east." Dialt0ne 04:05, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

The Queens Library's message page has absolutely nothing to do with official borders of neighborhoods in Queens. In the example you cite, the library is simply giving the Sunnyside branch's service area: it serves parts of Woodside and even Long Island City (addresses south of Greenpoint Ave. are officially "Woodside, NY" and those west of 36th are "Long Is. City, NY") because it is so much closer. The Woodside branch of the Queens library is off Roosevelt Ave., at least a mile away, and would be a hassle for these Woodside residents to access. The New York Times and other media regularly publish maps of NYC neighborhoods for news articles, and Sunnyside's boundaries are always drawn within the parameters described above: 36th (sometimes 38th), Barnett, 50th, and Greenpoint. Only this area's addresses read "Sunnyside, NY." Large apartment buildings that overlap these boundaries often have all units within a Sunnyside address for historical reasons, but this is the only exception. Also, addresses south of Greenpoint Ave. and east of 50th St. have a different zip code, are served by the Woodside post office, and they all say "Woodside, NY".


 * The Hunter College Department of Urban Affairs & Planning has also published a map  (see page 2 of the fact sheet) as part of developing a community plan  for Sunnyside. The borders of the plan go to 52nd street on the east end and all the way to the expressway on the south end. While I don't completely disagree with the boundaries that you present, the term "very precise" is poor language with a) no references and b) many groups choosing to define different boundaries. If you have links, scans, etc. of the maps published by "The New York Times and other media", it would make your statements more concrete. Dialt0ne 05:39, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

DialtOne, many maps show different concepts of Sunnyside (recent issues of the Yellow Pages included). We're not talking about concepts, even Hunter College's "community plan," but what are historical, "precise" boundaries for the neighborhood that affect the address on an envelope: If you ever rent an apartment on "52nd St." or even "all the way to the expressway", the address your landlord will give you is "Woodside, NY"--not Sunnyside, but Woodside, NY. ("Sunnyside, NY" is within the above boundaries I give above except for large apartment buildings overlapping the boundaries). Every landlord, homeowner, and real estate agent in Sunnyside and Woodside is aware of these boundaries, and the U.S. Post Office observes them, as does the New York Times and other informed sources. As a rental agent once told me: "She lives on 43rd St. and 50th Ave., over in Woodside." The boundaries are, repeat, "very precise". As a native New Yorker yourself (who is aware of Sunnyside's history as a separate town), you of all people should get this.


 * I can see that you feel very stong about Sunnyside's borders. However, you have not cited sources for the points you provide. I will whole heartedly agree with you if you can provide verifable facts, from reliable sources. Until then, I'll just have to disagree with "you" (since you are Anonymous) that Sunnyside's borders are not "very precise". Dialt0ne 01:36, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

You can agree or not. These are the historical boundaries of Woodside and Sunnyside. If I fill out my envelope for a building at the corner of 43rd St. and 43rd Ave., it always says "Sunnyside, NY," but if I fill it out for a place at the corner of 52nd Street and 43rd Ave., or 43rd St. and 50th Ave., it's "Woodside, NY." Addresses for pizza parlors, drugstores, hardware stores, and supermarkets (you name it) follow this same rule. End of discussion.

The New York Times Real Estate Section puts the south border at 47th Ave. It does not inlcude Phipps Garden Apartments as part of Sunnyside (see above)  Click on the map for the detail. Revmoran 03:26, 23 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Great find! Specifically - on February 2, 2007 the map in New York Times Real-Estate section on-line specifically shows the boundaries of Sunnyside as follows: the western boundary as 39th Street, the eastern boundary as 50th Street, the southern boundary as 47th Ave and the northern boundary in two parts - from 39th St. to 43rd St. it is Skillman Avenue and from 43rd St. to 50th St. it is Barnett Avenue. Considering the anonymous user above cites the NYT as thier authoritative source and it does not match the strict lines they attempted to draw, I believe that it can clearly be said that Sunnyside's borders are not "very precise". Dialt0ne 05:04, 24 February 2007 (UTC)

The borders are precise enough, and older NYT maps use Greenpoint Ave. as the boundary. And you refuse to acknowledge the main point: addresses outside the "very precise boundaries" say "Woodside, NY" and not "Sunnyside, NY". The historical boundaries have not changed, even in 2007.


 * Sorry, but you're missing MY point completely. If I can point out several sources - including the sources you reference - that all have different definitions of what Sunnyside's borders are, then who defines what Sunnyside's borders are? You? An anonymous user on wikipedia? I think not. And I wouldn't dare ask for the post office's definition of what Sunnyside is, as we're all Long Island City as far as they are concerned. If there were several reliable, confirmed sources that were all in agreement of what the border of Sunnyside are, then we wouldn't be discussing this. Since that doesn't exist, you cannot define Sunnyside's borders with any precision.

I do understand your point, and even agree to a certain extent. But you're missing mine, which refers to precision: the boundaries of Woodside and Sunnyside are old--very, very old--and the official addresses we all use in 2007 reflect these "very precise" boundaries. Many blocks might have the "feel" of Sunnyside, or are so contiguous that Hunter's or another study group would include them as part of "Sunnyside". But that doesn't change what the precise borders are, what the post office uses (by the way, after complaints from residents, the PO officially adopted Queens neighborhood names several years ago and now observes the old, precise boundaries of Sunnyside, Astoria, Rego Park, etc., to determine an address; the previous "LIC/Flushing/Jamaica" distinctions in Queens aren't "official" anywhere now), how they're discussed by real estate agents, and Sunnyside and Woodside residents. In summary: I didn't make the borders up--they're on your envelope!

Greenpoint Avenue is the south border of Sunnyside. I live south of Greenpoint Ave and my address is Woodside and if I need to pick up a package I must travel to 61st street Woodside post office. I live less then one block from the Sunnyside PO though.

--Umm, I live south of Greenpoint Ave and I 1). My address was given to my as Sunnyside, 2. I picked up my mail at the Sunnyside Post Office. So....you're wrong. --208.120.212.151 (talk) 02:27, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

NYTimes puts this debate to rest - there are no official borders. Dialt0ne (talk) 21:29, 2 March 2012 (UTC)

Fuzzy Borders

Q. Where can I find the official borders of Chelsea, Riverdale, Park Slope and other neighborhoods in the five boroughs?

A. They don’t exist.

...

But most New York’s neighborhood boundaries are a matter of local opinion. Ask residents on a border block what neighborhood they live in and you’re likely to get different answers. Much of yesterday’s Little Italy is today’s Chinatown. The Department of City Planning, the authority on the city’s official maps and names, does not specify official neighborhood boundaries.

other calls to fame
the movie "raising helen" was almost entirely filmed in sunnyside, queens. The main character's apartment was in my grandma's apartment building! thanx.--Dlo2012 (talk) 23:12, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Demographics
"Sunnyside is 48.0% White, 28.0% Hispanic/Latino (of any race), 24.0% Asian."

The above demographics are much too vague and needs more specifics. What percentage of Sunnyside's population is black? Or Middle Eastern? As diverse as Sunnyside is (and I live in Queens, I know how diverse this neighborhood is), I'm having a very hard time believing that only whites, Latinos and Asians live in the neighborhood. Please fix these statistics. Thanks.

I'm from Sunnyside and have hardly ever seen black people there. Don't know why. I don't remember having any in my elementary school. There are many ethnicities but I guess not all races. There are Middle Easterners though, but maybe they're part of the White category? And what about Indians for example, are they part of the Asian category? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.54.107.200 (talk) 22:02, 20 February 2017 (UTC)

Can this be so?: "Sunnyside is 48.0% White, 28.0% Hispanic/Latino (of any race), 24.0% Asian." That's very hard to believe. Please provide census data. Autodidact1 (talk) 08:45, 23 November 2017 (UTC)


 * Reply to both comments above: That is what the source says. According to this source, only 2% of Queens Community Board 2 (Woodside and Sunnyside) is African American. epicgenius (talk) 18:51, 1 August 2018 (UTC)

Yes, I understand that the black population is small, but those that just simply point out how small this population is are missing the point entirely. This quote: "Sunnyside is 48.0% White, 28.0% Hispanic/Latino (of any race), 24.0% Asian" suggests that there are ZERO black people that live in Sunnyside, which simply isn't true. It also leaves out people from other regions of the globe, such as the Middle East for example. I don't care how large or small a demographic is, if you're gonna give population statistics, state the facts, not generalizations.

Sunnyside Gantry's Renovation Photo Update Request
Sunnyside's gantry has been renovated and the photo should be updated but I don't know how to do it so someone else should. This is the new version and it's also a better picture than the current one, here you can see the name better. https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5725062a859fd0c265e62244/t/5846d769be6594c4abacb10f/1481037710128/ 108.54.107.200 (talk) 22:13, 20 February 2017 (UTC)

Demographics - disputed text
I have comments regarding the following text in the "Demographics" section:

"Queens is one of the most ethnically diverse urban areas in the world. Sunnyside's residents are also ethnically diverse and include people of Albanian, Algerian, Armenian, Bangladeshi, Bulgarian, Burmese, Chinese, Colombian, Dominican, Ecuadorian, Egyptian, Filipino, French, Greek, Indian, Iraqi, Irish, Israeli, Italian, Japanese, Korean, Lebanese, Mexican, Moroccan, Nepali, Pakistani, Paraguayan, Peruvian, Puerto Rican, Romanian, Russian, Salvadoran, Thai, Tibetan, Turkish and Vietnamese ancestry."

First, the fact that Queens is one of the most culturally diverse areas in the world is only tangentially relevant, and I say that as a resident of Queens myself. If that sentence was placed in the Middle Village or Howard Beach articles (both about majority-white neighborhoods), it would be irrelevant. Even in places like Sunnyside, this is not the only neighborhood where such diversity can be found. Most of the neighborhoods from here to Flushing are like that. What is the point of emphasizing this particular fact?

Second, I can't find a source for all of these ethnicities. These were provided by an anonymous user, with the summary Added source of this statement (again) which is also on Queens' Wikipedia page but you keep removing it from here. Yes it is relevant and notable when Sunnyside is one of the most ethnically diverse neighborhoods in Queens and is known for this. The ethnicities list isn't "too long" when they all actually live here. I'm not just adding random countries and am making sure there are people in Sunnyside from all of them. I've also been asking around to confirm everything. This may be true, but a reliable published source is needed for this. It doesn't matter if it's a documentary - actually, I think there is a documentary about northwestern Queens being one of the most culturally diverse areas in the world - or if it's a book, news article, website, or other resource. The issue is that all of these ethnicities need a source, and they don't necessarily have to be comprehensive.

TL;DR: The first sentence of the quote may be only tangentially relevant, the second is not sourced. epicgenius (talk) 18:51, 1 August 2018 (UTC)

-

I'd like to expand on this section but might not be doing it correctly. I was specifically trying to emphasize that in addition to Queens being one of the most culturally diverse areas in the world, Sunnyside is one of the most culturally diverse areas in Queens, but you keep deleting/rewording what I write to mean something else. You also improved how some of it was written, so thanks for that.

Sunnyside doesn't have a large ethnic majority from one group compared to some other neighborhoods in Queens (such as Greeks in Astoria, Asians in Flushing, Hispanics in Corona, etc) and is very mixed for just one neighborhood. Most of the countries in the list were there from before, it was long, disorganized and unsourced, no one had a problem with it being that way before and no one edited it, but when I organized it and added a few more you started having a problem with it. Every single one I added is based on a person and/or business I know of from that country. I'm looking for a better source and agree there should be one. I also think there was a documentary or some video about it I remember having seen but can't find it yet. So far I'm mostly finding sites like blogs talking about it, it's not comprehensive and I'm not sure if that's considered a good source anyway. I think the storefront businesses (food and non-food related) are the best proof right now because anyone can see them, including the fact that there's a festival to sample cuisines from local restaurants from these countries. http://www.qns.com/story/2018/05/23/eighth-annual-taste-sunnyside-draws-hundreds-eager-foodies/ says this year there were "over 20 eateries representing the cultural variety of the neighborhood" but I don't know if that means over 20 countries. There's also a walking food tour http://www.noshwalks.com/schedule.htm#may19 that originated in Sunnyside, due to its food diversity I'm assuming. I also know about this from personal experience because I'm originally from Sunnyside, attended P.S. 150 (elementary school), in the past (80s - 90s) my family had two stores and a restaurant in Sunnyside, our food was diverse and so were our customers. Also when my family's house was rented out, I know which countries the tenants came from. I live in Manhattan now but have been asking people who still live in Sunnyside about all this. When I find a better source I'll add it.

Should we combine the two Demographics sections on this Talk page? Because I had something to say/ask about the race percentage data too and am not sure where to post it now. Maybe in the other section. 108.41.131.244 (talk) 15:12, 2 August 2018 (UTC)


 * That makes sense. Thanks for your detailed explanation of why you added the information about ethnicity. Sorry for misunderstanding your edits, I just thought that the fact that Queens' diversity isn't really that relevant. As a resident of Queens myself (albeit a neighborhood that is not as diverse and mostly suburban), I thought it was beside the point. It would have been a non-sequitur, like mentioning that "Breezy Point is the least diverse area in the most diverse borough in the world."
 * Regarding the 2 demographic sections, I think you should post your other comment, about race, above. I already combined the sections (which were separate, but asked pretty much the same question about race), and I replied to them. epicgenius (talk) 23:30, 3 August 2018 (UTC)

Can I upload better pictures of the gantry and PS150?
The gantry is rusted in the picture but it has since been repainted. And I have a picture of PS150 without the graffiti van. Mpcoder (talk) 13:22, 12 February 2022 (UTC)