Talk:Super Smash Bros. Brawl/Archive 13

May 30th Update
Hmm, so the Super Scope is back. And now you can move around while firing it? Interesting... Disaster Kirby 07:54, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
 * The update seems to be saying you can move while using any shooting item now.
 * We’ve included rapid-fire items like the Super Scope once again. This time, though, you can walk and even jump while shooting these weapons!
 * I'm guessing it'll apply to weapons like the gun with the green ray awell, but that's specuation. For now, Let's not say you can move while using the Super Scope, but you can move while using shooting weapons.--Viridistalk 08:05, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

This is interisting, but is the update that big a deal? Anubiz 12:31, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Clearly it is. Since you couldn't move with items like that in the last game. -Sukecchi 13:46, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

You mean the Ray Gun Viridis. Angry Sun 15:45, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

Layisers nice. Anubiz 16:42, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

Wouldn't mentioning the ability to move while shooting be considered game guideish? Vilerocks 17:00, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
 * No because it would be pointing to a change between an earlier game in the series. --myselfalso 17:34, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

Point taken but, we nead everything we can git. Anubiz 17:02, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
 * And no, we don't need everything we can get. Not all of the information being released about Brawl is necessarily encyclopedic.  --myselfalso 17:35, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

But we are just gitting bits and peases. Anubiz 20:00, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes, we are just getting bits and pieces. Eventually the game is going to be released, and when it is, and when someone completes the game, then all the information that is considered encyclopedic will finally be in the article. Until then, we really don't need everything we can get.  The article has substantial length as it is.  --myselfalso 22:18, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

Developer
This notice is now on the official website:

"This is the official site for the Wii game Super Smash Bros. Brawl — a place where I offer personal, straight-from-the-creator reports on the project. -Masahiro Sakurai (Sora Ltd.)"

I highly doubt that Sakurai would go out of his way to mention Sora Ltd. on the site unless that studio was developing the game. All evidence points toward Sora being the developer: HAL has not made any sort of official statement about SSBB. Sakurai has made many, and we know he's part of Sora. We know that Nintendo funded a brand-new studio in order to develop SSBB, and lo and behold, that's right around the time Sakurai says Sora was created. In addition, we know Sora is working on several "unnamed projects", with Sakurai as head. I think a monkey could make the connection here. Can we pull out the common sense clause and end this "Unknown developer" nonsense now? Phediuk 13:39, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

I don't think so. Anubiz 13:47, 30 May 2007 (UTC)


 * No. No other website lists Sora as the developer...they all use Nintendo because they don't know who is developing the game.  We would be making an assumption that Sora is developing the game.  For all we know, Sakurai is merely mentioning his own company to promote it.  While common sense seems to be the logical course, this is something that needs to be verified, and not even IGN-type sites will use Sora as the developer.  The game is slated to come out some time this year- and it certainly won't get cancelled; there's no rush to uploading the information.  When it's announced, it's announced and then it can be put on the article.  --myselfalso 14:20, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

They wont tell us untill we have to. Bluefire princess 20:22, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

Azula has a point, we won't konw untill they have to tell us. Anubiz 22:02, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

Sora is one of the companies that DEFINATELY cant be the SSBB developer. Sakurai said in 'How This Game Came To Be Made' that it's a new Nintendo subsidiary that is working on it. He also states that the core of which is a company that are full of fans of SSBM and just completed a major game. Sora is owned by Sakurai, not Nintendo, and it has not just completed a major game. 60.228.192.105 02:43, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

IP Don't freaking start it. Sakurai is working on it and he is the CEO for SORA. Angry Sun 02:49, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Just because Al Gore is on the Google and Apple board doesn't mean Google and Apple developed an Inconvenient Truth. Saying that Sora is the dev is not only speculation, but is infactual. 60.228.192.105 03:00, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Lead Paragraph
As I stated earlier in the now archived version of the discussion, I'm trying to improve (mostly by expanding) the opening paragraph as per WP:LEAD, since an article of this length needs a longer opening. Of course, I don't feel that what I have is sufficient, so I'm not adding it in yet. Any help is appreciated. My rough draft can be found here. -TwilightPhoenix 02:29, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Meditate on the subiut. (He asked for any help) Anubiz 02:42, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Not bad, just one suggestion. Try to use "slated" as few times as possible :) Powerslave (talk-contribs) 07:04, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Picture yourself as someone who knows nothing about Smash Bros series. Don't assume they are already fans. Zojo 15:30, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks to those who improved it, I think it looks great now. Any objections/alterations needed before I add it? -TwilightPhoenix 17:56, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

May 31st update
Another item: The Cracker Launcher. "After you grab this item, it’ll rapidly release blast after blast of firecrackers that explode gaudily. You can walk around and jump while holding the launcher. You can also aim the launcher at different angles by tilting the Control Stick up or down."

They mention the control stick, but they still don't tell us what controller. Ah well. Disaster Kirby 08:31, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

the mention of the control stick at least rules out using the wiimote sideways, as was suggested in an archive somewhere. Djchallis 08:34, 31 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Another thing: Is it absolutely necessary to add every new detail given? By the release of the game (especially if they continue with this pattern of pushing back the release), we're likley going to be overflowing with unencyclopedic "filler" info. I think we ought to be more judgemental about what is important and what is not. For instance, I've integrated the bit about the Cracker Launcher to make the paragraph flow, but I really don't think that mention was necessary.  You Can '  t See Me!  08:45, 31 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I would personally think that the Wii Remote was ocmpletely ruled out, as is the Nunchuk. Can you imagine playing Smash bros with the Remote/Nunchuk setup? 84.13.127.171 09:01, 31 May 2007 (UTC) Mojanboss
 * Yes, as a matter of fact, I can. It's not that hard to imagine playing a game with a controller. In any case, that is speculation.  You Can '  t See Me!  09:08, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

i don't remember where, but someone said they didn't want to "alienate players familiar with the (Gamecube) controller" and that adding Wiimote sensor functions made it too complicated. i don't have the time to dig up the links and sources, but i think they've been referenced again and again. FyreNWater 09:19, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
 * That doesn't eliminate the use of the Wii Remote completely, though. It could mean something as simple as a button/analog-only interface (no motion sensing), for instance, which is still possible on the Wii Remmote.  You Can '  t See Me!  09:24, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Ase they drieing us lunnie on perpuis? Anubiz 10:53, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Is it the bazooka from Kirby's Air Ride? It has the same function and Kirby is holding it the same way. - Joshua368 12:31, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

I think he is right. Anubiz 12:38, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

i think a small mention of some of the newer items wouldn't go amiss, even if it's just listing them mid-paragraph (i.e. "some new items include the cracker launcher, etc...). the wii-mote nunchuck combination has not been ruled out, since it has enough buttons to keep the smash bros basics and does indeed have a thumb-stick.  i don't sakurai's passing mention is enough information to conclude anything, or at least not anything article-worthy. Djchallis 12:57, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

They are driving is loony on purpose aren't they? Anubiz 13:21, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

For veteran players, Nintendo announced that Brawl would use Gamecube Controllers. This doesn't defeat the idea that other controllers could be used however...

As for the new weapon, wouldn't hitting up result in a jump? I think they meant to say the C-stick, because it would be a pain to have to keep moving around just to try aiming a weapon (think Terminator II on 32x... *shudders*) Dark Ermac 13:30, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Terminator? Anyway that sounds pretty good but technically it is speculation. Anubiz 13:37, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

It seems as if this section has gone into ?controller? again. "Didn't want to alienate those familiar with the pad..." obviously means the GC conroller. I doubt that the Wiimote plus Nunchuk will be used. The only reason why I would think it would is because they don't want people to have to buy a conroller to play this game. In my opinion Characters and items should be listed on, well, a list. No info. Just list the references and people can go to the official site for the full story (so far it's a better site for info than wikipedia right now. Shame on you)  Zojo 15:28, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Responce one lets not specluate. Anubiz 15:38, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Do we really need to have a post on this talk page every day because DoJo has a new update? Seriously, a big update would be about characters or game modes. When it's all said and done, the Cracker Launcher is only going to have maybe a line in the article. --myselfalso 15:46, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Agreed unless we get a future update that confirms a new newcomer we shouldn't continue making talk sections for each and every update. Anubiz 16:03, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

The bazooka I do believe was from Kirby's Air Raid, and it works double here: The fireworks attack was also in a Kirby game. It was a dual-element ability in Kirby 64 (I think Fire/Lightining, not too sure). Jake52 My talk 20:35, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

No that is wrong, the fire/lighting combo is a light saber,just leave it as is.--User:Entei- Anubis It was Fire/Bomb Jake and E A The light saber was Spark/Cutter. Anubiz 21:15, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Thats besides the point,it just isnt worth mentioning..--User:Entei-Anubis

I'm jsut wondering, if they do decide to go with the gamecube controler, then what are all the new nintendo users who do not have gamecube controlers goign to do? They arn't in production in England anymore, as even GAME do not sell them. This would mean a lot of people simply could not get the game. Thankfully I still have two working gamecube controlers. This makes me believe the wiimote+nunchuck are perfectly usable (and i've even tried to see what it would feel like... heh). --Brendoshi 18:53, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

There is NO reason to think you won't be able to use the wii remote and nunchuck to play the game. It was said that they wouldn't alienate the veteran players by allowing use of a gamecube controller, but that doesnt mean you HAVE to use the gamecube controller.DurinsBane87 17:51, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

It does when the freaking creator states that you will use the GC Controller for the MAIN Game. Angry Sun 17:54, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Find me that statement. All I've read is where he says that gamecube controllers will be useable to avoid alienating veteran players. That could very easily mean that you can use both controllers, especially since the Brawl site still uses the wii remote smbol for the "How to Play" section.DurinsBane87 17:58, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Hugely Anticipated Brawler?
I am a subscriber to Nintendo Power, and as such, I receive e-mail updates on each coming issue. Just yesterday, I got an e-mail that said that the next issue would have "news on a hugely anticipated brawler," with a screenshot from the first trailer (the same one we have under the "Characters" section) nearby the text. My only question -- who could this hugely anticipated brawler be? With no name given, it is highly likely, if not inevitable, that this is a new character announcement, most likely Sonic the Hedgehog.

I know that this is merely speculation (which is forbidden), but, being Brawl-related and very possibly a new character announcement, I thought that I had some kind of responsibility to tell the people here at Wikipedia. So keep your eyes peeled for the next NP. Teamrocketspy621 19:30, 31 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Or it could be a brawler who is hugely anticipated simply because he/she is so beloved from the previous game(s) and has yet to be confirmed. Frankly, this could be anything, but any news is good news. --Bishop2 19:37, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
 * When would the next issue come, then? Erik Jensen (Appreciate 19:41, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Not completely sure. But I'll post anything I find here when it arrives. Unless someone else has already gotten it and beats me to the punch. Teamrocketspy621 19:44, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

I received the same e-mail, and it says, word for word, "Super Smash Bros. Website Debuts - News on the Hugely Anticipated Brawler!" In my opinion, "Brawler" seems to be referring to the game itself, since "Brawler" can be another name to call a fighting game. Sorry to kills your hopes like that. Disaster Kirby 19:59, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Release Date
Before you say "We don't know the release date!" I have good news, so please read this before replying:

According to Jeux-France.com, in this article: http://www.jeux-france.com/news20454_mario-kart-wii-annonce-a-l-e3-.html The release dates for Brawl will be released to the public at E3. This site is not known to spread false rumors, nor has it ever been proven not to be credible. Yes, yes, the word "Rumeur" appears a few times, but this whole article doesn't seem so far-fetched to me. Anywho, this doesn't need to be mentioned in Brawl's article anywhere, just thought that I'd give some people a heads-up. Teamrocketspy621 16:20, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

And I thought I was gubble. Anubiz 16:22, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

Actually it makes sense. If Brawl really is going to be released in 2007 like Dojo says, they would have to release a specific date soon. Powerslave (talk-contribs) 17:07, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

But when they put "Planned for a 2007 Release" doesn't make me feel better. Saying that leaves the option that they may not be able to release it 2007. Basically, "we're planning to but it might not happen..." is the impression I'm getting. (Zojo 18:36, 1 June 2007 (UTC))

I beleieve thats called the Twiilight Princess effect. We wont know until they offically give an exact date so theres no point in disscussing it further.--User:Entei-Anubis

amazon state that the release date will be june the 30th, and have done for a very long time. They've never got the release dates wrong for anything i've pre-ordered before, so could thnis be the right one? If so, then only 29 days to go >.>--Brendoshi 19:00, 1 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Like any other store, they probably just put that date as a filler date. Nintendo hasn't announced the release date yet, so as far as I'm concerned, all dates listed on such websites have been and still are fake. Disaster Kirby 21:53, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Delfino Plaza pic?
Should we replace the battlefield pic withh Delfino Plaza? I was wondering if this could be a possiblity. If we can't, should we add the pic with Battlefield? undefinedOBEY STARMAN 17:35, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

I like it the way it is. Anubiz 17:59, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

I don't. I think the article is shameful. It needs to be reconstructed into an article based on the catagories of the official site and the way the article was before the update. (Zojo 18:11, 1 June 2007 (UTC))
 * This article looks like a 12 yearold chainsawed it. We really should restore it to its orgins. undefinedOBEY STARMAN 18:13, 1 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I didn't know Jason had a son... AFAIK, the article in its original status had sourcing based on the Dojo site in its original status, and now that the Dojo site is all different, getting it to the way it was originally is impossible. I think. Erik Jensen (Appreciate 18:17, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

I think it's a slop job because we've just been adding stuff to it (except someone deleted the character list and in place wrote a sloppy paragragh). I think it doesn't need additions or deletions from it, just a whole recontruction. (do we really need anything about Sonic except that he's the most requested 3rd party character?) (Zojo 18:34, 1 June 2007 (UTC))


 * Then instead of complaining about it, be bold and fix the damn page. And I think we should have a Delfino Plaza pic.  --myselfalso 21:29, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

The scene changes on Delfino Plaza so 1 picture probably won't do it justice. And, please, someone be bold (65.41.108.140 22:28, 1 June 2007 (UTC))

Why doesnt this IP get a real username? People will take you more seriously if you do, (when I see a IP all i think is "VANDAL")..--User:Entei-Anubis
 * The stages section is pretty small and looks like it doesn't need to be any bigger than it currently is in text quantity... which means we shouldn't have two stage images in the section (one for Battlefield, one for Delfino Plaza), there's barely enough room for one pic as it is. Perhaps then we need to decide which picture should be chosen over the other to be shown in the stage section? I would vote for keeping the Battlefield pic as it is because that stage is far more thematically and symbolically attached to Brawl and the whole SSB series, and Delfino is only one of what could be many new sensational stages based on various game franchises to be revealed before the release. Erik Jensen (Appreciate 17:54, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Fire Emblem stage
I see there's no mention of it in the Stages section. Why is this when the castle – which was almost certainly Daein – was shown on one of the earlier trailers? Ashnard  Talk  10:18, 2 June 2007 (UTC)


 * I see that it says "the interior and exterior of a gloomy castle", although it is highly probable by the standards/flags on the castle that it is Daein. Ashnard   Talk  10:21, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Because saying it is a Fire Emblem stage without any proof is speculation. -Sukecchi 11:44, 2 June 2007 (UTC)


 * I don't like to be a pain, but where is the proof for the other stages then? Only Battlefield and Shadow Moses are sourced. Does that mean that the other stages are speculative? Ashnard   Talk  11:48, 2 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Yeah, that's a bit odd. We had a note saying that Pit's stage was confirmed since it was a Palutena statue, and that's the same situation. Seems the note (and any mention of the stage) is gone at the moment though. Gurko 12:39, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
 * On a technicality it would still count as speculation or original research for Pit's stage. To stay barely within the line it'll probably need two or more citations that are very similar in detail. For Pit's stage, a comparison picture of Palutena is enough. In the article it should use words that aren't definitive, like "supposedly" or "it appears that.." - Zero1328 Talk? 12:55, 2 June 2007 (UTC)


 * If there were a picture of a Daein flag/standard used as a source, could the "gloomy castle" then be identified as a Fire Emblem castle? Thanks. Ashnard   Talk  19:53, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

I think we should just remove the speculation from the stages. We can add the stages when they're released on the site. They will be eventually, so there's no need to go through all this. Lets delete the unconfirmed stuff.DurinsBane87 19:59, 2 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Seconded, keep things that are definite (gloomy castle, stage with changing seasons, stage with crumbling platforms) while removing speculation (that the above three are Fire Emblem, Yoshi Stage, Palutena) until the site confirms it.--Viridistalk 20:31, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

This raises difficulties since it would be difficult to describe the Yoshi or Mario Kart stages without making references to the actual series or character. Ashnard  Talk  20:41, 2 June 2007 (UTC)


 * It's not the Daine flag, it just looks like the Dain flag. It has a different symbol. nindb.classicgaming.gamespy.com Look there 60.228.192.105 02:55, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Stage in the Nintendo 2006 Tour Trailer
In the Nintendo 2006 Tour Trailer there was shown a stage of giant bloody atlas-esque people holding platforms in what looked like a dimly lit cave. Should this be added to the stage list??


 * There's currently indecision (in a way) as to what to include and it hasd been suggested that all stages that haven't been confirmed by Nintendo should be deleted. However, this would leave only Delfino Plaza, Battlefield and Shadow Moses despite the numerous other stages seen in trailers. Ashnard   Talk  21:40, 2 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Leading back to the stages section, should we go for an all-out deletion of non-confirmed stages or should we describe the stage and not speculate upon which series/character it represents. As stated above, there are some difficulties with the latter. Ashnard   Talk  08:44, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

Exactly. You can't mention the Yoshi's Island stage without saying that it's from Yoshi's Island, it's practically impossible. The same goes with the Mario Circuit Stage. I say we just go with a full fledged deletion of every stage that hasn't truly been confirmed. All that should remain should be Battlefield, Delfino Plaza, and Shadow Moses. This will leave the Stage Section a bit baron, but it will get bigger in the next few weeks, don't you think??68.195.110.145 15:59, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, I agree, although I'll wait a bit to see what other people say about it before deleting speculative info. Ashnard  Talk  16:23, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

Character Section
The char. section needs ALOT of cleaning up. I dont know who decided to jam it into an unorganized paragraph, but it needs to be changed. Let's bring it back to the old way, character by character, only let's shorten it a bit and add the details in the Character's own article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.146.101.31 (talk • contribs)


 * I 2nd that Anubiz 21:46, 2 June 2007 (UTC)


 * I 3rd that Vilerocks 21:46, 2 June 2007 (UTC)


 * I 4th that User:Entei-Anubis


 * Then fix it instead of writing about it on the talk page. I'm tired of people complaining about the article, but doing nothing to fix it.  --myselfalso 23:11, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Diu you rilly want me tue fix it. Anubiz 23:17, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

TTN said this version is better...Angry Sun 23:19, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Well guess what, TTN is not my superior. Vilerocks 23:22, 2 June 2007 (UTC)


 * We're going for an encyclopedic description and overview. Going into very specific details is just pointless. The list in the series article links to the that information. The current section's writing and arrangement isn't the best, but it works. TTN 23:22, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

The phrase "isn't the best" points out somethings hould be done. Vilerocks 23:28, 2 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Something such as making the prose flow better, and making it more than just a small list is what should be done. That doesn't require bringing in cruft. TTN 23:30, 2 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Please keep the conversation under the right headers. --myselfalso 14:29, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

I'm saying this on the talk section because whenever I add something without posting my decision here it ALWAYS gets deleted. And I'm not saying to bring back the whole two paragraph section for each character, just do what you did with the newcomers to the veterans.68.195.110.145 15:01, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

I tried fixing it up a bit. It is by no means perfect, but we need to fix it up! It looks awful. Unknownlight 17:30, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

It still needs fixing badly. I mean badly. We have the veterans jumbled up messily into who knows what. Mario Kirby and Pikachu have close to nothing about them other than their names. Couldn't we mention at least Mario and Kirby's final smashes? And next we have Link Samus and Fox with a bit more details but still...still....AAAAHH! I can't even explain it! In general, the whole thing is VERY unbalanced and messy. It looks like someone took the original char. sec, demolished it with a bulldozer, then did a shoddy job of cleaning up the rubble. I don't mean to be so metaphoric but, yea it needs refining.68.195.110.145 17:41, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm wondering if we should just revert the characters section into their original forms before it was jumbled up into one paragraph... Unknownlight 17:50, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

I have made it even more general now. This is just an overview of the characters. We don't need specifics (Only Samus is needed to show a major differences). Even when new characters are added, they shouldn't all go there. We just need to update it and make it more general as we receive information. TTN 17:55, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
 * The only reason all of the characters are there now is because we don't know that many. As we get more, we can change examples, but we won't add all of them. TTN 17:57, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

Reorganizing the Article
It appears to me that this article is having lots of debate over what to do for the daily updates, so I had an idea. Why not make lists for these updates? Kinda like the ones on the Halo 3 page! Make lists for confirmed stages, confirmed items, confirmed characters, and just add the new update daily, with a small description next to it.

EX: Items: Gooey Bomb - ''A bomb that sticks to players and the ground. Can be transferred by touch'' Next Item - Next description

And so on. Thoughts?

Ragingtsunami726 21:48, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

Well I agree on one thing. This page is a mess. I don't think a bunch of users making small changes is going to help it, it almost needs a complete rewrite. J M  J  21:51, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
 * If we're going to rewrite the entire article, the best time to do it is after E3 and much more information is released. Unknownlight 23:09, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

When's E3? Ragingtsunami726 00:45, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Soon. Just hold youre horses. Anubiz 01:10, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

I don't have a horse. Vilerocks 03:54, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

E3 is July 11-13. Unknownlight 04:17, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

I think adding the updates to paragraphs is a bad idea. I think someone (not me, I don't have the time or know-how) needs to fix the article. Characters should be mentioned on a list without descriptions over a sentence or two (maybe even no descriptions). The whole Sonic the Hedgehog section that was created because we were bored, should be deleted too. Sonic has just been voted the most wanted 3rd party character...that's it. I just think the article lacks flow especially when we start adding updates. It needs to be rewritten and made "update friendly." (Zojo 13:41, 4 June 2007 (UTC))

You know what, this whole thing is kind of pointless. For example, todays update showed the Yoshi Story ending. Now is that really necessary to put in the music secton? sure it's a song, but it's not huge. Important details for the music section should be the large amount of composers from and outside Nintendo (mention a few of the key ones). I would even go as far to mention the Menu 1 in battlefield. But anyway, getting to the point, why don't we just make a list in the Smash Bros series section of all the items and give a very brief description. That'll clean this article up a bit since we don't need to include every itsy bitsy eeny weeny teeny tiny detail. We could keep some of the major advancements like shooting and jumping, but that's it. How about it?? 68.195.110.145 19:14, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Yoshi
Just wanna make this clear. With the June 4th update, it's safe to say that Yoshi will be a character in the game. BUT THERE IS STILL NO PROOF OF HIS CHARACTER IN THE GAME. FOR ALL WE KNOW IT COULD BE BIRDO. So don't start with the Yoshi crap please :)

Thank you.Dengarde 07:21, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
 * In other words, he's practically confirmed, but he's not "confirmed". :P Disaster Kirby 07:25, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
 * It's pretty much been like that since the E3 trailer anyways :P This just adds to it Dengarde 07:26, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Only except that Birdo has yet to appear in a Yoshi game and that Yoshi's Egg Symbol appears. magiciandude (Talk) (review) 09:44, 4 June 2007 (UTC)


 * But technicly, she IS a Yoshi...I think. Dengarde 12:55, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

I don't think the simbols mean anything for the music. Anubiz 11:01, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
 * What a silly comment. Of course they mean something. The symbols are used to connect each update to the character they go with. Example: Mario and Delfino Plaza. Both have the Mario Symbol. -Sukecchi 13:04, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

There will not be a Yoshi egg floting around whever it playes. So the egg will not be a fatour in the game.Anubiz 13:19, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, of course Yoshi is in the game. That's a no brainer. But by wikipedia's standards, we can't put Yoshi in yet or say "it's likely Yoshi will be in based on..." (Zojo 13:45, 4 June 2007 (UTC))

Yes, we have Scoinc stuff so Waynaut Yoshi stuff. Anubiz 14:07, 4 June 2007 (UTC)


 * We shouldn't have Sonic stuff. (Zojo 14:12, 4 June 2007 (UTC))


 * But we do, so Waynut stuff about Yoshi. Anubiz 14:15, 4 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Your logic is very flawed, Anubiz. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kenny2k (talk • contribs)

One thing's for certain, though. Yoshi's symbol appeared alongside the update (which would make sense, since it is Yoshi music). There's no reason not to believe that Yoshi is going to be in the game. All we have to do now is wait for Nintendo to show us a visual appearance of Yoshi, and we're set to add a bit about him to the article. Disaster Kirby 17:27, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Control method
I think the article should have some mention about how the control method has not yet been announced and how *INSERT MAKER HERE* has somewhat mysteriously mentioned that it might be a good idea to keep those GameCube controllers. Also it is worth noting that recent updates to the official site have included both an icon of a Wii remote hold sideways and the mention of the fact that there will be a control stick. While I believe the article should not elaborate more on how the control scheme could be, it should present the given facts and for now let the read make their own decision on how they think the game will be controlled.--Henke37 09:31, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

As the game get's closer to release and with daily updates, the article's has to get out of posting speculation that was put in because we were bored. Let the reader view the official website like you did to draw a conclusion. Not here. (Zojo 13:43, 4 June 2007 (UTC))

Of course there should be no speculation, but the given facts are facts. At the very least I think the article should mention how *INSERT MAKER HERE* hinted that people should not be too hast in throwing out the GameCube controllers.--Henke37 16:30, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

For all we know the contraler is Yoshi. Anubiz 16:38, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

fixing the article AKA stop whining and actually do something
Its been agreed that this article needs a major revamping but no one has revamped it and it has been at least two weeks now, I wish I could do it but I'm going on vacation If I come back and see the article the same I'm gonna be angry come on lets get this article done nowMarioman12 17:21, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

I just fixed up the stage article. FE411

It's more like a walkthrough than a Wikipedia page now --Demonworks

This is how it was before and everyone likes it that way. K bye. FE411 (just not logged in)


 * We will not be listing everything, so that format doesn't work. As more general information comes out, it will replace the specific information that we have. TTN 23:01, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Yea I suppose in the weeks to come the article will be molded into its standard state, but we'll just have to deal with the garbage dump that it is now eh?? 68.195.110.145 23:44, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Semi-protection?
I noticed that semi-protection for the article ran out earlier today (if it was supposed to). Should we request for semi-protection again? It seems that there have been two unhelpful edits by IP users already, and since the site is updating daily on weekdays now, chances are likely that a number of IP users are going to try and mess up the article more than it already is.

Perhaps we should wait and see if the same problem as before begins to occur again instead? Disaster Kirby 00:59, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

I'm going to rewrite the article
Ok, the article needs alot of help now. Since everyone seems to be complaining about the article and not doing anything, I'll take the job of rewriting it. This is supposed to be an encyclopedia article, not an IGN faq. Trust me, I know what I'm doing. If anyone has any comments/suggestions, just let me know. Kenny2k

The whole article, or just the characters section? I think you should concentrate your efforts there. Anyway, I'm glad someone is doing something about it. J M  J  07:11, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
 * good luck. every time i've tried to fix it, other people come in and change it even more. FyreNWater 07:25, 5 June 2007 (UTC)