Talk:Survivor: Borneo/Archive 1

January 2006
I would like a source that states that its "official" name is now Borneo. Mike H. That's hot 20:13, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

If you go to cbs.com, and scroll down on the list of previous CBS shows, it list's ot as Survivor: Borneo. Also the official dvd set lists the title as Survivor: Borneo. --400lb.Gorilla 20:27, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

Group deletion nomination for Survivor contestants
You may wish to participate in Articles for deletion/Keith Famie which is discussing the deletion of Gervase Peterson who was a contestant on Borneo.

Pagonging
''After the tribal merge, all of the Pagong contestants were eliminated before the Tagi tribe voted out its own members. In Survivor fandom, the term "Pagonging" has been used to describe the same pattern.''

I think it's fine to include "Pagonging" in the article, but I don't think it belongs in the introductory passage. Why not move in to trivia? Doctofunk 15:52, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

Gervase Trivia
Gervase was featured in a 2004 Sunkist commercial.

I don't see how this is relevant to anything. Doctofunk 15:52, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

Elimination Notes Section
I feel that these sections in all the Survivor articles have a fair bit of POV and a lot of non-notable information. I think the note on Stacey Stillman is important and should remain. Also I think it's worth explaining the alliance, as it influenced the play of the game enomrously. Doctofunk 22:07, 29 August 2006 (UTC)

Show's impact
Did anyone think to mention this show's impact on television and how it begun the wave of reality television we see today? I think it's definately a point worth mentioning, unfortunately I personally wouldn't know how to cite such a claim.

Website
Survivor Borneo's website now redirects to Survivor Cook Islands, no matter if you type /survivor or /survivor1. Also, Borneo is still on the drop down but it also redirects to Cook Islands. Because of this I took out the link to it.TeckWiz is 12 yrs oldTalk Contribs # of Edits 12:53, 1 October 2006 (UTC)
 * I added a link to an copy of the official site from the Internet Archive. --CrazyLegsKC 23:37, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

Source
I'd like to see a citation for this claim: "Part of the reason for Kelly's loss was due to a negative attitude from the jurors, especially Sean Kenniff and Greg Buis, that they would be insulted to lose to a river raft guide with their high educations. This is the reasoning behind their votes and cost Kelly the game." 68.159.191.52 03:29, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Duplicate information in 'Contestants' and 'The Game' sections
It seems that the 'Contestants' and 'The Game' sections have a lot of the same information. I can understand some overlap, but the 'Finish' column doesn't seem like it belongs in the 'The Game' section as that information is specific to a contestant and not an episode.

Sorry if this has been discussed elsewhere. Is there a common place to discuss standards for the Survivor family of articles? BullWikiWinkle 23:55, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Getting rid of 39 days item
For the articles, can you please let it be? The Survivor season articles without "No of days" shown, as 39 is how it's (almost) been and will be that way the same. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.37.134.220 (talk) 02:29, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia is about informing the uninformed, so non-Survivor fans would have no idea about how many days it takes to film a season. -- Scorpion0422 03:00, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

They will. Trust me. Try doing something. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.37.134.220 (talk) 15:26, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

The Radio
Near the first week Survivor aired it someone on the radio said that the winner of Survior was Richard Hatch and that he had some crimnal charges. Should this be in the artical? And for any one how is going to ask "do you have a source" I'm going to say this I no someone who heard it on the raido. Sorry I can't give you better source than that.216.134.168.163 08:24, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
 * It's already in the article. --Maxamegalon2000 13:35, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Maxmegalon, IDK if you meant the info about the radio or the criminal charges was in the article, but I couldn't find any about the radio. I can't help with anything about that, though; we don't pick up US radio in New Zealand :D THE  DARK LORD  TROMBONATOR 10:59, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Episode titles
I wonder where the episode titles came from. Can you cite the source it is from? 99.230.152.143 01:11, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
 * The official DVD? I dunno, I haven't got it. THE  DARK LORD  TROMBONATOR 04:58, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

Neither do i. 99.230.152.143 22:47, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Main discussion at Talk:Survivor_%28TV_series%29 THE  DARK LORD  TROMBONATOR 05:05, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

Rattana Color
I think it should be changed, because I thought it was darker, but what do you think about this?:

I was unclear, so I thought I'd turn to this page.Stjimmy61892 (talk) 21:47, 19 February 2008 (UTC)


 * No idea, I didn't see the season. I am not really concerned about the colour, changed or not. -- THE DARK LORD TROMBONATOR  01:25, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
 * K Thanks... and can we PLEASE stop putting this as a sub-topic to "Episode Titles"? It's REALLY bugging me. This has NOTHING to do with that. Stjimmy61892 (talk) 22:59, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

On this one i do agree with you. The tribe flag was very close to the new color you chose. I say change it Survivorfan101 (talk) 08:39, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

Also, here on the archived survivor borneo website it shows the color and kelly green is very similar to it Survivorfan101 (talk) 02:47, 1 March 2008 (UTC) Check out my sandbox:[] and look under Reality TV. There you'll find that I changed the tribe color on my own. Anyone agree with me here? I'd like to have a vote if that's ok.Stjimmy61892 21:16, 4 November 2008 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Stjimmy61892 (talk • contribs)


 * Here are the exact colors used for all three tribes on the CBS website:


 * I think a consensus has been reached regarding Rattana's color being changed. I'm going to go ahead and change all the tribe colors to match the ones from the CBS site.  --  Bull  Wiki  Winkle  20:37, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

These colours need to be reverted, they do not represent the colour of the tribes buffs or flags. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.209.32.18 (talk) 10:24, 31 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I agree with the user before me. The colors we had before were much more representative. No way was the Rattana green that dark. MarkMc1990 (talk) 01:20, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I agree with the two previous users. These colors NEED to change, and I own a Rattana Buff myself. No way it's that color. Same goes to Pagong. Look at their flags and Buffs in the show. CBS used the colors only for identification, and it is not seriously correspondent to the tribe colors. When this color change first took place I literally thought it was some kind of vandalism.


 * These are the colors I would suggest.
 * 123.116.201.195 (talk) 06:02, 31 July 2009 (UTC)

I completely agree. I just got a Rattana Merged Tribe buff, and the color is more of a neon green. Peanut.pookie (talk) 16:05, 2 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Completely agree with you. The green is way too dark. Borneo was a bit weird here, because the buffs were a very neon green, but the tribe flag was much darker. I think the usual way to do things is to match the colour on the buffs (certainly that's what people are talking about with season 22.) If that's the case, the green needs to be what Peanut.pookie suggested.TheTribeHasSpoken (talk) 04:20, 16 January 2011 (UTC)

Stacey Stillman
The article on Stacey Stillman has two sources: a CBS profile from Survivor, and an IMDB (unreliable source) profile listing appearances in Survivor. The information in her article talks about her appearance on Survivor and her suing the show Survivor after she was booted off. The number of reliable independent sources cited in the article is zero, claims to notability outside of Survivor are also zero. This looks like an excellent candidate for merging to the series article per WP:BLP1E; there are no non-trivial independent biographical sources about her and there's no suggestion that her career as a lawyer is in any way distinctive or notable. Guy (Help!) 10:07, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Expansion
I'm trying to start expansion of this article. An expansion that will include a reception, production, crew, and DVD release sections. I will clean it up, and aim to have it featured. Apparently a consensus was formed to keep the tables centered and the leave the merged tribe as one long line. In order to gain featured status of this article, the table shouldn't be centered, and should be sortable. If the merged tribe is in one long row, it fucks up the sortable featured, so I should really be un-sortable.  iMa tth ew  20:34, 21 November 2008 (UTC)
 * (Yay! Someone else who wants Survivor FAs!) OK, thanks. Is it compulsary for FAs with tables to have left-aligned tables and sortable columns? IMHO it's aesthetically better the way it is now. But thanks very very much for wanting to expand, I had planned to spend most of my upcoming summer holidays on this task. -- THE DARK LORD TROMBONATOR  20:38, 21 November 2008 (UTC)
 * From my work and what I've seen at FLC and FAC, the reviewers all prefer left aligned tables and sortable columns, so it kind of is necessary.  iMa tth ew  20:40, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

Also, I'd like to remove the "elimination summaries" and replace it with a season summary. I have the DVD set, so I can write it all up.  iMa tth ew  20:40, 21 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Mnyerghh... ok, I guess. I don't WP:OWN the article. I'll make sure some other current contributors get a say in this also, though. Episode summaries would be great, but please don't write us a novel! Lol. Would you be interested in helping with the (somewhat dormant) Survivor Task Force? We intend to build all articles up to (and beyond) Gabon-standard, and clear up contestants articles etc. -- THE DARK LORD TROMBONATOR  20:46, 21 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Sure, I can join - I'll get to that soon. Also, my plan over the next two months is two back away from Professional wrestling articles (my old area of work) and most towards expanding and cleaning up all Survivor seasons articles. Who knows - the smell of FT isn't that many miles down the road.  iMa tth ew  20:50, 21 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Yay! Wiki-hugs! ... Ahem... Let me know if you find any sources that may have info about later seasons that we can use. I don't know if we can get episode ratings; it might be too late. However the sites used for Gabon may have back issues, per say. Best of luck! -- THE DARK LORD TROMBONATOR  20:59, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

I've worked on it at User:IMatthew/Survivor - feel free to offer a copyedit or two. Also I'd like to rename "The game" section, but I'm not sure what to. And in that table, I'd like to eliminate the "Votes" column, as it is redundant with the "Voting history" table.  iMa tth ew  22:58, 21 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I began a copyedit, but you editconflicted me and I'm in a rush to leave now so I've posted my changes here rather than try and merge them. Is this format better than an ep-by-ep format like later seasons? -- THE DARK LORD TROMBONATOR  23:37, 21 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I believe so. I think that a brief summary of each episode is better than an individual description for each.  iMa tth ew  23:40, 21 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm a fan of the current article layout (see China, Micronesia, and Gabon) with the episode summaries rather than a season summary. We've already started a (small) MOS section.  Any changes to what is already documented should definitely be documented there.  My main concern is that we get to a point where the articles have a consistent look and feel. --  Bull  Wiki  Winkle  02:04, 22 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I believe that in order to get the article to Featured status, it should have the tables not centered and the merged tribe row be broken into 10. Also, for featured status, we can't have an article full of non-notable information. Those seasons go into way to much detail. With the summary and/or the TV tables (as in Degrassi link below), it only discusses it briefly. I actually think the TV tables may look better.  iMa tth ew  02:30, 22 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Unless others think specific episode descriptions would be better in a table? As in Degrassi: The Next Generation (season 1).  iMa tth ew  00:41, 22 November 2008 (UTC)
 * It seems that a table for episode listings is a standard for fictional shows, but reality competitions shows seem to be formatted more like the latest Survivor seasons. Also, a table format for episode summaries was proposed a while back.  Check out the conversation here. --  Bull  Wiki  Winkle  02:30, 22 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Although that was almost a year ago (remember, consensus can change - especially over time), if that's the case, I'd say that the summary would be the best thing to do, to get the articles featured. Reminder - I'm still working on User:IMatthew/Survivor. I have added DVD release and Crew information, as well as some prose in the Contestants section.  iMa tth ew  02:38, 22 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I think that this is an excellent idea (yay Survivor FAs!), but can we get an image or two other than the logo for the "The Game" section? LMK what I can do to help.  spider1224  00:55, 22 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I'd still reason that the centered tables look cleaner, as it removes all the whitespace on one side of the screen. iMatthew, a format similar to the one used on Degrassi was proposed (here, and it was decided best to keep all of the "game" table stuff in one place. (BTW alternate name "gameplay?") -- THE DARK LORD TROMBONATOR  04:58, 22 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Well, to clear up white space, I plan on putting a picture or two/three of some of the survivors to fill the whitespace. To see how this is done, check out List of American Idol contestants, and List of Survivor contestants.  iMa tth ew  13:01, 22 November 2008 (UTC)

I added quote, expanded more and more and more. I have the book - and it's a GREAT source. Is there really any problems still with it? User:IMatthew/Survivor.  iMa tth ew  14:51, 22 November 2008 (UTC)

Arb. Break - Challenges
Hello. I am having trouble in locating the challenges that were actually done in each season. I am looking at the latter seasons and thought that only Guatemala was different. Apparently, all seasons prior to Guatemala (other than Palau) has been changed to the current format of the earlier seasons. I would just like to ask if it is possible to add a listing and description of the actual challenges? I honestly think it is better to do that as this is an online encyclopedia. However, if it is not possible, is there any way for me to have an exact description of the challenges?LordBelly06 (talk) 15:06, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
 * With the updated format, I think we can fit the challenges into the "Episode list" table, if we remove the final "voted out" column which is duplicating info in the previous table. I'm going to sandbox a version that I think should work and will repost here. --M ASEM  21:33, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
 * That wouldn't work. The individual challenges are not notable. After this article is reviewed at GA, it will become an FAC and we need to see how things pan out.  aye matthew  ✡ 21:48, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Just post them here and we discuss it. Plastikspork (talk) 22:19, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I disagree the challenges aren't notable - they are a core gameplay element of the show. Obviously we don't need excessive detail on these, but we need enough to establish what they are. --M ASEM  22:22, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
 * User:Masem/sbtest is my version of the episode table to include brief descriptions of the challenges and rewards. --M ASEM  22:55, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I love the fact that you removed the duplicate Finish column, but adding the challenge info makes the first two columns look rather squished. -- Bull  Wiki  Winkle  02:04, 5 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I think this is useful information. It would be good if it could go somewhere, if not here. Plastikspork (talk) 02:15, 5 December 2008 (UTC)
 * List of challenges from Survivor: Borneo?  aye matthew  ✡ 02:43, 5 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I don't think this needs to go in a separate article. There's enough space here for something with the challenges as long as they are kept to the short descriptions I used. --M ASEM 04:00, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

The template shown is actually good enough, if the challenges are to be included. Another way perhaps, is to have a separate table for the challenge descriptions. I have to say that the challenges are important. Nonetheless, the format now is ok, but incomplete. I hope someone who has watched the show religiously can do an edit, once a consensus has been reached. The current version for Gabon looks too intensive. It is a good "diary entry" but encyclopedia-wise, it may be best to have this format instead, with the addition of the challenges table/list.LordBelly06 (talk) 04:37, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Merge with Survivor: Borneo or List of Survivor contestants. What's next? Individual articles for contestants on The Price is Right. These people appeared on one season of a reality show. They don't require separate articles.George Pelltier (talk) 18:39, 20 June 2009 (UTC)

Fishing village
The article says ''On March 7, 2000, the contestants were flown to Los Angeles, then to the city of Kota Kinabalu in Borneo. From there, they were taken by boat to their island'' but when you watch the beginning of the first episode the voiceover says "From this tiny Malaysian fishing village, these sixteen Americans ..." and you see the contestants in a small village, clearly not Kota Kinabalu the capital of Sabah, getting on small boats to go out to the larger boat which they then were shipwrecked off [youtube link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R1rkQbhzmlU]. So the text is wrong.

Question: what was the name of the village they left from? 86.134.116.184 (talk) 14:45, 24 February 2009 (UTC)

Did anyone proof read this article?
How did this article manage to make it GA status? It needs a ton of work on grammar (The mistakes are really obvious under the episode section ). Someone familiar with the show should proof read it and correct the mistakes. -- GateKeeper (talk) @ 01:28, 1 February 2010 (UTC)


 * example of what I mean :


 * "At Tagi Dirk and Sean are still still trying to fish instead of helping around camp. While at Pagong everyone feels vonerable because there tribe is getting a little more smaller. At the award Joel help Pagong win reward. At Tagi Dirk and Sean is beginning to help around the camp but that didn't change there tribe members mind. At Pagong with there chicken award they dicided to let them lay eggs. At the immunity challenge Gervase help Pagong to victory. At Tagi tribal council Dirk was voted out 5-1-1."
 * What you are citing are very recent additions (see the edit history). Clearly this needs to be cleaned up. Thanks! Plastikspork ―Œ (talk)  17:48, 1 February 2010 (UTC)

Article merging
I would like the following articles to be merged into Survivor: Borneo:


 * Sonja Christopher
 * Stacey Stillman
 * Gervase Peterson
 * Sean Kenniff


 * Lamp301 (talk) 00:40, 3 June 2010 (UTC)
 * It looks like Sonja Christopher is at AFD. Stacey Sillman could probably be safely redirected if the controversy section is merged. Gervase Peterson and Sean Kenniff had an acting careers after the show, which makes redirection a bit more controversial. Plastikspork ―Œ (talk) 19:29, 3 June 2010 (UTC)

Rating/Reception
It should be noted that the premeir episode went against an episode of Who Wants to be a Millionaire?, in which Millionaire slightly had more viewers than Survivor 16.5 to 15.5 million. This is in the book Deperate Networks by Blair Carter (2006).--Cooly123 15:19, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

B.B. Andersen passing
I have removed the noting of B.B. Andersen's passing because, to put bluntly, but still respectfully, everybody castaway is eventually going to die and his passing is not notable. There is no point in noting who has passed away because eventually everybody will have that notation and it becomes pointless. While there may be comparisons to Jenn Lyon and Survivor: Palau, the difference is that she has her own article meeting the notability guidelines and she was, unfortunately, the first castaway to pass.

So while B.B.'s passing is certainly sad, we should not be noting it in the article. -- Gogo Dodo (talk) 23:15, 1 November 2013 (UTC)


 * Have to agree - death of former players should not be noted on these pages and only on pages about the player, unless somehow the death impacted the show to be acknowledged there. --M ASEM (t) 23:49, 1 November 2013 (UTC)

However, on the wikipedia page for the first season of the Amazing Race, both Margaretta Groarks and Nancy Hoyts deaths are noted and none of them have their own article DrKilleMoff (talk) 02:41, 8 November 2013 (UTC)