Talk:Suur Tõll (icebreaker)

Article name
Why the hell was this moved from Suur Tõll (icebreaker)? Please read Article titles and move it back. The name of the ship is "Suur Tõll". — Jeraphine Gryphon  (talk) 20:14, 30 December 2011 (UTC)


 * WP:SHIPNAME states that "for ships of navies or nations that don't have a standard ship prefix, name the article (Nationality) (type) (Name)". Although not a naval ship, the Suur Tõll was still a state-owned ship in Finland, Estonia, Russia and the Soviet Union, and was used in the war effort. I have also used the same naming convention with the Finnish state-owned icebreakers. However, I do admit that the building year is probably not needed as the ship has an unique name.
 * There are probably as many naming conventions for icebreaker articles (Icebreaker xxx, xxx (icebreaker), Someone's icebreaker xxx, xxx (someone's icebreaker), xxx, xxx (year)...). As I work through the articles, I intend to harmonize the names in a way or other because most icebreakers are named after something that also has an article, and often there are several ships with the same name. However, I'll probably ask on the project talk page before I make a move outside my zone of comfort (former and current Finnish state-owned icebreakers). Tupsumato (talk) 09:42, 31 December 2011 (UTC)


 * As for the spelling of the name, both the Estonian Wikipedia and the Eesti Meremuuseum seem to use "õ" instead of "õ". If the latter is correct, the article can be moved, but I think we should have redirects from "õ" and perhaps even "o" or "ö" because "õ" can not be found from the standard keyboard (WP:TITLEFORMAT). Tupsumato (talk) 09:46, 31 December 2011 (UTC)


 * "seem to use "õ" instead of "õ"." --- õ instead of õ? I don't get what you're saying. Yes, we should have redirects from the o and possibly the ö version. But what actual article title do you propose? — Jeraphine Gryphon  (talk) 14:51, 31 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Disregard my comment. I need a better monitor. Tupsumato (talk) 17:42, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

I moved the page, to the one without the year. Also, sorry for over-reacting up there^. — Jeraphine Gryphon  (talk) 15:00, 31 December 2011 (UTC)


 * No problem. Thanks for the move. Tupsumato (talk) 17:42, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

Reassesment
I'm floored.

With that said, I'll be reading through it properly and will assess, unless someone else gets to it first. (Note: I'm not a member of WP Ships, but I am a member of WP Estonia. Hoping articles don't usually get rated separately for separate WPs...) — Jeraphine Gryphon  (talk) 23:50, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

Should there be a wikilink to Mooring (watercraft) from the word "moored" in the second paragraph? The average person (such as myself) might not know what it means. — Jeraphine Gryphon  (talk) 00:10, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

Reassessed to B class. — Jeraphine Gryphon  (talk) 00:23, 1 January 2012 (UTC)


 * Thank you. Also, if you can find some Estonian sources, could you check that the facts are correct and if there's something else about her career in Estonia or the Soviet Union, that would be a welcome addition. The books I'm using are from early 1990s and although the Finnish author was a specialist in steam-powered icebreakers, he might have made some minor errors because the ship spent only a few years under the Finnish flag. I also added the wikilink to mooring — being familiar with the terminology, I often forget that not everyone knows what they mean. If you find something else worth of linking to another article, feel free to add the brackets. Tupsumato (talk) 09:53, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

As a museum ship
How important to the article is the ship's state and happenings as a museum ship? It seems our newspapers are really fond of it; I've been compiling some sources in my sandbox below. I'm having some difficulty understanding what's going on, chronologically, and how certain terms or place names translate to English, but I haven't made a proper effort yet. I'll be actually reading through them, if it's relevant to the article here, and make edits, or if I lose interest or don't understand anything then I'll dump the links here. — Jeraphine Gryphon (talk) 18:33, 5 January 2012 (UTC)


 * I think such information would be relevant to the article — after all the ship still exists and something is happening to it. If you don't have time or lose interest at some point, just put the links here and someone (like me) can continue the work. I'll also keep an eye on the article and add bits of information if I come across anything interesting. However, the Estonian sources are probably the best for recent news. Tupsumato (talk) 19:41, 5 January 2012 (UTC)

I won't get around to it. Linkdump below:

http://www.meremuuseum.ee/?op=body&id=28

2011

2006

2004
 * http://uudised.err.ee/index.php?0536304 Suur Tõll veetakse Lennusadamasse 25.01.2004. Eesti Rahvusringhääling
 * http://uudised.err.ee/index.php?0536304 Suur Tõll veetakse Lennusadamasse 25.01.2004. Eesti Rahvusringhääling

2000

a
 * http://aktal.tallinnlv.ee/static/Eelnoud/Dokumendid/endok2304.htm Feb 2004
 * http://aktal.tallinnlv.ee/static/Eelnoud/Dokumendid/endok2304.htm Feb 2004
 * http://aktal.tallinnlv.ee/static/Eelnoud/Dokumendid/endok2304.htm Feb 2004
 * http://aktal.tallinnlv.ee/static/Eelnoud/Dokumendid/endok2304.htm Feb 2004

x
 * http://www.parnupostimees.ee/389092/tostamaa-tehnokulas-askeldab-tosin-ettevotjat/ (mention)
 * http://www.mil.ee/?id=988 (mention)
 * http://www.kul.ee/index.php?news=3528&path=0x5x124
 * http://www.kul.ee/index.php?news=249&path=0x5x124
 * http://tartu.postimees.ee/260406/esileht/siseuudised/199151.php
 * http://www.loodusajakiri.ee/eesti_loodus/artikkel2289_2270.html (mention)
 * http://www.meremuuseum.ee/?op=body&id=39
 * http://www.raamatukoi.ee/cgi-bin/raamat?32880
 * http://www.raamatukoi.ee/cgi-bin/raamat?26342

— Jeraphine Gryphon (talk) 05:17, 9 January 2012 (UTC)


 * I'll put it on my to-do list. Tupsumato (talk) 21:44, 9 January 2012 (UTC)