Talk:Team Rocket/Archive 1

Talk Page Rules
I've spent a while cleaning this up and it's primarily because people can post for their lives. Anyway, a few guidelines to clear things up -


 * Use a informative header, for example "Article Splitting" over "This is HUGE"
 * When you have finished writing a message please sign it by adding 4 tildes (like this - ~ ) at the end of your post.
 * When replying in a topic, use colons (these - ":") at the start of your message to make it start further than the one above yours. (For example, if you are the first replier, use 1 colon, and if you are the seventeenth use 17 colons)
 * Use Apostrophes (these:  )

Happy Posting! H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 16:12, 22 April 2006 (UTC)


 * I've spent a while cleaning this up and it's primarily because people can post for their lives. I believe what you meant to post was "can't." Ah, sweet irony. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.138.115.3 (talk • contribs)

Pokemon Chroicles
Has anyone tried to fit the pokemon chronicle episodes featuring meowth living in the city with the other pokemon? ((Pichu bros, and etc))

Japanese Statuses
James wouldn't be a "Bishonen" - he seems to be an adult or late teen - therefore a "biseinen". WhisperToMe 02:54, 27 Jun 2004 (UTC)
 * From Wikipedia: "a young man whose beauty (and sexual appeal) transcends the boundary of sex." I think James qualifies as a "young man." — Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.138.115.3 (talk • contribs)

Jessie or Jesse?
Which way is correct, Jesse or Jessie? According to a quick Google Search I did, some 14.5 thousand people spell it Jessie, but a little over twice as many (30 thousand) spell it Jesse. Which is correct? Or should we not worry about what is correct and just please the majority? If so, what about those 14.5 thousand people who spell her name Jessie? Wouldn't it be harder for them to find this article?--Fern 20:06, 3 Jul 2004 (UTC)
 * According to Pokémon.com, "Jessie" is indeed correct. I quote from their summary of "All in a Day's Wurmple": Jessie manages to snag a Wurmple of her own before Team Rocket blasts off at the end of the episode. (from ) --kelvSYC 17:58, 4 Jul 2004 (UTC)
 * So what do we do? correct the article spelling it "Jessie"? If so, what about those 30thousand or so that spell it "Jesse"? Should we put "Jessie (sometimes misspelled as Jesse) is..."?--Fern 04:42, 5 Jul 2004 (UTC)
 * As "Jessie" is correct, we should use it, but make a reference that she is sometimes referred to as "Jesse" due to its connection to "Jesse James". --kelvSYC 13:16, 5 Jul 2004 (UTC)
 * OK. I'll go and put it in right now.--Fern 15:43, 5 Jul 2004 (UTC)
 * Personally I wouldn't give much credence to them, and Jesse's namesake IS Jesse James. Also her Japanese name is technically male. Randee15 08:50, 10 Jul 2004 (UTC)
 * True on all counts, but there still remains the chance that "Jesse" was changed to "Jessie" to make it sound more of a girl's name. --kelvSYC 16:12, 10 Jul 2004 (UTC)
 * Kids WB/Nintendo/ForKids...whoever controls the english media - has also spelled her name "Jesse" on several occasions. I even have an official Pokemon card with her name spelled "Jesse"
 * To further muddy the waters, the subtitles to "Go West Young Meowth" add "Jessy" to the list of the variations on Jessie's name. --Kain 11:49, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

Team Rocket Ages
Pokémon.com also says Jesse and James are twelve years old, when they're very obviously ont. Randee15 08:50, 10 Jul 2004 (UTC)
 * I always assumed that Jessie and James were adults, so they must be closer to 16. What we do know about the ages of the human characters is that, in the English version, Ash is older than May and Brock is older than Ash. --kelvSYC 16:12, 10 Jul 2004 (UTC)
 * (I warn you, this is long and a teensy bit rambling. It's 4:52 a.m. here, and I really should be sleeping, but I couldn't resist.) Actually, the characters' current age is a great mystery. On Pokémon.com is a letter written to the Pokémon Company where a fan asks how old Ash was at the time since when he left Pallet Town he was 10. Pokémon dot com cleverly replied that the Pokémon characters are ageless, comparing Ash to Mickey Mouse who by now should be all old and grey and yet he still appears to be the same age than when he made his debut in Steamboat Willie.--Fern 17:52, 10 Jul 2004 (UTC)
 * Ash states at the end of the Indigo League (I think, it's been a while since I've watched those early eps) that one year has passed since he was last in Pallet Town, i.e. when he left on his pokémon journey on his 10th birthday. Also, in the third Pikachu short "Pikachu and Pika", which occurred well after the Indigo League comment, Ash tells Pikachu that it's the anniversary of their first meeting. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk • contribs).
 * These comments, to me, clearly show that time passes in the Pokéworld, and also implies that the characters do indeed age. If that's true, Ash would be 12 years old now, and all the other characters would be two years older too. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk • contribs).
 * Another blow to Pokémon.com's statement is the fact that James was supposed to get married. Now, even if he was only 16-19 in "Holy Matrimony!", that's still an acceptable (if young) age to marry. 12 years, on the other hand, is not, and I doubt even James's nutty parents would go for that, particularly since they seemed anxious for grandchildren immediately. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk • contribs).
 * As for Jesse/Jessie's age, she fills in a form in an early ep wherein she lists her age as "17". Of course, she also says her occupation is "diva", so this is admittedly a little suspect. Still, it's the only concrete, sensible answer given in the anime as to Team Rocket's age, at least in the English version. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk • contribs).
 * Actually, the dubbers made fun of the "Team Rocket are 12 years old" answer in the ep "Plant It Now... Diglett Later". A very old woman says to Jesse/Jessie that she's 120 years old. Jesse replies with "What?! That's 10 times my age!" (120 divided by 10 is 12, of course). Meowth quickly and sarcastically responds "Where'd you learn that math, Jess?" Randee15 11:53, 11 Jul 2004 (UTC)
 * OK, I'll agree to the fact that while the U.S. Pokémon Company is in charge of distributing the Pokémon video games and anime in the U.S. (and organising all those events where Pokémon like Celebi are given out) they may not be the best Pokémon experts in the world. Perhaps the best thing to do would be to find someone who speaks Japanese and English fluently, and also holds an interst in the Pokémon anime, and ask them to write to the Pokémon Japan company itself. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk • contribs).
 * Time obviously does pass in the Pokémon world, but the time-scale is different. In Pokémon Yellow for example, when you get off the SS Anne (St. Anne in the anime) there's an NPC that tells you that the ship has left to cruise around the world and will not return in more than a year. Remembering this when I was playing Pokémon Gold and Silver, I put on Pokémon Yellow and checked the dock. Obviously, the game makers didn't expect that much patience from the players because the SS Anne hadn't returned yet.--Fern 13:37, 11 Jul 2004 (UTC)
 * Let's just assume that Jessie and James are both 17 and that Meowth is 3 years old (although he's very mature for his age, probably about 17). —The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk • contribs).
 * Let's not assume Meowth is any age as pokemon are pretty much digital animals and so if anything is "ageless" in this cartoon, it should be pokemon. The only example of an aged pokemon was from that surfing episode where the guy's pikachu actually LOOKED old and Tracey's Scyther. But it still makes no sense. Ash certainly *seems* more mature and his voice has dropped (lol) so I generally figure Ash was 10 and has now aged a few years, as have Team Rocket, who (probably) started off at 17 and are now on their way to their 20s. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk • contribs).
 * Not so. Pokemon are not digital animals. They may be in this world, but not in theirs. Let's just assume that Jessie and James are around the same age that the MMPR were in their second season (around 16) and that Meowth is, well, Level 35. 71.111.215.224 14:16, 28 March 2006 (UTC)
 * "Pokemon are not digital animals. They may be in this world, but not in theirs." What does this mean? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk • contribs).


 * Yes, I remember the Diglett episode and what was said about Jessie's age in comparison to the old woman's...Think of reality...Does anyone leave home to venture out on a life-long quest at ten? No.  This is fiction and needs to be considered as such. Michael 03:04, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Please note that this conversation is almost two years old, and that general consensus has been to omit ages because sources are contradictory and the exact ages have little bearing on the anime. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 03:09, 25 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Well, you never know when someone may attempt to revitalize the argument. As you know Wikipedia is always changing, and people are always changing things, so it's quite possible that someone will bring this into question again.  Oh, and this conversation was actually used less than three months ago, so it's still relevant.  Michael 00:03, 26 June 2006 (UTC)


 * So let's look at this in an up-to-date way - the show has been on for 10 years. It might not make THAT much of a difference to Jesse and James (although to be approaching your 30's and still chasing around the same kid and pikachu goes beyond Team-Rocket-sad) i also makes Ash and co. 10 years older. Ash sure doesn't look 20 to me. So even though they talk about days and months in the show, clearly time doesn't pass quite 'normally.' — Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.138.115.3 (talk • contribs)


 * I once read in a magazine that Jessie's and James' ages are 17. I remember because after mentioning their age, they had in brackets "(they're not even old enough to drink yet!)". Not sure if this is credible, but I thought I'd bring it up in case someone else remembers and can clarify if the source is reliable. CureHeart 18:11, 22 March 2007 (UTC)


 * The original and the dub seem to differ on this. In the japanese CD Drama, The Birth of Mewtwo, Sakaki (Giovanni) states that the events occured 20 years prior to "now" (during season 1), and it is implied that Musashi (Jessie) is somewhere during or between Preschool and Kindergarten, making her at the time 2-5 years old, and at the end of the drama she says that her daughter is nearly a hag (unmarried woman over 24). So if Kojiro/James is the same age as her, then at the beginning of the anime, they were somewhere between 22 and 25. But who know how old any of them are now, considering the definite time warp that seems to have occured in the show.

Merge from List of Pokémon characters
List of Pokémon characters began life as a split from Pokémon (anime), but the description of J/J/M was way, way, too long for either article. There's a ton of useful info about the trio there, though, so I've tagged it for merging into this article. This shouldn't be too controversial, I hope. - A Man In Black (Talk | Contribs) 18:18, 1 September 2005 (UTC)
 * Merged. --Celestianpower hab 09:52, 24 September 2005 (UTC)
 * Thank you. - A Man In Black (Talk | Contribs) 10:27, 24 September 2005 (UTC)

Giovanni x Delia Ketchum and "Ash is Giovanni's son"
If you're about to add a note that Giovanni is Ash's father or had a relationship with Ash's mother, please stop, unless you can prove that this is canon. - A Man In Black (Talk | Contribs) 02:21, 24 September 2005 (UTC)
 * There's some coverage of this on the Giovanni article, anyway. Sonic Mew | talk to me 06:18, 2 October 2005 (UTC)

Style on "trainer's Pokémon" sections
I noticed you added a table to Ash Ketchum, and, while I like the idea of reforming those horrid bulleted lists of Pokémon, I'm not sure a table is really that much better, visually. Have you seen what A Link to the Past was doing in Team Rocket? Something about that style of chronological paragraphs with alternating anchor images seems to me to be somehow more encyclopedic than bulleted lists or tables. I'm still of two minds on this one, though; any thoughts? - A Man In Black (Talk | Contribs) 05:58, 2 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Paragraphs are more encyclopedic, but the Pokémon that they own needs to be made clear. My idea has the same goal, to be more encyclopedic, but the only difference is that the text is just in a table.  It's an improvement on before, and it looks nicer than my earlier work, such as on Brock's article.  Team Rocket certainly looks good, but my main issue is that it fails to make all the Pokémon clear at a glance - something that the unencyclopedic lists did do right.   Sonic Mew | talk to me 06:22, 2 October 2005 (UTC)
 * As for quick reference, why not just make sure each paragraph has effective topic sentences, mentioning the major Pokémon? I don't see any reason anyone would ever need to see at a glance that Ash had a Beedrill, Mankey, or Raticate, as all of them were one- or two-ep appearances, and the major ones can be emphasized, with images (with captions, the lack of which is problem with Team Rocket) and prominent mentions. - A Man In Black (Talk | Contribs) 06:36, 2 October 2005 (UTC)
 * I prefer the chart its alot easiser to read and under stand and the way its set up makes it way easier to tell what pokemon they have now Lego3400 03:40, 7 January 2006 (UTC)
 * While you guys were wasting time in conversation, I tabulated Jessie and James' pokémon.59.164.115.51 15:14, 21 April 2006 (UTC)

Team Rocket Grammar
I would just like to point out a mistake that's more of a small annoyance to me than anything else. Team Rocket is a singular noun. It may refer to many people, but that doesn't mean it requires an "are", just like "everyone". I, um, fixed it a few times in the article, but just wanted to say that for future reference, being an avid Team Rocket fan, and total English freak, lol. Oh, and I think I read somewhere that Jessie and James are 21 in the Japanese series...um, Bookworm89 10/24/05 10:05AM


 * Whopee. --Apostrophe 01:07, 27 November 2005 (UTC)

Splitting Articles
Since there is SOO much info on jessie and james it would be better to put them on their own page (together with meowth) for 3 main reasons. Also Butch and cassidy have their own page but its empty they can be put there but that can really stay here since they have little info. Lego3400 02:50, 7 January 2006 (UTC)
 * 1) This page is huge but they take up half the page.
 * 2) It's hard to tell what pokemon they have now the way its set up if we give them their own page we can make a chart more like what the heros have.
 * 3) The page is 42 KB, a little too large. Also if it is decided to keep them here you might want to bump Their pokemon up above Giovanni's info.
 * Agreed. Remember when Meowth (Team Rocket) was split between the pages on Meowth (the main Pokémon page), the Team Rocket page, and his own?  Now that all of the Meowth (TR) info is in this page, the result is that this page is huge!  With Giovanni having his own page, there is certainly a precedent for splitting out Jessie/James/Meowth into a separate page.Kain 11:45, 30 March 2006 (UTC)
 * (Sirens blares) FANCRUFT ALERT! FANCRUFT ALERT! Step away from this article people, we are not splitting it up! H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 21:34, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree that Jessie and James should have their own pages. There is also little in this article about Team Rocket in the Pokémon videogames, and it is not clearly findable... Kurtle 20:54, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
 * I do like your spelling of definitely :P I agree with you though. H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 21:33, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
 * It's the typical practice for Wikipedia articles to get split when there's sufficient content to call for it. And with Giovanni getting his own article, Jessie, James, and Meowth should too. They have appared in 449 out of 450 episodes so far; that's the mos appearances of any characters other than Ash and Pikachu. Being in 99.8% of the episodes of a series that's run for 10 years and is a major pop culture phenomenon is surely sufficient to merit their own article. Redxiv 07:00, 27 April 2006 (UTC)
 * We've had this discussion before, yes they merit their own article but there'd be so much cross referencing to the other articles it's pointless. H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 07:22, 27 April 2006 (UTC)
 * So if we're not splitting this article, can I remove the cleanup tag?The Raven's Apprentice(Talk) 07:43, 7 May 2006 (UTC)
 * This article is definitely too long not to be split. I don't get the point about the cross-referencing.  The consensus seems to be to split, so I don't see why we don't. Rhindle The Red 14:13, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

What about the games??
Shouldn't this article have more information about Team Rocket's role in the video games? The Raven's Apprentice(Talk) 07:49, 7 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Probably, we may decide to split Jessie, James and Meowth into one article and the rest into another. You can bring it up at the project's talk page. H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 11:06, 7 May 2006 (UTC)
 * They only appear in Pokemon: Yellow, and their role is based off the video game...The extent of it is basically them showing up about three or four times to battle with you, suing the Pokemon they originally had (though they do evolve, just like in the series, except Meowth, if I recall correctly, does too). Michael 03:09, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Noticed the date? The message was posted waaaay back when all of Team Rocket was still one article. The Raven's Apprentice (Call) 07:35, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Kana
Are Kojirō and Musashi's names written in Kanji or Katakana? 武蔵 or ムサシ is Musashi, and 小次郎 or コジロー or コヂロー is Kojirō. ' (Feeling chatty? ) (Edits!) 20:44, 14 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Kanji Katakana, I think, it's what we normally use. I use Kanji Katakana (well I wouldn't know.. it comes out the JP generator, so I hope it's Kanji Katakana) but the article leads in creature articles are in Kanji Katakana, so go with that. Cheers, H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 20:48, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Okay, I am stupid. H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 21:16, 14 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Just so we're clear, Kanji is the more complicated writing, with characters representing words. 武蔵 is Kanji. Katakana is the simplier system, with characters representing sounds. ムサシ is Katakana. That's what's used in creature articles. I'll just put in the Katakana for now, then see if I can find any mentions of their names in Japanese writing. '  (Feeling chatty? ) (Edits!) 21:11, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Found it. Hope mentioning Kojirō being more common is good enough. '  (Feeling chatty? ) (Edits!) 21:28, 14 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Can you cite that? If you reference it, just add infront, and it'll note that the reference is in Japanese. H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 21:35, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
 * 6" Pokemon Pocket Monster Musashi & Kojiro (Team Rocket) Figure 2-Pack. It'll do for now. I'll try to find a better source. '  (Feeling chatty? ) (Edits!) 01:04, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
 * I've also changed it to Kojiro, to conform with the packaging of the toy (you can barely see the O and MUSASHI behind Jessie). '  (Feeling chatty? ) (Edits!) 01:20, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

Image
How is Image:TeamRocket.png worse than Image:Goodmanpokemon02 edited.jpg, which has been JPEG artifacted to Hell? Is it the aliasing? What? ' (Feeling chatty? ) (Edits!) 02:04, 18 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Because someone recoloured in Jessie's hair. It's an early version anime, before the anime was coloured by computer. H ig hway Rainbow Sneakers 10:05, 18 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Both pictures are crap. There are limitless Team Rocket pictures laying around - we can't do better than this? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.138.115.3 (talk • contribs)


 * I've added Image:Team Rocket2.png, does this satisfy everyone? H ig hway Batman! 12:51, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

I had to revert to an earlier edit with the picture that I took of the live actors dressed as Team Rocket shrunken. NoseNuggets 7:46 PM US EDT Aug 14 2006.

4kids are the devil?
I've seen this on a few sites, but I'm not sure what episode it was from or if its real. Anyone know and is it noteworthy? http://youtube.com/watch?v=2K5UZXaAVZo

I found the episode, its 130. "The Whistle Stop." I think I should add it.

Mewtwo Returns?!
Were Jessie, James, and Meowth's memories erased with the rest of Team Rocket's at the end of "Mewtwo Returns"? I didn't get a chance to see the movie, so I don't know. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tz0o (talk • contribs)
 * Apparently. -- The Raven's Apprentice (Talk 15:22, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

No Jessie,James and Meowth kept their memories at the end. Infact for most of the movie Meowth was helping mewtwo and even gave a speech at the end that convinced mewtwo not to erase everyone's memory. Know it all guy

Split
Why is somebody talking of spliting this article? Vikrant Phadkay 14:50, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

sevii islands part
I'm deleting it because there's nothing in the games that says that Giovanni actually reformed team rocket or that they were responsible for Deoxys.70.16.25.12 23:52, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Shellder
Shellder is not WP:CRUFT. James sent out his Weezing to capture it, but Jessie threw her Poké Ball at it instead and she captured it. Within the same episode (The Evolution Solution) it bit onto a Slowpoke's tail. Check out the episode. It really happened. --PAK Man Talk 20:43, 19 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Wait, nevermind, should have read the section about it first. Still think Shellder could be mentioned briefly, though. --PAK Man Talk 20:44, 19 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information. --The Raven's Apprentice (PokéNav 14:19, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

Team Rcoket motto
Can somebody post the new Team Rocket motto from dp?141.151.1.241 00:52, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

STOP!!
People need to stop adding bogus new Pokemon rumors for jessie and james!--72.208.195.160 00:24, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Release of Cacnea
Please do not keep moving Cacnea to "Released". It has not yet happened, and even the scans (which can't be used as a reference) do not state that Cacnea is going to be released. It is pure OR to state otherwise. MelicansMatkin 18:17, 10 October 2007 (UTC)
 * The idea that Cacnea leaves comes from the title: "Gardenia and Cacnea! A Farewell is for Whom!" Heavily implied, sure, but a release is certainly not confirmed at this point. --Sonic Mew 02:52, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Exactly. MelicansMatkin 15:37, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

'' On the way to Veilstone City, Ash and the others arrive in a town where the once again see Gardenia, the Eterna Gym Leader. Team Rocket also arrives in town. Gardenia asks Ash and friends to have a tag battle between her and James. Gardenia then tells James that he is not using Cacnea to its full potential, and offers to take Cacnea and help train it.''
 * Hate to burst your bubble but look at what I found on TV.com for the summary

Of course if any of you are members at that site all you have to do is talk to editor who handles the Pokemon section at TV.com to help with finding a source to the details. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.59.237.110 (talk) 06:08, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Asking to have Cacnea is not actually receiving Cacnea. MelicansMatkin 12:19, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

Large paring down of article
Over the next few minutes, I'm going to be removing large, trivial parts of this article in compliance with WP:CRUFT because of its large length. --Jedravent (talk) 00:40, 5 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Okay, I removed part of it, but there's still much more than there needs to be.

Relevant page history
Some page history that used to be at the title "Team Rocket" can now be found at Talk:Team Rocket/Old history. Graham 87 14:06, 29 December 2010 (UTC)

team rocket
how did jessie and james go from being inept every season to being mean and horrible and actually getting wrong things right,i dont like them like that,put them back to old school,also bring back brock and misty,the ones he travels with now are silly,getting really silly with the pokemon now as well,just adding a word on the end is ridiculous,its about time ash won the tournament went home and settled down with misty,after all hes been travelling 17 years and learnt alot,he even forgot all his pokemon hes caught, — Preceding unsigned comment added by 151.228.25.239 (talk) 19:55, 10 December 2013 (UTC)

Reverted this.
I've reverted this to its last pre-redirect revision. --DarthNightmaricus (talk) 02:55, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Requested move 3 August 2016

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was: Moved — JFG talk 03:54, 12 August 2016 (UTC)

Team Rocket (anime) → Team Rocket – Currently, Team Rocket redirects to List_of_Pokémon_characters, while the actual article has the title Team Rocket (anime). In the animated series, Team Rocket is more important, as they take on the role of the antagonists. soetermans. ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 15:32, 3 August 2016 (UTC) CN¥
 * Support. There's no point in the redirect which then tells you to visit the main article. kennethaw88 • talk 01:21, 5 August 2016 (UTC)
 * Support. It's the common name (WP:UCRN), plus "anime" is unnecessarily restrictive to the scope. Wolfdog (talk) 23:23, 9 August 2016 (UTC)