Talk:Tell el-Qudeirat

Possible Future Avenues for Improvement
I'll probably just strike my own comments here as I resolve issues, and leave more comments as I uncover new ones.

I am working without (at present) access to The Excavations at Kadesh-Barnea edited by Rudolph Cohen (1981). That work contains contributions by multiple authors that appear important. If anyone has access, they could probably help quite a bit.

Quseima does not have a Wikipedia article, and I would like a bit more information on it. Perhaps I'll find some.

I need to clarify the relationship between Tell el-Qudeirat, Wadi el-Qudeirat, Ain el-Qudeirat, and Jebel el-Qudeirat. I suspect that the Tell and the Jebel are one and the same. I know what a Wadi is, and that there is one near the Tell, but I wish I knew of a map I could link to in a footnote. It sounds almost like the Tell and the Ain are synonyms, but I think I saw a source that distinguishes them. Argh!

I need to clarify what Mordechai Haiman (see the citation) means by "Negev Highlands". He and other authors view El Qudeirat as being part of a class of ancient settlements in the "Negev Highlands", although I'm not yet sure just what is included in that phrase. The Wikipedia article Negev refers to a region in Israel, but Tell el-Qudeirat is in Egypt, so I'm not linking out to the Negev article at the moment until I have a clearer picture of the Negev Highlands.

A quick search hasn't yet revealed a Wikipedia article on Iron Age II that I can link to. I'm hoping that there's a well-accepted definition of Iron Age II that I can use in the article. Alephb (talk) 21:18, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Alephb, "Tell" means "ruin," "Wadi" means "gulch; "gully; riverine brook; valley," "Ain" means "spring; well" (i.e. where there is water), and "Jebel" means "mountain." I do not have access to the book that you cited, but when I go the next time (perhaps after our holidays) to the Hebrew University library in Jerusalem, I'd be more than glad to check these sources.Davidbena (talk) 18:42, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * One more thing: "Negev" is a Hebrew word for "South," or "South country". So, "Negev Highlands" simply means "Southern Highlands," the region of the country between Sinai and Israel proper. Perhaps it is so-called because of higher elevations in relation to the other areas of the Negev.Davidbena (talk) 18:45, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * As far as I know tell means hill, at least in Arabic, so it's plausible that Tell and Jebel el Qudeirat are one and the same.
 * Is this the book you mean? If so, I can send you a PDF copy if you email me. –&#8239;Joe (talk) 19:17, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Actually, the map on pg. 2 of that book clarifies all the toponyms you mention: Wadi el-Qudeirat is a stream fed by the Ain el-Qudeirat, and cuts south of the Jebel el-Qudeirat (a mountain). Tell el-Qudeirat is located between the bottom of the mountain slope and the north bank of the wadi, about 1.5 km downstream of the spring. –&#8239;Joe (talk) 19:29, 8 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm not recalling he source at the moment, but I saw what appeared to be a photo of the fortress of Tell el-Qudeirat with the captain "the fortress at Jebel el-Qudeirat." But it sounds like Joe's map clears that up.
 * Davidbena, part of the reason for my confusion was that I was aware of the meanings of "tell" and "ain", but in this case it seemed like scholars were using Tell el-Qudeirat and Ain el-Qudeirat as synonyms. One scholar would say that "Everyone agrees Kadesh-barnea was at Tell el-Qudeirat", and then some other scholar would say, "It is generally agreed that Kadesh-barnea was at Ain el-Qudeirat." Alephb (talk) 21:18, 8 September 2018 (UTC)