Talk:Telmarines

Merge
I have merged the article Telmarine into this one. aliceinlampyland 11:49, 1 February 2006 (UTC).

Telmar
Telmar is also the world's largest media planning service provider. www.telmar.com. The word was originally derived from "telemarketing" and was reduced to make it easier to say and remember. This was before the word was used to talk about "telemarketing" as a phone approach to sales.
 * (DAB notice long since added. -- Elphion (talk) 20:23, 3 March 2016 (UTC))

Speculative: Appearance / suggested Polynesian ancestry of Telmarines
The following appeared without verifiable references:


 * However, the Telmarines (who invaded after earlier Narnian kings disappeared and presumably would have strong Polynesian ancestry) are never referred to as such.

Citations should be added before such a suggestion that is not part of the body of common knowledge on this work is restored to the article. DvonD (talk) 13:26, 30 May 2008 (UTC)


 * (no longer in the article -- Elphion (talk) 20:23, 3 March 2016 (UTC))

Speculative and relevance: the ethnic origin of minor characters in film adaptation
The following was removed to this talk page awaiting verifiable references:


 * the film also uses some Slavic, Mexican, and South American actors.

Citations should be added to this suggestion which is outside the body of common knowledge related to the work.

In addition, it has been removed to this talk page until a consensus of editors ascertain whether it has any meaningful relevance to the article. Recall that the article is about the fictional place Telmar, and not about the film adaptation of Prince Caspian or its cast-members. Further, the principle cast-members to not appear to satisfy this claim and it is a puzzle as to why minor or unnamed characters are the subject of any encyclopedic discussion.DvonD (talk) 13:32, 30 May 2008 (UTC)


 * (The article now claims Latin origin only for the principal actors, and this is discussed in the article for the film. -- Elphion (talk) 20:23, 3 March 2016 (UTC))

Calormenes vs castaways
This article is currently really confusing: it says that Telmar was first colonized by Calormenes, who then came to Narnia during a famine, but then it also says Telmar was colonized by the 12 human castaways. I haven't seen any evidence anywhere else that Calormenes were involved at all--I re-skimmed Prince Caspian last night and found no mention of that. So I think that sentence in the article here is probably just wrong, but excising it would require reorganizing the paragraph, and I don't have any good sources of info about Telmar other than the book itself, which may not be the last word. So I'm leaving it alone, but it would be great if someone with access to Narnia scholarship materials could clean up this discrepancy. --Elysdir (talk) 06:24, 14 June 2008 (UTC)

I agree; I will change this paragraph and remove the Calormene settlement section if there is no objection EyeBall67 10 November 2008 —Preceding undated comment was added at 01:51, 11 November 2008 (UTC).


 * (This part of the article has been rewritten for clarity -- Elphion (talk) 20:23, 3 March 2016 (UTC))

German Eagle
Why does the flag of Telmar look like the German eagle during the Weimar Republic? Is this a coincidence or did someone want to draw paralleles? -- Orthographicus (talk) 21:12, 3 September 2011 (UTC)
 * The arms and flag are based on the original Pauline Baynes illustrations, for example her picture of Miraz in duel with Peter (http://www.paulinebaynes.com/?what=artifacts&image_id=571&cat=69). Goustien (talk) 05:08, 19 February 2015 (UTC)
 * The linked Pauline Baynes illustration has the eagel with an orange background. The "File:Flag of Telmar.png" etc. are yellow. tahc chat 15:47, 19 February 2015 (UTC)
 * In the film, you may recall, the Telmarine standard bears a device similar to a compass rose, which would suggest an originally seafaring nation; as well as a perhaps inconstant, not to say treacherous national character. Though whence this device is derived, I cannot say. Nuttyskin (talk) 14:27, 31 July 2015 (UTC)
 * I've added a note to the box mentioning Baynes. -- Elphion (talk) 20:23, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

Need to separate out the film information
The information about the film needs to be in its own section as it is in the other Narnia articles. LloydSommerer (talk) 12:22, 12 November 2014 (UTC)


 * I've removed most of the film-specific information. It's mostly not relevant for a general article about the Telmarines, and plot details are discussed elsewhere. -- Elphion (talk) 20:23, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

coextensive with Narnia
Since the relationship between Telmar and Narnia (country) is very unclear without this description, I added "By conquest, the land of Telmar is roughly coextensive, with the former and later country of Narnia."

As this seems obvious to me from the article (as a whole) and/or the books, can you tell me which part of my edit you object to and in what way. For example, do you think it may have been by means other than conquest? We can then try to reword in a way that we are both happy with. tahc chat 21:58, 3 March 2016 (UTC)


 * Lewis (PC, p. 41-42) has Cornelius say, "It was your Highness's ancestor, Caspian the First, who first conquered Narnia and made it his Kingdom. It was he that brought all your nation into the country. You are not Narnians at all. You are all Telmarines – that is, you all came from the Land of Telmar, far beyond the Western Mountains."  In other words, the Telmarines abandoned Telmar for Narnia (presumably because of the famine in Telmar), and Telmar is a place distinct from Narnia.  Caspian and Miraz are styled Kings of Narnia, not Kings of Telmar.  They call themselves Narnians, not Telmarines – which is why Cornelius has to explain that they are not, in fact, true Narnians. -- Elphion (talk) 22:16, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

Requested move 3 March 2016

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was: moved. Number   5  7  21:58, 11 March 2016 (UTC)

Telmar → Telmarines – because the article is only about the people who came from Telmar, and not about Telmar itself (e.g. no scene in the books takes place there). tahc chat 22:37, 3 March 2016 (UTC)
 * I now agree with you.
 * The article still needs changes to make this more clear. Since the article is more about the people who came from Telmar than aboour Telmar itself (e.g. no scene in the books takes place there), I propose we rename the article to Telmarines. tahc chat 22:26, 3 March 2016 (UTC)


 * I was about to make the same suggestion. (Ironically, "Telmarine" was originally merged here.)  I think we should get some independent opinions first, though. -- Elphion (talk) 22:31, 3 March 2016 (UTC)


 * Question Which term is most used in the book? Or both? That seems as relevant as whether the article is mainly about the place/people? Pincrete (talk) 21:43, 6 March 2016 (UTC)
 * Neither is used much in the book. They are introduced to explain the background, but then the Telmarines are largely referred to as "Miraz's army".  At the end, when Aslan explains their fate, the terms Telmarine and Telmar appear again briefly.  The point, though, is that the book only mentions Telmar, while the Telmarines actually appear.  We know essentially nothing about Telmar itself except roughly where it is, and that the Telmarines once lived there. -- Elphion (talk) 00:20, 7 March 2016 (UTC)


 * Support. The use of Telmar is only by extension of Telmarines, who actually appear in the book.  —  AjaxSmack   02:17, 9 March 2016 (UTC)
 * Support. Unfortunately, owing to the merge both the article and the target have significant histories which must be preserved for copyleft purposes. But it will be worth it. Andrewa (talk) 04:54, 11 March 2016 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

refimprove
I removed the refimprove template, as I believe the article is now adequately sourced. Since you have reinstated it, it would help if you would tag things that you think need references. (or explain here.) -- Elphion (talk) 23:17, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

Support this request. If no rationale is provided, the tag should be removed, as it appears to now have been. Andrewa (talk) 04:58, 11 March 2016 (UTC)