Talk:Thanksgiving/Archive 5

Problematic OR Presentation
The presentation below strikes me as WP:Synthesis. A scholarly secondary source should be found to say this, not a collection of "representative" sources complied by a Wikipedia editor. The present presentation of these sources as representative for various faith traditions or North Americans is OR. (ie. who determined these people are representative and Reagan is not a recognized historian). I will remove to here (something better is needed). Alanscottwalker (talk) 21:14, 26 May 2012 (UTC)


 * "The Judeo-Christian heritage is widely viewed as the foundation of the official Thanksgiving Day holidays in North America."

Taught the Pilgrims how to fish?
In the first paragraph of the section "In the United States" there is an unsourced statement: "While initially, the Plymouth colony did not have enough food to feed half of the 102 colonists, the Wampanoag Native Americans helped the Pilgrims by providing seeds and teaching them to fish." That can't possibly be true as written. We're expected to believe that the Pilgrims had no idea how to fish? But in the main article Thanksgiving (United States) there is a statement that seems much more believable: "Squanto, a Patuxet Native American who resided with the Wampanoag tribe, taught the Pilgrims how to catch eel and grow corn and served as an interpreter for them (Squanto had learned English while enslaved in Europe and during travels in England). Additionally the Wampanoag leader Massasoit had donated food stores to the fledgling colony during the first winter when supplies brought from England were insufficient" I'm deleting the unsourced statement from this article and leaving it to other editors to replace it with something substantiated. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.40.14.215 (talk) 02:09, 12 October 2012 (UTC) MorbidAnatomy (talk) 02:12, 12 October 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 16 October 2012
Here, I am quoting a string, then providing a suggested new version, and then explaining what is changing:

>And so, in an effort by President Abraham Lincoln (influenced by the campaigning of author Sarah Josepha Hale who wrote letters to politicians for around 40 years trying to make it an official holiday), to foster a sense of American unity between the Northern and Southern states, proclaimed the date to be the final Thursday in November.[22] Because of the ongoing Civil War and the Confederate States of America's refusal to recognize Lincoln's authority, the concept of "nationwide" Thanksgiving did not totally take effect until Reconstruction completed in the 1870s.

Try changing it to this (minor changes, and they are explained further below):

>And so, President Abraham Lincoln (influenced by the campaigning of author Sarah Josepha Hale, who wrote letters to politicians for around 40 years trying to make it an official holiday), to try to foster a sense of American unity between the Northern and Southern states, proclaimed the date to be the final Thursday in November.[22] Because of the ongoing Civil War and the Confederate States of America's refusal to recognize Lincoln's authority, the concept of "nationwide" Thanksgiving did not totally take effect until Reconstruction was completed in the 1870s.

The changes:

To provide for a correct sentence structure, remove "in an effort by" and replace it with the later "to try".

Put a comma after "Hale", because "who wrote ..." is merely adding extra information.

Insert "was" just before "completed" in last sentence.

128.63.16.20 (talk) 18:50, 16 October 2012 (UTC)
 * That entire paragraph needed some copy editing for cohesion. I went ahead and did a quick copy edit. &mdash; KuyaBriBri Talk 21:18, 16 October 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 23 October 2012
The article would be improved with a link to my analysis of nonsense about Thanksgiving that appears (or has appeared) on ca. 200 different websites. The article is called "Thanksgiving on the Net: Roast Bull with Cranberry Sauce." The link is:

www.sail1620.org/history/articles/93-roast-bull-cranberry-sauce.html

Thank you for inserting this somewhere. Jeremy Bangs

Dr. Jeremy Dupertuis Bangs, Director Leiden American Pilgrim Museum p/a Mandenmakerssteeg 11 2311 E D Leiden,    The Netherlands www.leidenamericanpilgrimmuseum.org/index.htm

94.208.73.27 (talk) 10:45, 23 October 2012 (UTC)


 * Thank you. It has been added. Alanscottwalker (talk) 11:32, 23 October 2012 (UTC)

pumpkin pie edit request
Unless this is also true in Liberia, Japan, and Norfolk Island, etc, please add "...in North America." to the pumpkin pie photo caption. Thanks, Wordreader (talk) 23:02, 14 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Um, OK, it was already in the NA section though.

Suggestion: reducing clutter through list-defined references
Regarding. Per Citing_sources: "Inline references can significantly bloat the wikitext in the edit window and can be extremely difficult and confusing. There are three methods that avoid clutter in the edit window: list-defined references, short citations or parenthetical references. (As with other citation formats, articles should not undergo large scale conversion between formats without consensus to do so.)" I'd like to introduce list-defined references to this article, to make it more friendly to edit (less code -> closer to WYSWIWYG). Per the request of editor who reverted me and WP:CITEVAR recommendation I'd like to ask editors interested in this article for input which style they prefer, and strongly suggest following the "avoid clutter" recommendation. While LDR add a little code to the total size of the article, it amounts to only 10% or so of the total article size, so load time should not be significantly affected (nobody should notice a 10% change; also, section edit load time will shorter anyway...), and editing experience should become much friendlier. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 06:03, 17 November 2012 (UTC)
 * we need proof of this "significantly bloat the wikitext in the edit window and can be extremely difficult and confusing" -- I do not see it. I note that Piotrus has spammed many articles with his notice--and before he was stopped earlier today he was using a bot of some sort to make major formatting changes to major articles  On none of those articles had he been an active editor and he never saw any of the "significant bloat''. The idea is a bad one because it makes it hard for the user to follow the notes. Rjensen (talk) 06:53, 17 November 2012 (UTC)

A method that works to separate text from long refs and make ref ends easier to find (while still keeping them near the text they support, and thus easier to find) is simply putting the '''  (close ref) on a separate line (all by itself) at the end of the ref, and then adding a carriage return before continuing with the text - unless there are multiple refs, in which having a line which contains only  ''' also makes the separation between refs easier to find. Carriage returns do not add to the length of text any more than a space character does (and much less than putting all the refs at the end). However, occasionally, some people mistakenly feel the need to "clean-up" such an arrangement.--JimWae (talk) 22:05, 17 November 2012 (UTC)

Virginia
On February 9, 1850, Prince William County, Virginia delegate Benoni Evans Harrison to the Virginia Assembly "Laid on Table" a petition to have a Thanksgiving. The petition reads as follows:

"The following petition was produced by the citizens of Prince William County, Virginia, and submitted to the Virginia General Assembly.

To the members of the Genl Assembly of Virginia. We the undersigned citizens of the County of Prince William would most respectfully represent that there ought to be some provision authorizing the Governor of this Commonwealth to appoint annually some day in November to be observed as a day of public thanksgiving & prayer. We believe that such provision would operate beneficially upon the morals of the community & elevate the minds of all in a thankful form to that Being from whom flow all the blessings which we enjoy. We therefore humbly pray that you will adopt some measure (either by resolution or bill) best calculated to carry out the above suggestion. 1. Wm J. Weir 2. P. D. Lipscomb 3. Wm W. Monroe 4. J. E. Nixon 5. Alfred Ball 6. A. Shaw 7. J. Williams 8. Wm P. Foster 9. Geo. W. Tennille 10. G. W. Clifford 11. T. Leachman 12. Wm Edwd Lipscomb 13. Robert C. Page 14. Wm H. Franklin 15. E. W. Latimer 16. W. Tasker Weir 17. John Towles 18. J. C. Goods 19. D. Wroe 20. Robert Deats 21. Joseph Osmun 22. F. P. Brawner 23. Henry Keys 24. Thos K. Davis 25. Jas W. Washington 26. William Weeks 27. John Camper 28. Garret Hulfish 29. Jesse L. Frittz 30. Otho Berkley 31. John W. Bowen 32. Henry A. Barron 33. Chas W. Latimer 34. A. Howison 35. Jas Howison 36. James M. Sinclair 37. Charles W. Alexander 38. G. W. Mitchell 39. John Hornbaker 40. John P. T. Fitzhugh 41. R. A. Sinclair 42. Benj Cooper 43. Benjn (H.?) Cockrell 34. Wm J. Hixson 35. J. Muschett M.D. 36. T. H. Muschett 37. C. Hildeman(?) 38. Cyrus C. Marsteller 39. Abram Van Pelt 40. L. B. Norvill 41. Robt A. Calvert 42. W. W. Davis 43. R. F. Brawner 44. Walter Woodyard 45. Thos B. Gaines 46. Jno Gray 47. J. Weedon 48. Daniel Witbeck 49. Chas G. Howison 50. John A. Harrison 51. W. E. Goodwin 52. John Sulluvan 53. Robt. C. Weir 54. William W. Thornton 55. Richard G. Davis 56. William Renoe 57. Enoch Robinson 58. Moses Hixson 59. Wm Brawner 60. Jerome B. Norvill 61. James Fewell 62. James B. T. Thornton 63. B. Brawner 64. Jos. Janney 65. M. B. Sinclair 66. Aylett Nicol 67. Eppa Hunton 68. William Dickinson 69. James Stewart Petition of 69 citizens of the County of Prince William for the passage of a Law or resolution authorizing the Govr to appoint annually a day in Novr to Set apart be observed on a day of general thanksgiving and Prayer. B. E. Harrison Feby 9 1850 Laid on table Transcription note: The person counting the names on the petition numbered the names incorrectly. There were actually 79 names on the petition. Numbers 1-43 were correct. What should have been number 44 was counted as number 34, and so on, making the total number off by 10.

Source: From the microfilm Virginia General Assembly Legislative Petitions, Prince William County, 1819 Dec. 15 – 1858, Reel 165, Acc. # 36121, available at The Library of Virginia. Transcribed by Beverly Veness and Donald L. Wilson, Librarians of Prince William County Library's Ruth E. Lloyd Information Center (RELIC). Article submitted to Wikipedia by Raymond Vance Olszewski, author and researcher into the life and legacy of Benoni Evans Harrison. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ROlszewski (talk • contribs) 09:31, 21 November 2012 (UTC)

Secular
The article states the holiday is secular, not religious, in today's society. Because secular people celebrate the holiday and ignore religious conventions does not make it wholely secular. The holiday is, in fact, still a religious one. Schools still teach the religious connotations, churches expound on "manifest destiny," and universities such as Ohio State University talk about the pilgrims, the Puritans and the religious reasons for the celebration. The very title of "thanks" denotes a religious premise of prayer to the Judeo-Christian God. Noting that over 80% of Americans profess some form of Christian faith itself, retires the misinformation that the holiday is solely or predominantly secular. I request that the misinformation be addressed and revised to reflect the predominant culture. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jampitts (talk • contribs) 13:14, 21 November 2012 (UTC)

hey comment sa va ? mdr — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.202.36.101 (talk) 14:56, 21 November 2012 (UTC)

Thanksgiving actually celebrating a massacre of American Natives by settlers?
That's kind of what the Huffington post says: ''On that day the Massachusetts Colony Governor, John Winthrop, proclaimed such a "Thanksgiving" to celebrate the safe return of a band of heavily armed hunters, all colonial volunteers. They had just returned from their journey to what is now Mystic, Connecticut where they massacred 700 Pequot Indians. Seven hundred Indians - men, women and children - all murdered'' http://www.huffingtonpost.com/richard-greener/the-true-story-of-thanksg_b_788436.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 41.151.54.114 (talk) 08:35, 27 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Actually I think the page does deserve a "criticisms" or "controversy" section. Clearly. It's perhaps the most controversial holiday, certainly the most controversial one I can think of. And this opinion has been expressed by countless public figures of all stripes -- it surely can't be hard to dig up a few quotes. 68.173.149.250 (talk) 22:37, 6 October 2012 (UTC)


 * After hearing from massacre story countless times I'm quite appalled to see no mention of it on Wikipedia page. TheDarkLordSeth (talk) 19:46, 22 November 2012 (UTC)

Edit request - Poland
While I am not a registered user, I believe that the list of other holidays called 'Thanksgiving' should be revised to include Poland, where a holiday called 'Thanksgiving Day' (Dzień Dziękczynienia) was instituted nationwide within the Roman Catholic Church in 2005, on the first Sunday in June, see Polish Wikipedia entry: http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dzie%C5%84_Dzi%C4%99kczynienia_%28Polska%29. It is roughly modeled on the North American Thanksgiving concept but not specifically tied to the harvest. 13:54, 22 November 2012 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.28.187.36 (talk) 08:34, 22 November 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 22 November 2012
Not done: - no details of edit provided. Begoon &thinsp; talk 02:24, 23 November 2012 (UTC)

Edit request - Korea, "Fall"
The Korea section refers to "Fall", which is contrary to WP:SEASON. Could someone fix it please. 203.176.108.99 (talk) 05:26, 20 November 2012 (UTC)


 * I've tagged the text with when, but not fixed it. (The reference says it's September 30 in 2012, but "August 15th according to the lunar calendar" in general. I don't know enough about the lunar calendar to be able to put something specific in the article.) Mitch Ames (talk) 11:51, 20 November 2012 (UTC)

Edit request 23 November 2012
The article at this time does not include mention of Native Americans in the origin of Thanksgiving as an American holiday. It is still widely taught in public schools that Thanksgiving originated as a feast shared by settlers and American Indians. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.92.130.105 (talk) 20:36, 23 November 2012 (UTC)
 * The article you are looking for is Thanksgiving (United States), which is linked several times in this article. Alanscottwalker (talk) 15:47, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 25 November 2012
The statement "Several other places around the world observe similar celebrations" need a citation. It is also foggy and not clear at all. What does -similar- stands for? What -several- exactly means here? What -other places- stands for? thanks

Gara1980 (talk) 23:29, 25 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: This statement is backed up later in the article when "Thanksgiving" celebrations in other countries are covered, along with links to seperate articles for some of them.  RudolfRed (talk) 00:12, 26 November 2012 (UTC)

I think that wikipedia is expected to relate both sides of the picture- biblical and scientific- wiki did NOT do a good job on your end of biblical.

Intro
I think the intro does a very bad job of explaining what the holiday is about. Its so confusing when a wikipedia article does not start with 'What is this' — Preceding unsigned comment added by Vibhabamba (talk • contribs) 22:31, 28 November 2012 (UTC)


 * "Thanksgiving Day is a national holiday [] in . . ." That is what it is . . .   And its different in different nations.  Alanscottwalker (talk) 22:54, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

Talking about "Traditionally celebrates the giving of thanks for the autumn harvest."
The page for "Public holidays in the United States" at "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_holidays_in_the_United_States" describes "Thanksgiving Day" thusly:

"Traditionally celebrates the giving of thanks for the autumn harvest. Traditionally includes the sharing of a turkey dinner. Traditional start of the Christmas and holiday season."

Respectfully suggested is (1) an inadequacy in the first sentence re "thanks for the autumn harvest", which is not the principal purpose; and (2) omission of many peoples' belief that this is a day of giving thanks to "Almighty God" and "our beneficent Father who dwelleth in the Heavens" (per Abraham Lincoln, cf below).

I know this suggestion touches two difficult issues of whether Thanksgiving Day has ANY religious meanings, and whether ANY such meanings should be recognized by Wikipedia scholars. IMHO, I suggest the religious overtone and reverence seen in any holiday by hundreds of millions of people in the US should be recognized. Interrogatory: If this were a reference to a holiday or festival with significant religious meaning to millions of aboriginal practitioners of a animist faith, would Wikipedia scholars ignore the religious meanings there? I think not. I hope not.

Further, the description "thanks for the autumn harvest" seems more appropriate to other festivals, like Oktoberfest in Germany, which to my understanding is not related, underpinned, or tangential to thanking the source of the autumn harvest. In Lincoln's proclamation of Thanksgiving, Lincoln invites us to focus on the source ("Almighty God") responsible for "the blessings of fruitful fields and healthful skies". Focusing on the source, and ascribing "Devine purposes" to that source, is a unique attribute of Thanksgiving Day, very much distinguishing Thanksgiving Day from the celebration of good crops alone. IMHO.

Please let me suggest a new articulation:

'''Traditionally celebrates the giving of thanks for the first autumn harvest in the New World by the Pilgrims. Then and subsequently, Thanksgiving Day particularly ascribes for many religious peoples the source of the good harvest to "the Most High God," without preferentially crediting one religious tradition over another. Traditionally includes the sharing of a turkey dinner. Traditional start of the Christmas and holiday season.'''

Offered below is the original transcript fro Abraham Lincoln, as recorded by "Proclamation of Thanksgiving" at "http://www.abrahamlincolnonline.org/lincoln/speeches/thanks.htm".

The year that is drawing towards its close, has been filled with the blessings of fruitful fields and healthful skies. To these bounties, which are so constantly enjoyed that we are prone to forget the source from which they come, others have been added, which are of so extraordinary a nature, that they cannot fail to penetrate and soften even the heart which is habitually insensible to the ever watchful providence of Almighty God. ..... No human counsel hath devised nor hath any mortal hand worked out these great things. They are the gracious gifts of the Most High God... ..... I do therefore invite my fellow citizens ... to set apart and observe the last Thursday of November next, as a day of Thanksgiving and Praise to our beneficent Father who dwelleth in the Heavens. And I recommend to them that while offering up the ascriptions justly due to Him for such singular deliverances and blessings, they do also, with humble penitence for our national perverseness and disobedience, commend to His tender care all those who have become widows, orphans, mourners or sufferers in the lamentable civil strife in which we are unavoidably engaged, and fervently implore the interposition of the Almighty Hand to heal the wounds of the nation and to restore it as soon as may be consistent with the Divine purposes to the full enjoyment of peace, harmony, tranquillity and Union.

Respectfully, --Mrkc225 (talk) 19:11, 13 April 2013 (UTC)


 * Hi. You appear to be in the wrong place.  If you want to make suggestions about the text of "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_holidays_in_the_United_States" you should go to "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Public_holidays_in_the_United_States" or if you wish to make suggestions concerning Thanksgiving (United States), you may transfer your comments there.  This article seeks to cover the day as it developed several different countries. Alanscottwalker (talk) 19:32, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

Guineafowls
"Most of the U.S. aspects of Thanksgiving (such as the turkey or what were called guineafowls originating from Madagascar), were incorporated when United Empire Loyalists began to flee from the United States during the American Revolution and settled in Canada". So what animal are we talking about when we say "what were called gioneafowls from Madagascar"? Rui &#39;&#39;Gabriel&#39;&#39; Correia (talk) 14:55, 16 September 2013 (UTC)


 * Don't know. I trimmed it until someone can explain.  Alanscottwalker (talk) 17:56, 16 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks, Alanscottwalker. I'll post the question also at Guinea fowl. Regards, Rui &#39;&#39;Gabriel&#39;&#39; Correia (talk) 12:41, 17 September 2013 (UTC)

Broken Link
The URL for the Source: "Bangs, Jeremy D. "Thanksgiving on the Net: Roast Bull with Cranberry Sauce". Sail 1620. Society of Mayflower Descendants in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. Retrieved 2012-10-23." needs updating. The linked page is an unrelated article. The correct URL is: http://www.sail1620.org/articles/1621-a-historian-looks-anew-at-thanksgiving — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rw63phi (talk • contribs) 09:15, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

Edit Request
In the Observance -> Canada section, there should be no comma in the sentence "...the holiday is nonetheless, recognized and celebrated..."

Please change: "...the holiday is nonetheless, recognized and celebrated..." To: "...the holiday is nonetheless recognized and celebrated..."


 * Yes check.svg Done. Thanks. --Stfg (talk) 09:28, 28 November 2013 (UTC)

American Thanksgiving Info.
The Pilgrims set ground at Plymouth Rock on December 11, 1620. Their first winter was devastating and by the fall they had lost 46 of the original 102 who sailed on the Mayflower. However, the harvest of 1621 was a bountiful one and the remaining colonists decided to celebrate with a feast, so they invited the Native American Indians who had helped them survive their first year. The feast lasted three days and included wild ducks, geese, venison, fish, boiled pumpkin, berries and dried fruits. It is not certain that wild turkey was a part of their feast since the pilgrims used the word "turkey" to mean any sort of wild fowl.

However, this first Thanksgiving feast was not repeated the following year. In fact, it wasn’t until June of 1676 that the governing council of Charlestown, Massachusetts proclaimed another Day of Thanksgiving to express thanks for the good fortune that had seen their community securely established.

However, much like the original Thanksgiving in 1620, this day was also not repeated the following year. October 1777 marked the first time that all 13 colonies joined in a Thanksgiving celebration but again, this was a one-time affair.

In fact, until 1863 Thanksgiving Day had not been celebrated annually since the first feast in 1621. It was Sarah Josepha Hale, a magazine editor, whose efforts eventually led to what we recognize today as Thanksgiving. She encouraged President Abraham Lincoln to establish the last Thursday in November as a day for national thanksgiving and prayer, hence, Thanksgiving Day.

The following information can be found at: http://www.abrahamlincolnonline.org/lincoln/speeches/thanks.htm

Proclamation of Thanksgiving Washington, D.C. October 3, 1863

This is the proclamation which set the precedent for America's national day of Thanksgiving. During his administration, President Lincoln issued many orders similar to this. For example, on November 28, 1861, he ordered government departments closed for a local day of thanksgiving.

Sarah Josepha Hale, a 74-year-old magazine editor, wrote a letter to Lincoln on September 28, 1863, urging him to have the "day of our annual Thanksgiving made a National and fixed Union Festival." She explained, "You may have observed that, for some years past, there has been an increasing interest felt in our land to have the Thanksgiving held on the same day, in all the States; it now needs National recognition and authoritive fixation, only, to become permanently, an American custom and institution."

Prior to this, each state scheduled its own Thanksgiving holiday at different times, mainly in New England and other Northern states. President Lincoln responded to Mrs. Hale's request immediately, unlike several of his predecessors, who ignored her petitions altogether. In her letter to Lincoln she mentioned that she had been advocating a national thanksgiving date for 15 years as the editor of Godey's Lady's Book. George Washington was the first president to proclaim a day of thanksgiving, issuing his request on October 3, 1789, exactly 74 years before Lincoln's.

The document below sets apart the last Thursday of November "as a day of Thanksgiving and Praise." According to an April 1, 1864, letter from John Nicolay, one of President Lincoln's secretaries, this document was written by Secretary of State William Seward, and the original was in his handwriting. On October 3, 1863, fellow Cabinet member Gideon Welles recorded in his diary how he complimented Seward on his work. A year later the manuscript was sold to benefit Union troops.

By the President of the United States of America.

A Proclamation.

The year that is drawing towards its close, has been filled with the blessings of fruitful fields and healthful skies. To these bounties, which are so constantly enjoyed that we are prone to forget the source from which they come, others have been added, which are of so extraordinary a nature, that they cannot fail to penetrate and soften even the heart which is habitually insensible to the ever watchful providence of Almighty God. In the midst of a civil war of unequaled magnitude and severity, which has sometimes seemed to foreign States to invite and to provoke their aggression, peace has been preserved with all nations, order has been maintained, the laws have been respected and obeyed, and harmony has prevailed everywhere except in the theatre of military conflict; while that theatre has been greatly contracted by the advancing armies and navies of the Union. Needful diversions of wealth and of strength from the fields of peaceful industry to the national defence, have not arrested the plough, the shuttle or the ship; the axe has enlarged the borders of our settlements, and the mines, as well of iron and coal as of the precious metals, have yielded even more abundantly than heretofore. Population has steadily increased, notwithstanding the waste that has been made in the camp, the siege and the battle-field; and the country, rejoicing in the consiousness of augmented strength and vigor, is permitted to expect continuance of years with large increase of freedom. No human counsel hath devised nor hath any mortal hand worked out these great things. They are the gracious gifts of the Most High God, who, while dealing with us in anger for our sins, hath nevertheless remembered mercy. It has seemed to me fit and proper that they should be solemnly, reverently and gratefully acknowledged as with one heart and one voice by the whole American People. I do therefore invite my fellow citizens in every part of the United States, and also those who are at sea and those who are sojourning in foreign lands, to set apart and observe the last Thursday of November next, as a day of Thanksgiving and Praise to our beneficent Father who dwelleth in the Heavens. And I recommend to them that while offering up the ascriptions justly due to Him for such singular deliverances and blessings, they do also, with humble penitence for our national perverseness and disobedience, commend to His tender care all those who have become widows, orphans, mourners or sufferers in the lamentable civil strife in which we are unavoidably engaged, and fervently implore the interposition of the Almighty Hand to heal the wounds of the nation and to restore it as soon as may be consistent with the Divine purposes to the full enjoyment of peace, harmony, tranquillity and Union.

In testimony whereof, I have hereunto set my hand and caused the Seal of the United States to be affixed.

Done at the City of Washington, this Third day of October, in the year of our Lord one thousand eight hundred and sixty-three, and of the Independence of the Unites States the Eighty-eighth.

By the President: Abraham Lincoln

William H. Seward, Secretary of State — Preceding unsigned comment added by Lloyd Hayes (talk • contribs) 13:28, 28 November 2013 (UTC)


 * Material as detailed and extensive as this might be better considered for Thanksgiving (United States), rather than here. Please don't copy your first four paragraphs there, though, as they seem to be a copy of this page, which appears to be copyrighted. --Stfg (talk) 13:46, 28 November 2013 (UTC)


 * This suggests that national Thanksgivings in the fall were celebrated throughout the Revolutionary war period. and individual states had set it up before Lincoln's proclamation. Alanscottwalker (talk) 13:55, 28 November 2013 (UTC)

Deliverance of Queen Anne
"Days of Thanksgiving were called (...) following the deliverance of Queen Anne in 1705" Either the year is wrong, or I have no idea what's meant by deliverance. Because when I look at the Queen Anne article, the last pregnancy was in 1700. The only one worth celebrating IMHO would be the deliverance of Prince William, Duke of Gloucester in 1689. By 1705, he unfortunately wasn't even alive anymore. Digital Brains (talk) 20:23, 28 November 2013 (UTC)

Controversy section for United States Thanksgiving
I would like to see the addition of a section for the United States Thanksgiving based on the controversy surrounding Native American beliefs about misrepresented history, massacres and Thanksgiving. Possible places to start for research might be:

Or, if a section of its own isn't approved, links to this site's own articles outlining the National Day of Mourning begun by Native Americans in New England in 1970 and Unthanksgiving Day established in 1975 seems fitting.

The idea isn't to create controversy, of course, only to educate people that such a controversy even exists when they research Thanksgiving Day.

Mkindle (talk) 20:33, 28 November 2013 (UTC)


 * It might be a bit late for this year, but you've got almost a whole year before folks start reading the article next year! Go ahead and give it a try!  BTW, somebody asked for a citation in the controversy section despite there being 2 there already.  I just removed the  tag as clearly not needed.  Smallbones( smalltalk ) 20:59, 28 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Whoops that was in Thanksgiving (United States) . If anybody can figure out a way to make these 2 articles divide up the material in a way that makes sense, do please let us all know.  Smallbones( smalltalk ) 21:05, 28 November 2013 (UTC)

Commonwealth, not State
The caption for the photo says state of PA, but PA is a commonwealth, not a state. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.222.211.235 (talk) 06:11, 29 November 2013 (UTC)
 * check out the official website of Pennsylvania: PA.gov the Official Web Site of the State of Pennsylvania Rjensen (talk) 06:36, 29 November 2013 (UTC)

PA.gov says Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, The Key Stone State. Furthermore the article on Pennsylvania refers to it as a Commonwealth
 * The term 'commonwealth' in this case is vestigial. Pennsylvania (as well as KY, VA and MA) is a US State that uses 'commonwealth' as part of its official name. The title 'Commonwealth' in this case however, insofar as it applies to US States, has no real impact on its clasification as a US State (see: Commonwealth (U.S. state) if you have any further questions. Ryecatcher773 (talk) 03:32, 28 March 2014 (UTC)

Puritans were not radical reformers
See radical Reformation. The term has a specific meaning and the puritans do not fit. --JFH (talk) 01:13, 24 May 2014 (UTC)
 * OK. Thanks for clarifying. Zyxwv99 (talk) 13:13, 24 May 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 14 October 2014
190.82.100.74 (talk) 15:50, 14 October 2014 (UTC) a la Lissette le pica el poto

If you want to suggest a change, please request this in the form "Please replace XXX with YYY" or "Please add ZZZ between PPP and QQQ". Please also cite reliable sources to back up your request, without which no information should be added to, or changed in, any article. - Arjayay (talk) 16:08, 14 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: as you have not requested a change.

Semi-protected edit request on 24 November 2014
MUSIC:  The Thanksgiving Song by Scott Messina (featuring Eric Scott)'

72.189.181.95 (talk) 06:12, 24 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. Anupmehra  - Let's talk!  10:06, 24 November 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 24 November 2014
Under Sources please add: Thanksgiving Holiday Music and please include this Title/Link: The Thanksgiving Song by Scott Messina (featuring Eric Scott)'

72.189.181.95 (talk) 06:12, 24 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: -because duplicate request (see below). Anupmehra  - Let's talk!  10:07, 24 November 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 24 November 2014
Under Sources please add: Thanksgiving Holiday Music and please include this Title/Link: The Thanksgiving Song by Scott Messina (featuring Eric Scott)'

IShowcase (talk) 06:20, 24 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: -It doesn't contribute to improve the encyclopedic aspect of the article beyond it's present shape. See also, WP:ELNO, a guideline on what external links are accepted and what not. Anupmehra  - Let's talk!  10:12, 24 November 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 25 November 2014
71.183.6.146 (talk) 21:16, 25 November 2014 (UTC) b/ldjsbnfmFH'HFHUEWRIHT;08
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. — &#123;&#123;U&#124;Technical 13&#125;&#125; (e • t • c) 23:11, 25 November 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 27 November 2014
You have the wrong adjective in your "Thanksgiving" log

Pilgrims and Puritans who began emigrating from England in the 1620s and 1630s carried the tradition of Days of Fasting and Days of Thanksgiving with them to New England.

Please edit "emigrating" to "immigrating" as immigration is the movement of persons into a country to which they are not native in order to settle there, especially as permanent residents or future citizens. That is your own definition of "immigrate, and the Europeans coming from Europe to the Americas were/NOT native.

Main3699 (talk) 05:29, 27 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the template. Emigration is the act of leaving one's native country with the intent to settle permanently or temporarily elsewhere. - Seems more appropriate to me. — &#123;&#123;U&#124;Technical 13&#125;&#125; (e • t • c) 06:07, 27 November 2014 (UTC)

Australia
Why is Australia singled out in particular as somewhere which does not celebrate thanksgiving? The vast majority of countries in the world do not celebrate it. 217.34.253.153 (talk) 14:11, 28 November 2014 (UTC)

Deliverance of Queen Anne in 1705
In the history section :

Days of Thanksgiving were called following the victory over the Spanish Armada in 1588 and following the deliverance of Queen Anne in 1705

I didn't found any sources that talks about this deliverance — Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.45.240.18 (talk) 21:58, 10 November 2014 (UTC)


 * Regarding the Day of Thanksgiving and Anne, I read the same thing some months ago, but cannot remember where. Should it come to me, I will enter the source. My point is that at least one source exists for this information, if not more, somewhere in the ether. Thank you, Wordreader (talk) 05:45, 27 December 2014 (UTC)

Celery & olives.
I altered the statement about celery and olives to better convey what the original material says. The current source for the statement refers to an NPR interview with a woman who wrote an article on the topic for another site. I instead went to that article for my changes. I remember how ubiquitous those items used to be at Thanksgiving and on the tables of expensive restaurants: now I know why! As I don't know how to wrangle citations, could someone please change reference - reference #18 - from that interview to the actual article, "Celery and Olives Dominated Thanksgiving for Nearly 100 Years—Until They Didn’t", found at: http://www.boston.com/food-dining/food/2014/11/24/celery-and-olives-dominated-thanksgiving-for-nearly-years-until-they-didn/4GFrGQyPYexAs8OuyCKVBK/story.html

Additional information about other Thanksgiving food traditions would be interesting, especially if it illuminates how the day is celebrated unto today. Thank you, Wordreader (talk) 06:04, 27 December 2014 (UTC)