Talk:The Human League/Archive 1

Misc
Where does it say "Singles titles in quotes"?

I'm not being funny, I just can't find it. I was going to make Heaven 17 compliant but wanted to check the manual first ...

Nevilley

I just changed the singles titles to italicised rather than quotes as this seems to be the more usual protocol in wikipedia quercus robur

Oh dear, but I can't find that in the style manual either, it just says albums in italics ... maybe somone will enlighten me with ref in the manual?

Oh and well done with the pic, it's great! :) Nevilley 00:05 Nov 25, 2002 (UTC)

Songs in quotes was agreed on somewhere, but the MoS page sseems to omit it. I've added it now -- Tarquin -- actually, there's was an example there:
 * "She's Leaving Home" appears on Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band

Sorry for causing the fuss - I should've checked the MoS was clear about this. I must have been extrapolating it from "italics for novels, quotes for short stories" and that sort of thing - thanks to tarq for making it explicit. --Camembert

I think you'lle find that "together in electric dreams" was a solo hit by Phil Oakley and not the Human League.


 * Dash it Sir! I think you'll find you are right!!! Going to fix it now, let me know if OK? Thanks Nevilley 10:09 Mar 16, 2003 (UTC)

Ermmm I don't want to make trouble - nor indeed a rod for my own back, as I am offering to fix it - but isn't this band really called "The Human League" and not "Human League"??? Minor I know, but I would rather get it right. Especially as I have contributed so thoroughly to getting it wrong, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa etc etc -- Nevilley 19:54 Mar 22, 2003 (UTC)

Fascination
Shouldn't the 1983 mini-ep "Fascination" be considered an album? This had the 12" of Fascination (which, to this day, has never been released on CD), "Mirror Man", "Hard times", "I Love You too Much", "Reminds me of Gold", and a weird remix of "Fascination". Samboy 21:54, 4 Aug 2004 (UTC)


 * Since no one has commented on this, I have added the 1983 EP fascination to the list of Human Legaue albums; I'm surprised this wasn't listed here before. As an aside, this album was released in two colors; a medium grey, and a dark brown-grey; both albums are otherwise identical.  Refs:    Samboy 22:31, 7 Aug 2004 (UTC)


 * The Fascination EP is just that - an EP, not an album. The band themselves named their 8th album "Octopus" ("Love and Dancing" was the 4th) so I'd suggest moving "Fascination" to an EP sub-section of the discography. Afront 12:19, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

Secrets
Needs an update for Secrets and beyond...

Being Boiled
Shouldn't the reappearance of Being Boiled be listed under Travelogue instead of Dare?

Dare Demos
I was looking for bootlegs from back in the day and I came across Dare demos on several peer 2 peer networks. Now there are 36 tracks with everything from accappellas to instrumentals so I'm really curious if there's a story that explains how in the world did these rarities find their way to these networks?


 * Er, people uploaded them!--feline1 09:23, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

Trivia Section to be deleted
As per Wikipedia guidelines I have flagged up the trivia section for deletion in 7 days. The majority of the entries in The Human League trivia section are largely irrelevant to the band in the first place and deserve to be deleted 'per se'. Philip Oakey's collaborations with other artists are in his capacity as a Independent singer and should be on Wiki:Philip Oakey not here. The only exception should be Together In Electric Dreams as this has now been adopted as a 'Honory' Human League track by Gayle and Catherall. Covers and samples belong on that Song's page and not on the band's page unless there is some claim to notability, Such as the Controversy created by George Michael's Shoot The Dog

Andi064 17:40, 18 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Removed Trivia Section complete as per guidelines. Also removed Philip Oakey's Independent solo works as this was nothing to do with the band it belongs on Philip Oakey (which it already is) NotThe Human League. POV removed elswhere. Andi064 22:36, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

The 'New Album'
Since people insist on trying to edit this into the article as a forgone conclusion,a few facts:


 * 1 Philip Oakey has only said that it is the Band's aspiration "to record 'new material' this Year". He has hinted at a new album; but also previously at a series of commercial downloads(PO speaking to Metro Magazine)
 * 2. The Human League currently do not have a major Label that would give the necessary financial backing to release and promote a full studio album, but do have people "who want to work with them".(PO speaking to BBC SE News 22/11/06) The signing to a label would be announced well before an album is released.
 * 3. The band are understandably playing this very close to their chest, after the Label and promotional problems which caused the 'Secrets' album to fail. But the fact that they are touring again so soon may mean that the project has been shelved.
 * 4 There is absolutely no timescale or finality to this, even people very close to the band (of which I am not!) do not know what is currently happening in HL Studios. Therefore until PO makes a formal announcement about a release with a Title and date, all else is pure speculation! Andi064 19:57, 3 April 2007 (UTC)


 * Update: Susan Gayle [who is the Band media 'officer' & often acts as its spokesperson] confirmed to The Falkirk Herald newspaper on 01/05/07 that the band intend to release a new album in her words "In the near future". This is as much confirmation as there currently is on the subject.Andi064 00:59, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

Bogus Websites
Human League websites

The Human League do not have an Official Website, this is a deliberate decision by Philip Oakey (who is known to dislike appearing on the internet). Therefore any website claiming to be “Official” is Bogus. A quick e-mail to THL media enquiries will confirm this.

This includes the so called “Official Human League Myspace page” which is considered a joke by THL fan Community, (but unfortunately fools some gullible people). Bogus sites should be removed from Wikipedia immediately.

Secrets-online is the “Officially Recognised” website. In that although it is a technically a fansite, the webmaster has regular direct communication with the band and Philip Oakey has personally given his seal of approval to the site; and comments occasionally. Secrets is also used by the band to release information regularly. Other fan sites listed are known about and approved of by the band but do not have direct communication with them and should be considered Unofficial. 62.255.104.31 10:19, 4 May 2007 (UTC)


 * The above comment is unfortunately incorrect: The band declined to endorse Secrets Online, which is why it no longer exists as a purely Human League website. Secrets Online is not the "officially recognised website" as there is no such thing. Phil Oakey does not contribute to or comment on Secrets Online. One member of the band does occasionally post gig announcements and other tidbits to the Secrets Message Board, but this is not related to the Secrets Online website. On the plus side, the Secrets Online webmaster does run the official Heaven 17 website. Afront 17:45, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

81.158.192.227 14:05, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
 * That myspace page is a laughable, an official site that uses photos 12 years out of date!! Has anyone reported it to Myspace abuse or told Phil?

Andi064 18:38, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree with the above comments, I also removed the 'fake' Myspace page this morning for all the above reasons, and not for the first time! Can anyone adding external links abide by External links or they will be removed immediately. And as the above comments say there are no official Human League web sites, Myspace or Bebo profiles.

Associate band members
I have recently removed Russell Dennett and ‘Neil Sutton’ from the members section in the info box, to prevent a free for all. As far as I’m aware the Members / Previous Members section is correct and does not need editing. But I can see why they were added:

You could argue that Neil Sutton who has been with the band for 17 years deserves to be listed. But if he is not a member of the band then he cannot be added. The reason for this, it is my understanding, that for legal reasons (I'm guessing royalties / legacy contractual problems) only Oakey, Catherall and Gayle retain the band name and only they are full members of the group. Neil Sutton, Nic Burke and David Beevers are not full members but are (for want of a better term) associate members. Russell Denett who worked with the band at the same time as Neil Sutton in the early 1990s falls into this category, which is why he was also removed. There is some justification for incorporating a section on band associates in the main article, but the info box is not the place for them. As I have said, that is my understanding based on what Gayle has said on record, although she is characteristically vague on the matter. So Im not 100% certain on the full dynamics of the subject. I will create an associate members section in the article in a few days unless someone can contradict the above info with a source.

Andi064 00:52, 10 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Not listing them would be preposterous, as Sutton has written the majority of the bands material since 1990 and always is part of the performing lineup at live shows. When I buy a ticket to see the band it does not bill them as "The Human League also featuring Neil Sutton" - it just says the Human League. There's a difference between the narrow legal ownership of a trade name, and the who is in the "band" - Neil Sutton could not legally perform shows on his *own* (or with other musicians), billed as "The Human League", but that doesn't mean he isn't in the "band".--feline1 14:17, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree, this is an online encyclopedia, not a legal document. We're not distributing royalties here, we're just writing an article about the band. - eo 14:27, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
 * The point here is not how it should be, but how it is. I would personally like to see Sutton, Burke & Beevers listed in the info box because of their contribution. But if their status is not band member but supporting musician then it would be factually incorrect to list them as a band member. Susan said this in an interview for "Remember the 80s". "...Philip is what we call the musical director, and he works with a guy called Neil (Sutton) who's not actually in the group but always works with us live on stuff, and Philip writes the songs with Neil, and pushes the music in a certain direction...."Andi064 20:14, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't agree - what you are talking about is who owns the legal trademark of "The Human League". In the interview you cite, Susan uses the word "band" to refer to this entity, but she is not a lawyer, and "band" is not the correct term for this business entity. band is a very loose general term (check its wiki article). A great many performing bands with wiki articles would have a different formal line-up if articles listed who had the rights to the trade mark band name (often it would be the bands' management company!). By all means, the article can discuss the different status of Sutton et al, but it should most definately mention them (for one thing, he contributes a damn sight more to the band's music that Susan!) --feline1 22:10, 11 May 2007 (UTC)