Talk:The Treniers

Line-ups of Treniers bands
Came across a discography which mentioned Treniers band members Don Hill (as./ts.) and Gene Gibeaux (piano), who both recorded with Jay McShann's band (with Jimmy Witherspoon, Ben Webster, etc.). I include it here for future reference as there is no place to include in this article. --Technopat 18:46, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I see no reason why such information can't be added. Some sort of source would have to be cited, but we have line-ups listed in other similar articles. Feel free to add such a section. 23skidoo 00:01, 15 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Thanx for your prompt reply, 23skidoo. I agree with you in principle, but as the two band members don't yet have their own article pages, I reckon it's pushing things a bit to include such a tenuous link without further info. --Technopat 08:08, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

To correct technopat: Gene Gilbeaux and his band worked with Jimmy Witherspoon when Witherspoon wasn't working with Jay McShann in 1949. Gene Gilbeaux did not play in Jay McShann's band as they were both pianists and had separate bands. Unfortunately compilation CD's tend to blur the distinction when listing band members who may be on different tracks, giving the impression they performed together when they may not have.

Gilbeaux/Witherspoon recorded a concert in Pasadena, California on May 9, 1949 for Gene Norman's Just Jazz concert. There were 5 tracks released on Modern Records from that live concert including Ain't Nobody's Business, Big Fine Girl, No Rollin Blues, Failing By Degrees, New Orleans Woman and I Gotta Gal and others which became hits in 1949.Witherspoon rejoined with Jay McShann again in 1950 then began working with other musicians. The Trenier twins were not involved with this but they did perform at Just Jazz in 1950. It is unknown if any live recording of that performance survived.

The Gene Gilbeaux Orchestra included Don Hill, Herman Washington, Shifty Henry, Jimmy Johnson among others. The Trenier Twins were a separate act in the late 40's but they often performed with Gene Gilbeaux.

Gene Gilbeaux also recorded three records among the first 45 RPM records released by RCA with songs like "Gold Ain't Everything" and "Up the Hill with Jeep" The male vocalist was listed as Choo Choo Train but it turned out to be Claude Trenier. Those records are what caused the Treniers with Gene Gilbeaux to be the first act signed by A & R representative Danny Kessler when Columbia re-started their Rhythm and Blues label Okeh Records and they were the most successful R & B band and proto rock and roll group until other acts became even bigger. At that time the Gene Gilbeaux Orchestra and the Trenier Twins groups combined and the name was shortened to The Treniers. They were sometimes referenced as "The Fabulous Treniers".

By the way the website for Bill Hailey and run by his estate used to state explicity that he and his band were influenced by the Treniers to change from Country and Western style to rhythm and blues and copied the Treniers stage antics. They were close friends from working together at summer clubs at the Jersey shore. More recent updates to the web page have dropped that reference for some reason. Bill Hailey was always the type of guy to go out of his way to thank those who helped him and he made it known the Treniers were an influence.

The Treniers were not at what is generally considered the first rock and roll concert, the Moondog Coronation Ball but they became friends and were supported by Alan Freed. They wrote a song Moondog which was his theme until Mr Freed moved to New York City and was sued by another artist who had registered the Moondog name. Thereafter Freed pushed the term rock and roll which he copyrighted. The same music at that time which was R & B was now called rock and roll.

The Treniers performed on many live television shows and toured worldwide for decades. There is at least one book that states the Treniers performance on The Colgate Comedy Hour with Dean Martin and Jerry Lewis was the first time Rock and Roll was performed on television. They were among the first rock groups to perform overseas. On their first tour of England they were to perform with Jerry Lee Lewis. Unfortunately the press in England learned that his young bride of 13 was also his cousin so Jerry Lee had to cancel his particpation in the tour. The Treniers continued their tour in England with Lonnie Donegan and gave Skiffle boost in the UK until Rock and Roll later displaced it. They gave a command performance for the Queen of England and on their return also performed at the White House for President Eisenhower. The Treniers also toured Europe, Australia and Asia as well as performing regularly in Vegas and Atlantic City.

They made many recordings for Armed Forces radio, many of which survive.

It should also be mentioned that as a live act the Treniers performed with Frank Sinatra, Dean Martin, Sammy Davis Junior, Elvis, Johnnie Ray and Liberace and many others. The Treniers shared the same manager as Liberace (Seymore Heller). The Treniers performed in some Soundies, Scopitone and the equivalent early precursers to music videos

Some facts:

The Treniers were the first major act to drop the stand up bass in favor of the (then) new electric bass developed by Fender. This was the electric guitar style with frets so that bass lines could be consistent. The story is Shifty Henry was given one when was with The Treniers to gain the exposure from their high profile and it was stolen. He was given another by the manufacturer which was also stolen. After that he had to buy one like everyone else.

Gene Gilbeaux also performed with Johnny Otis on one of his first recordings and later with Steve Gibson's Redcaps.

Gene left the Treniers and started a Swing band called the Gene Gilbeaux Swing Orchestra in San Francisco. I am told the band still exists even though Gene passed away in 1992.

Claude Trenier along with his brother Cliff started performing vocals with the Jimmy Lunceford Orchestra in the early 40's. Claude also recorded vocals with Barney Bigard, Jim Wynn and Charles Mingus.

Don Hill performed saxaphone for at least 5 years with Louis Armstrong as well as with Gene Gilbeaux and the Treniers. He later performed with other Rock, Jazz, Gospel and C & W musicians. He wrote and recorded many songs over the years and is a fantastically under rated musician.

Shifty Henry later started his own band and his name was used in Jailhouse Rock performed by Elvis Presley.

Mickey Baker was a session guitar musician who performed really great tracks with Milt Trenier and the Gene Gilbeaux Orchestra on Groove Records.

The Treniers also was one of the first singing groups to choreograph its act, which inspired many of the Motown groups of the 1960s.

The Treniers made several appearances on the Ed Sullivan, Jackie Gleason, Merv Griffin, Mike Douglas, Dinah Shore and Ernie Kovacs television shows.

After a sponsor sent Red Skelton a wire suggesting he should not feature black entertainers on his television show, Skelton mentioned the telegram on air and said: "Here's my answer: the Treniers."

The Treniers as a band were influenced by Louie Jordan and Jimmy Lunceford.

The Treniers influenced Bill Hailey and the Comets, Paul Revere and The Raiders, The Coasters, The Turbans, Freddie Bell and the Bellboys, among others. It is well documented that John Lennon and Paul McCartney were big fans of the movie the Girl Can't Help It, but that doesn't mean they directly influenced the Beatles msuical style or performance. One of the contenders for the first Rock and Roll song. Long before Elvis, Bill Hailey or Jackie Berenson, rock music was being made in the late 1940's. There is no agreement on who made the first song or first hit sing that would qualify as rock, but at least one web page lists the contenders including the Treniers.

The Trenier Twins are the first on record to use the term "Fly Girl" on a song on the late 1940's and now in common usage and defined on the Urban Dictionary.

The song " We Want a Rock and Roll President" from 1956 included the term "Rock the Vote" years before it was used in politcal campaigns from the 1980's until the present.

Their only top ten hit was "Go Go Go" first released in 1951.

The song "Rock a Beatin Boogie" is the first time black artists covered a rock song by a white musician.

They released a song called Poontang which got airplay even though most people didn't get the real meaning behind the title. They also created promotional cans of Poontang which were distributed to fans.

They recorded a song with Willie Mays and produced by Quincy Jones. According to the Baseball Hall of Fame the song is one of many used in their travelling showcase.

Bill Cosby took the name Cliff for his character in his groundbreaking 1980's show from his good friend Cliff Trenier.

In a book about the first Ali-Frazer fight there is a brief story about Ali taking a break from training and going to see his friends the Treniers perform in Florida about midnight. He mixed it up with the crowd and wound up on stage in a mock battle with Cliff and Claude in order to help promote the fight.

The band performed until 2003 with Claude's passing.

Milt Trenier (who left the group in the late 1950's) still performs on occasion in the Chicago area.

There are many videos of the Treniers performances on Youtube.

I have a lot more information and references. Baronvon (talk) 08:53, 21 December 2008 (UTC)

Pronunciation?
Rothorpe (talk) 12:27, 30 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Truh-NEERs, I believe. Someone else needs to turn that into IPA.  Ghmyrtle (talk) 13:04, 30 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Like Chenier, that figures. /trəˈniərz/, then? Rothorpe (talk) 18:08, 30 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Indeed - that's what Dean Martin says - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NshLnFXH-Gw Ghmyrtle (talk) 12:42, 1 December 2014 (UTC)
 * Right, many thanks. Rothorpe (talk) 15:08, 1 December 2014 (UTC)
 * Another thanks, I was headed waaaaay in the wrong direction. Einar aka Carptrash (talk) 15:52, 1 December 2014 (UTC)

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