Talk:Thomas the Tank Engine/Archive 1

Spoiler warning
Does this need a spoiler warning? violet/riga (t) 12:17, 11 October 2004 (UTC)
 * Theoreticaly, yes; as the paragraph beneth does give plot details... but should it even be there? Its a rather unremarkable story. NeilTarrant 12:33, 11 October 2004 (UTC)

The titles of the first five series:
The Names of the first five (UK) series are (sourced from the Classic Collection box set): Series 1 01 - Thomas And Gordon 02 - Edward And Gordon 03 - The Sad Story Of Henry 04 - Edward, Gordon And Henry 05 - Thomas' Train 06 - Thomas And The Trucks 07 - Thomas And The Breakdown Train 08 - James And The Coaches 09 - Troublesome Trucks 10 - James And The Express 11 - Thomas And The Guard 12 - Thomas Goes Fishing 13 - Thomas, Terence And The Snow 14 - Thomas And Bertie 15 - Tenders And Turntables 16 - Trouble In The Shed 17 - Percy Runs Away 18 - Coal 19 - The Flying Kipper 20 - Whistles And Sneezes 21 - Toby And The Stout Gentleman 22 - Thomas In Trouble 23 - Dirty Objects 24 - Off The Rails 25 - Down The Mine 26 - Thomas' Christmas Party Series 2 01 - Thomas, Percy And The Coal 02 - Cows 03 - Bertie's Chase 04 - Saved From Scrap 05 - Old Iron 06 - Thomas And Trevor 07 - Percy And The Signal 08 - Duck Takes Charge 09 - Percy And Harold 10 - The Runaway 11 - Percy Takes The Plunge 12 - Pop Goes The Diesel 13 - Dirty Works 14 - A Close Shave 15 - Better Late Than Never 16 - Breakvan 17 - The Deputation 18 - Thomas Comes To Breakfast 19 - Daisy 20 - Percy's Predicament 21 - The Diseasel 22 - Wrong Road 23 - Edward's Exploit 24 - Ghost Train 25 - Wooly Bear 26 - Thomas And The Missing Christmas Tree Series 3 01 - A Scarf For Percy 02 - Percy's Promise 03 - Time For Trouble 04 - Gordon And The Famous Visitor 05 - Donald's Duck 06 - Thomas Gets Bumped 07 - Thomas, Percy And The Dragon 08 - Diesel Does It Again 09 - Henry's Forest 10 - The Trouble With Mud 11 - No Joke For James 12 - Thomas, Percy And The Post Train 13 - Trust Thomas 14 - Mavis 15 - Toby's Tightrope 16 - Edward, Trevor, And The Really Usefull Party 17 - Buzz, Buzz 18 - All At Sea 19 - One Good Turn 20 - Tender Engines 21 - Escape 22 - Oliver Owns Up 23 - Bulgy 24 - Heroes 25 - Percy, James and The Fruitful Day 26 - Thomas And Percy's Christmas Adventure Series 4 01 - Granpuff 02 - Sleeping Beauty 03 - Bulldog 04 - You Can't Win 05 - Four Little Engines 06 - A Bad Day For Sir Handel 07 - Peter Sam And The Refreshment Lady 08 - Trucks 09 - Rock'n'Roll 10 - Home At Last 11 - Special Funnel 12 - Steamroller 13 - Passengers And Polish 14 - Gallant Old Engine 15 - Rusty To The Rescue 16 - Thomas And Stepney 17 - Bowled Out 18 - Train Stops Play 19 - Henry And The Elephant 20 - Paint Pots And Queens 21 - Thomas And The Special Letter 22 - Bulls Eyes 23 - Toad Stands By 24 - Fish 25 - Special Attraction 26 - Mind That Bike Series 5 01 - Cranky Bugs 02 - Horrid Lorry 03 - A Better View For Gordon 04 - Lady Hatt's Birthday Party 05 - James And The Trouble With Trees 06 - Gordon And The Gremlin 07 - Bye George! 08 - Baa! 09 - Put Upon Percy 10 - Toby And The Flood 11 - Haunted Henry 12 - Double Teething Troubles 13 - Stepney Gets Lost 14 - Toby's Discovery 15 - Something In The Air 16 - Thomas, Percy And Old Slow Coach 17 - Thomas And The Rumours 18 - Oliver's Find 19 - Happy Ever After 20 - Sir Topham Hatt's Holiday 21 - A Suprise For Percy 22 - Make Someone Happy 23 - Busy Going Backwards 24 - Duncan Gets Spooked 25 - Snow 26 - Rusty And The Boulder — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.37.41.15 (talk) 22:36, 12 June 2005 (UTC)

Series 6 01 - No Sleep For Cranky 02 - Salty's Secret 03 - Harvey To The Rescue 04 - A Bad Day For Harold The Helicopter 05 - Elizabeth The Vintage Lorry 06 - The Fogman 07 - Jack Jumps In 08 - A Friend In Need 09 - It's Only Snow 10 - Twin Trouble 11 - The World's Strongest Engine 12 - Scardey Engines 13 - Percy And The Haunted Mine 14 - Middle Engines 15 - James And The Red Balloon 16 - Jack Frost 17 - Gordon Takes A Tumble 18 - Percy's Chocolate Crunch 19 - Buffer Bother 20 - Toby Had A Little Lamb 21 - Thomas, Percy And The Squeak 22 - Thomas The Jet Engine 23 - Edward The Very Useful Engine 24 - Dunkin Duncan 25 - Rusty Saves The Day 26 - Faulty Whistles — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.108.221.117 (talk) 17:02, 15 September 2005 (UTC)

That is an unfair comment
There should not be a spoiler warning, because this is a group of stories aimed at children, mainly under the age of 8 years old. The story may seem "unremarkable" to you, but please take into consideration that the story is probably not intended for people of your age. Besides, they are short groups of stories, and all that is mentioned is a brief outline of what happens in some of the stories! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.93.21.69 (talk) 19:24, 10 September 2005 (UTC)

Edits
It's pointless to go into plot details in any case- there have been so many stories about the character that any list of adventures would either be incomplete or too long to be worth reading. I've edited the article to only discuss those adventures that have had a significant bearing on the character.

More then 3 Links, some not needed?
At the botom of the page, there are a number of links. Wikipedia articles in general should only have three links, and should try to stick to offical sites, or very informative and factual sites that offer more information. Obviously the "Thomas the Tank Engine .com Official website" link needs to be kept, but with no disrecpect, I'm concern that the "Criticism Talking Pictures" sites and "iRail" do not seem offer a informative and factual view of the series itself, and are more concerned about a unrelated topic (though both do cover the series.) The fourth link "http://thomas-the-tank-engine.idlebanter.co.uk/" seems to offer very little information, so I would like to suggest that only the fullying links are used...

The Real Thomas - http://www.semg.org.uk/steam/e2_class.html Offical Website - http://www.hitentertainment.com/thomasandfriends/official_thomas_the_tank_engine_website.htm Thomas Blog - http://thomas-train.blogspot.com/

I am not sure about using a blog, but as it is dedicated to Thomas the Tankengine and stays informative it seems acceptable? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Percz (talk • contribs) 19:44, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

Roving Thomas
I don't know which railroad does it, but one of the U.S. railroads has a Thomas the Tank Engine that tours the country for festivals and other special events. --Tim4christ17 22:57, 11 July 2006 (UTC)


 * I added some information on this subject. Thomas can only appear as part of a licensed Day Out with Thomas event. n2xjk 21:01, 11 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Excellent, thanks for that. Gonzerelli 05:59, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

best known?
This doesn't need a citation, it needs to be removed. It's not verifiable and adds nothing to this article Rtphokie — Preceding undated comment added 11:26, 30 August 2006 (UTC)
 * I think his world-wide recognition does indeed add a lot to the article, so I've changed the wording slightly to reflect this. Gonzerelli 13:14, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

Missing Origins?
In the section 'Thomas in the Railway Series' it talks about Thomas being rebuilt. The paragraph ended with the cryptic line:
 * For the reasons behind this, see 'Origins of Thomas'.

This wasn't a link to another page, and there's nothing in the current page that this corresponds to so I've cut it. If someone knows what it should be referring to they can put it back. --Xurble 15:37, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

"Fictional Hero"??
An unregistered user has been continually adding the Category:Fictional heroes to the bottom of this article.

You could hardly call Thomas a "hero", no more than you could call Gordon a "hero". A protagonist, possibly, still not quite appropriate but more accurate.

This category has been removed, and will continue to be removed if added incessantly. Gonzerelli 01:59, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

original
i have a question,I am wondering which of the Thomas the tank engine series are the original ones ( the ones in the 80's narrated by Ringo Starr). i can not find this/


 * Firstly, this information is available on the page for the TV Series itself (Thomas the Tank Engine and Friends).
 * The first two seasons of the Series were narrated by Ringo Starr. These two seasons have their own articles:- Season 1, Season 2.
 * Gonzerelli 06:06, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

Christian Animation?
Does anybody actually know why this is classed as "Christian Animation"? Apart from the occasional vague moral (which can be found virtually any children's program, such as "don't tell lies", etc.) and the fact the character was created by a clergyman, I can find little evidence to suggest it is specifically a Christian series.

Because it was originally written by a rather crusty old vicar, perhaps? 219.117.176.253 02:19, 23 June 2007 (UTC)

Well several times Christmas has been metioned and celebrated. Father Christmas/Santa Claus has even made an appearence. Diesel 10 10:43, 9 September 2007 (UTC)

Christmas (and Santa Clause) are in childrens series all the time, I don't see any reason why that would make this show christian —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.134.133.207 (talk) 20:28, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

In the later animations, the term 'Christmas' seems to have been replaced by 'Winter Festival'.....Longfinal (talk) 17:26, 27 April 2021 (UTC)

Season 2
In Double Trouble, why is Thomas wearing a face that looks like a female face? TobytheTramEngine 19:06, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Well, they got different facemasks for S2. That's probably why--S.C.Ruffeyfan (talk) 16:23, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

Starlight Express
Andrew Lloyd Webber has stated the original intent of his Show Starlight Express was to pay tribute to Thomas, which is why I added this info.Thenextstephensondheim1 23:55, 19 July 2007 (UTC)


 * OK, but we need a Reliable Source to back this up. The information was already on the Starlight Express page and has hence been mirrored all over the web. Unless this can be proved, it needs to be removed from both pages.
 * EdJogg 08:17, 20 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Reference was removed today (by an anon), as unsourced. Try as I might, I cannot find a reputable source for the rumour. Lloyd-Webber's own pages do not mention any link, nor do the those describing the show at The Really Useful Company -- and Richard Stilgoe appears not to have a website. Nevertheless, it is possible to find several web sources to back up the rumour (eg theatre reviews) but nothing concrete. Has Lloyd-Webber written an autobiography?
 * EdJogg 01:35, 6 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Found a citeable reference!! But where did they get the info from? "The Cambridge Guide to Literature in English" By Ian Ousby (page 47) Cambridge University Press (1994 - ISBN 0521440866) Entry for Rev W. V. Awdry, final para: "Starlight Express (1984), a stage musical by Andrew Lloyd Webber and Richard Stilgoe loosely based on Awdry's train characters, has since proved extremely successful.")
 * EdJogg 02:34, 6 November 2007 (UTC)


 * How stupid!! It was under my nose all the time - have a look at pages 288 to 291 of The Thomas the Tank Engine Man, and it's all there. Time to put the web to rights!! Ref to follow in due course. EdJogg 02:56, 6 November 2007 (UTC)


 * I added a section to the page, with a quote from the Composer, proving the 'Starlight' theory to be true. Why was it deleted? ElphaPearl (talk) 13:49, 16 February 2008 (UTC)


 * It was deleted because it was untrue. Starlight Express was not based on the Thomas the Tank Engine books. As the Starlight Express article clearly explains, Weber wanted to create a Thomas-based musical, but couldn't secure the rights from Awdry. Instead he wrote a musical about trains. It cannot be claimed that the version of Starlight Express that was written is based on Thomas - it clearly isn't. The Starlight Express article already covers this, there is no need to add it to this article since the connection is so minor. Gwernol 13:53, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

Strange Factor
I saw two copies that talk about Thomas. Can I remove the one on the bottom? TobytheTramEngine 04:32, 26 September 2007 (UTC)


 * Already done it! Be BOLD! (You don't need to ask about this sort of thing, as it is obviously an accident.) However, I strongly recommend using the 'diff' facility on the page history to compare across multiple versions -- that way you can double-check that anti-vandal work (for example) has not changed the article unexpectedly. EdJogg 08:53, 26 September 2007 (UTC)


 * Oh, sorry. Well, I only asked because I was afraid if I reverted that edit, someone would revert it. TobytheTramEngine (talk) 04:33, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

Sugar Coated?
Loads of the people I know are calling Thomas and Friends sugar coated. How do you call a Crane falling down causing engines to be trapped sugar coated? S.C.Ruffeyfan 15:00, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Thomas the Tank Sodor Island Map
Hi can anyone help me I have A very old SODOR ISLAND MAP I think it 1960s am thinking of listing it on ebay would like it to go to a good home,i saw one a while back go for over £100 but mine is not quite so good,any info would be nice thanks TRI-ANG-TT 21:35, 16 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Ignoring the fact that this is not the purpose of Wikipedia (many editors would simply have deleted your edit as irrelevant to WP)...
 * Your map should easily sell on eBay, especially if it is an early example. I suggest you watch the other maps for sale for a while to get an idea of how the condition of yours compares and what an appropriate starting price might be.
 * EdJogg 08:12, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

How about some protection?
Looking at the history of this article, it seems to be a pretty regular target for vandalism from haters and fans alike. Does anyone else think it might be time to request some sort of protection?HonestTom (talk) 15:51, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
 * You're welcome to try! Needs to be some form of long-term semi-protection, but I'm not sure whether they will go for that. Mostly semi-protection is used to prevent attacks over a short period of time. EdJogg (talk) 11:24, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

Real Engines
Having a Thomas obsessed small son we recently visited the Nene Valley Railway (NVR) who have a "Thomas" engine. I was surprised to find there is no reference to them in this article.

The NVR website (http://www.nvr.org.uk/) states that their Thomas is a Hudswell Clarke engine 0-6-0T No. 1800 which was built in 1947 and spent all its working life at the British Sugar Corporation's Peterborough factory. They show a photograph of the Rev W Awdry in 1971 naming No. 1800 "Thomas".

--Thealmondtree (talk) 07:53, 27 August 2008 (UTC)


 * There is a reference at Day out with Thomas, although it is arguable whether the text should be moved here instead or not. I think there used to be a picture of it here that was removed for reasons of copyright.


 * A number of engines have been dressed-up as Thomas (or as other characters). Although we could have a list of them here, unless the lists can be referenced from published sources there is no proof to indicate that the list is complete (and there is the risk that the list could grow too large).


 * Thank you for your observation, nonetheless.
 * EdJogg (talk) 23:42, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

Vandalism?
At the moment, it says: "Thomas the Tank Engine first appeared in 1294", which is presume isn't true, although I don't know the correct date; indeed that whole sentence seems somewhat garbled. Maybe this was some kind of vandalism? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.67.110.34 (talk) 22:07, 25 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Since fixed. Sadly Wikipedia attracts many people who seem to have nothing better to do than disrupt what we're trying to achieve. This article is one of several that attracts higher-than-average attention from them...
 * The only solution is to carefully watch EVERY edit to the page, and revert as necessary. A quick examination of the 'history' tab will allow you to check for recent edits and obvious vandalism.
 * EdJogg (talk) 12:24, 27 May 2009 (UTC)

Listen with Mother
The main article gives credit to Britt Allcroft for creating a TV verison, but no mention is made of the reading of the stories on 'listen with mother' (BBC home service) in the 1950s. My mother often spoke of my childhood fascination with these tales (the banking engine's refrain of 'I know I can, I know I can' being read out to emphasise the sound of an exhaust note) --Brunnian (talk) 22:37, 29 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Before my time :o)
 * We can certainly add this in if we have any references to back it up. -- EdJogg (talk) 12:38, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

Anthropomorphic, or Personified?
The only thing anthropomorphic, or of 'human form', would be the bas relief mug plastered on the front of the engines. Anthropomorphic doesn't seem to fit quite right. Personified isn't quite on the mark either. The engines sport visages. That said, can we get rid of the term anthropomorphic in the many Thomas articles and come up with something better? Technically, 'anthro' might be grudgingly correct—but not by much. 98.235.159.157 (talk) 04:07, 9 January 2010 (UTC)WikiPaull


 * This terminology has been discussed before -- the characters were described as 'sub-anthropomorphic', until it was realised that this was a term seemingly made-up for the benefit of WP articles! If there is a better word, then we can consider using it, but for now I suggest we leave 'as is'. -- EdJogg (talk) 12:36, 12 February 2010 (UTC)


 * I thought anthropomorphism meant having human form, thoughts or emotions and can be seen as representing facets of human personality and character traits. I would argue that TRS does this, not just by simply putting a human face on the front of an engine, and that the term does apply.&mdash;User:MDCollins (talk) 11:14, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

Slate article on imperialism
I found: It talks about imperialistic views in the Railway series WhisperToMe (talk) 04:17, 28 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Roake, Jessica. "Thomas the Imperialist Tank Engine." Slate. Tuesday July 26, 2011.

"Really useful engine" - first appearance
When did the phrase "Really useful engine" first appear? This may be the source. Dick Dilworth, designer of the EMD GP7 locomotive, which established the boxy pattern of almost all modern freight locomotives: "In planning the GP, I had two dreams. The first was to make a locomotive so ugly in appearance that no railroad would want it on the main line or anywhere near headquarters, but would keep it out as far as possible in the back country, where it could do really useful work. My second dream was to make it so simple in construction and so devoid of Christmas-tree ornaments and other whimsy that the price would be materially below our standard main-line freight locomotives." That quote is from a 1954 book, and that series of locomotives started in 1949. --John Nagle (talk) 19:06, 23 December 2012 (UTC)

"Thomas the Train"
Looking e.g. at amazon.com, there are lots of products named after something called "Thomas the Train", which seems to be just the same as Thomas the Tank Engine. Is "Thomas the Train" a valid name in the US? In Wikipedia, "Thomas the Train" redirects to the article "Thomas & Friends", not this article. Why? 109.152.147.255 (talk) 02:31, 30 March 2015 (UTC)

Can`t find the date of the change to CGI ?
I couldn`t find the date of the change (from models) to CGI) in the TV series. If it`s in the article it should be more prominent, arguably it`s the most significant change to Thomas the Tank Engine since it was first written. There is an exhaustive list of all the narrators yet this more significant change is either omitted or buried !--JustinSmith (talk) 15:38, 31 August 2015 (UTC)
 * The change to CGI happened in 2008. --ACase0000 (talk) 03:08, 14 December 2015 (UTC)

It was in 2009 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.14.45.36 (talk) 00:38, 3 June 2020 (UTC)

About the revert
It is not logical for one to purchase the rights and wait that long to make it a TV show.

This is about this revert: (I couldn't use Twinkle that well at that occasion ) https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Thomas_the_Tank_Engine&type=revision&diff=843526709&oldid=843524138 -- 1233 Talk 18:33, 29 May 2018 (UTC)

"Prototype and background"
I am quite confused by this section. When is says "Thomas is one of half a dozen locomotives fitted with an extension to the front of the water tanks" and "Thomas is seen today on various heritage railways..." it sounds (to me) that it's talking about the fictional character as if it exists in the "real world." If the Thomas in these passages is the "Billinton designed 0-6-0 E2 Class" engine mentioned elsewhere it should be made clear that the inspiration is being referred to as "Thomas." PurpleChez (talk) 20:45, 13 September 2018 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion: You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 15:22, 15 May 2020 (UTC)
 * ThomasCGI.png

TRAINS-FORMERS Needed In Pop Culture
Pop Culture Has A Parody Part, Why Not TRAINS-FORMERS? It’s Like A Thomas Version Of Transfromers Has power rangers act. SteaminThomasTheTrain32 (talk) 15:57, 25 December 2019 (UTC)

Because it is an unofficial project by someone who doesn't know what he was doing. It wasn't made by any official corporations. So it is going to be excluded — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.14.45.36 (talk) 00:00, 3 June 2020 (UTC)

Annie and Clarabel
Hi. I see that his two carriages appear to not get a mention. Seems rather a shame as he was obviously very closely connected (!) to both of them.....Longfinal (talk) 17:29, 27 April 2021 (UTC)
 * The problem is that there is no independent secondary source for that (see WP:V and WP:SECONDARY). If there is one such source about that, point it out and we'll see what can be added. Cheers, RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 18:53, 27 April 2021 (UTC)

Hi. How about reading any Thomas the Tank engine book about Thomas himself. 'Thomas and the Guard' is a classic example - unless your comment is tongue-in-cheek. Longfinal (talk) 15:13, 11 May 2021 (UTC)
 * @Longfinal those are primary sources, which is the point that RandomCanadian was making. Wikipedia it written from secondary sources - for example a book about the TtTE books which notes the importance of Annie and Clarabel would be a good source. The Railway Series books are not. Laplorfill (talk) 15:29, 11 May 2021 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 10 September 2021
Husky75621 (talk) 19:42, 10 September 2021 (UTC) I want to edit the Thomas the Tank Engine page!
 * Full-protection-shackle-no-text.svg Not done: requests for decreases to the page protection level should be directed to the protecting admin or to Requests for page protection if the protecting admin is not active or has declined the request. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 19:55, 10 September 2021 (UTC)

Changing main image to a Railway Series one
The Railway Series is the original, so should the main image for the article be a Railway Series one? You can put the current image under the TV Series section. Thomasfan1000 (talk) 22:27, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

The article's language needs help
One of the sections begins with s nonsensical sentence fragment, and the article contradicts itself on the subject of whether or not the locomotives were based on real prototypes. This lack of clarity and conciseness is hard on those who struggle to read. Also, there are those totally unfamiliar with Thomas, making this a problematic introduction to him for them. Could some charitable soul spare 5 minutes to fix these, please? He deserves to be known by as many as possible. 73.12.177.207 (talk) 21:07, 26 May 2023 (UTC)
 * I've tweaked the bit about prototypes, hopefully it is clearer now. Which section begins with "a nonsensical sentence fragment"? I'm happy to address that too. I think the lead paragraphs are an okay intro to the subject; what would an improvement look like? Best, Grachester (talk) 21:28, 26 May 2023 (UTC)