Talk:Toba Tek Singh District

Requested move
Shouldn't we move this article to Toba Tek Singh District and have the city Toba Tek Singh's article in its place? Yasirniazkhan 12:46, 1 February 2007 (UTC)


 * I agree with the above comments - this article should be moved to Toba Tek Singh District - whilst the Toba Tek Singh, Pakistan article should be moved here (i.e. to Toba Tek Singh).


 * Pahari Sahib  23:04, 10 December 2007 (GMT)

There seem to be at least three meanings of Toba Tek Singh:


 * The district, corresponding to the article currently at Toba Tek Singh and to Category:Toba Tek Singh District.
 * The city, corresponding to the article currently at Toba Tek Singh, Pakistan.
 * Toba Tek Singh tehsil, one of the three subdivisions of the district, currently without an article.

I suggest that Toba Tek Singh unqualified should probably be a disambiguation page, with the two existing articles renamed to Toba Tek Singh District or similar (but consistent to the category, which might also need renaming) and Toba Tek Singh (city). Toba Tek Singh, Pakistan should redirect to the disambiguation page. Andrewa (talk) 00:24, 19 December 2007 (UTC)


 * I don't think there should be a Toba Tek Singh DAB, because this would make Toba Tek Singh articles an anomaly compared to other Pakistani districts - all of which have city and district articles, for example Abbottabad and Abbottabad District (most districts seem to be missing the article for the tehsil, at the moment) - the convention is an article named 'x' for the city, 'x District' for the district and 'x Tehsil' for the tehsil. It should be clear from the lead section of the article that the article pertains to city x, headquarters of district x or tehsil x (although it has to be said some articles maybe less than clear in saying this).


 * Pahari Sahib  02:59, 19 December 2007 (GMT)


 * Hmmmm... so you're agreeing that there are three meanings, and saying that this is typical of Pakistani districts, is that right so far? Andrewa (talk) 08:06, 19 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Yes, but are you implying that this would necessitate a DAB page for all Pakistani districts then :-), or for that matter Afghan provinces for example there are two meanings of Herat: Herat (city) and Herat Province, or for Indian states, for example Amritsar and Amritsar district?


 * Pahari Sahib  13:47, 19 December 2007 (GMT)


 * In general, disambiguation pages are not required when there are only two meanings, instead we use hatnotes. But if all Pakistani districts contain both a town and a subdistrict of the same name, and if all of these districts, subdistricts and towns are sufficiently notable to each have an article, then yes, each of these names should have a disambiguation page. If some but not all of them meet these criteria (as I was guessing but could well be wrong) then I'm afraid it needs to be done case by case. Andrewa (talk) 09:03, 20 December 2007 (UTC)


 * With respect to hatnotes, I thought that it was generally added to to the article that most people would be looking for, e.g. the Robin Hood article - where the hatnote then points to the DAB page. Actually having thought about it Toba Tek Singh can refer to five different things, City, tehsil, district, historical figure and a short story. So I'm not sure if Toba Tek Singh unqualified should not be a DAB or whether it should be about the city with a hotnote for other uses, but I do think the current Toba Tek Singh article needs to moved to "Toba Tek Singh District".


 * Pahari Sahib  05:00, 22 December 2007 (GMT)


 * It sounds as though it definitely should have a disambiguation page, but where this should be, and what the unqualified name should be used for, I'm not yet sure. Tell me more about the historical personage, and the short story. Andrewa (talk) 13:24, 23 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Well I don't really know much about the historical figure other than he was actually called "Tek Singh", the city, and subsequently district and tehsil, were named after him. As for the short story - it is a satire on the relationship between India and Pakistan following partition see Toba Tek Singh (short story).


 * Pahari Sahib  18:51, 23 December 2007 (GMT)


 * That's quite enough for a start! Now, we need to make it as easy as possible for someone looking for the article on the short story to find it. I don't think this is controversial, so I'm going to be bold and create Toba Tek Singh (disambiguation). Andrewa (talk) 19:47, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

resetting offset to zero

OK, that's done. It's not ideal but it's a start. What needs tidying up IMO:


 * Deciding which article if any belongs at the unqualified name Toba Tek Singh. That's one thing this Requested move is about. And of course if the article currently there is moved, there's some tidying up to do afterwards.
 * I'm assuming that anyone significant enough to have a city named after them deserves an article, so we need an article at Tek Singh.
 * Assuming there is no Toba Tek Singh outside Pakistan, then Toba Tek Singh, Pakistan should either redirect to Toba Tek Singh or (to avoid double redirects) directly to the same article as that redirects to. Again, this should be discussed as part of this move proposal.
 * Deciding whether to split Toba Tek Singh tehsil as a separate article to Toba Tek Singh (city). We may as well discuss this here too; It doesn't need administrator action and hopefully won't be controversial.

There are consequences of these decisions regarding several other article names, and there are probably other things I haven't thought of. Andrewa (talk) 20:36, 23 December 2007 (UTC)


 * There is no "Toba Tek Singh" outside of Pakistan.


 * Pahari Sahib  09:17, 24 December 2007 (GMT)


 * Hmmmm, yes, and I have second thoughts about the redirect... after the article currently at Toba Tek Singh, Pakistan is moved, the resulting redirect should be deleted. Andrewa (talk) 14:05, 24 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Yes I agree, there seems no point have a redirect there once the article has been moved.


 * Pahari Sahib  17:51, 24 December 2007 (GMT)

Tek Singh
From discussion above I don't really know much about the historical figure other than he was actually called "Tek Singh"..

Tek Singh seems to be a very common name. Perhaps I misunderstood you... what is the historical figure normally called? Andrewa (talk) 21:24, 23 December 2007 (UTC)


 * I have been a little unclear, the historical figure was just called "Tek Singh". "Toba Tek Singh" or "lake of Tek Singh" was originally a lake named after him. Toba Tek Singh also came to refer to the area around the lake - a settlement in this area (which later became the city) was named Toba Tek Singh, subsequently the tehsil and district were formed all bearing the name.


 * Pahari Sahib  09:12, 24 December 2007 (GMT)

Hi. I'm here to close this move request, and I first want to be sure I'm clear on what needs to happen. It appears that there was a person called Tek Singh, and that there is a lake, a district, a tehsil, a city and a short story all called Toba Tek Singh (which means "lake of Tek Singh"). Assuming that's all correct, the decision we have to make is whether one of the five(?) possible meanings for "Toba Tek Singh" is clearly the primary usage. If so (option A), then that article should be at Toba Tek Singh, and there would be a hatnote there pointing to Toba Tek Singh (disambiguation), which would link to the others. On the other hand, if there is no clear primary topic (option B), then Toba Tek Singh should be the disambiguation page, with links to Toba Tek Singh (lake), Toba Tek Singh (district), Toba Tek Singh (tehsil) (which might redirect to the district page until it has its own article), Toba Tek Singh (city) and Toba Tek Singh (short story). So, do we wish to go with option A or B, or some other option that I've missed? -GTBacchus(talk) 20:20, 27 December 2007 (UTC)


 * I think we should go with Option A, a couple of points though: the primary usage of Toba Tek Singh is currently at Toba Tek Singh, Pakistan, and articles on Pakistani districts all (pretty much) have this format "DistrictName District" e.g. Bannu District or Charsadda District - which is why I requested the move to Toba Tek Singh District. Oh by the way - I think you can forget about adding the lake to the DAB, etymologically the city etc may derive their names from it, but it no longer exists and is not notable enough, in my opinion anyway :-)


 * Pahari Sahib  22:33, 27 December 2007 (GMT)


 * Ok, I've moved pages, fixed a few links, adjusted some redirects and hatnotes, and updated the disambiguation page. I don't think I missed anything, but if I did, please let me know, particularly if it's something you need administrative assistance to fix. There was already a non-trivial history at Toba Tek Singh District, so I moved that history to Toba Tek Singh (District) (which redirects here) in case anybody needs to see those contributions for any reason. Cheers. -GTBacchus(talk) 22:59, 27 December 2007 (UTC)


 * It all looks fine now :-)


 * Thanks
 * Pahari Sahib  00:55, 28 December 2007 (GMT)

Education
The education section looks good, but what's the source? Pahari Sahib  01:37, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

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 * Added tag to http://www.nrb.gov.pk/lg_election/union.asp?district=33&dn=Toba%20Tek%20Singh
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