Talk:Trams in Zurich

Tram route 1
Hasn't the Tram route 1 been replaced by the trollybus route 31?

''Tram route 1, converted to bus in 1954 and trolleybus in 1956. This together with Farbhof - Schlieren is the only tram line to have been replaced by a trolleybus. The sections of track that were rendered redundant and dismantled as a result are: Kreuzplatz - Kunsthaus and Kaserne - Bäckeranlage (modern names).''

Would appreciate any help on adding to the article. And isn't there or wasn't there discussion of replacing the route 31 with a new tram route? --TGC55 (talk) 15:58, 18 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Yes there is, but won't be built before 2025. Longer busses should do till then. --RalpH himself (talk) 20:03, 27 March 2011 (UTC)

S 17 (BDWM)
S17 is nowhere near the city. I suggest kicking it out of this article. --RalpH himself (talk) 20:03, 27 March 2011 (UTC)


 * A bit late, but now done. -- chris_j_wood (talk) 13:20, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Requested move

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was: page moved. Vegaswikian (talk) 00:17, 12 October 2011 (UTC)

Zürich trams → Zurich trams –The city is Zürich in German, Zurich in English. The article is about a generic subject (trams in the city of Zurich) so should be named in English. chris_j_wood (talk) 16:44, 4 October 2011 (UTC)


 * Oppose, imho "Zürich trams" should be trated as a "trademark", Roland 18:29, 4 October 2011 (UTC) btw: please re-link after and not before the community has voted :-(
 * Comment: Puzzled by this. I know 'tram' is used in Swiss German (as opposed to 'Straßenbahn' in Germany), but is the plural really 'trams' in Swiss German?. Or are you saying this is some kind of mixed language trade mark; if so I think some cites are needed. -- chris_j_wood (talk) 08:53, 5 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Comment: As for re-linking, I had no idea this was contentious or would go anywhere near a vote. The only reason I didn't do an immediate move is that the technology wouldn't let me. -- chris_j_wood (talk) 09:01, 5 October 2011 (UTC)
 * For future reference, Chris, you can list uncontroversial requests like this at Requested moves and they will be done in a few hours rather than having a week-lon discussion/vote. Jenks24 (talk) 01:11, 8 October 2011 (UTC)


 * Support for consistency with parent article, Zurich. Jenks24 (talk) 20:49, 4 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Support. As per WP:ENGLISH. --DAJF (talk) 23:07, 4 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Support. If the city is "Zurich", we can't have the trams over in "Zürich". Kauffner (talk) 20:28, 5 October 2011 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Out of date map.
Unfortunately the map at File:Tramnetz-zuerich2.png is out of date in two areas:


 * Apart from its number at the Flughafen terminus, it doesn't show route 12 at all. The stretch of route between Auzelg and Stettbach that is covered only by the 12 doesn't appear.


 * It shows route 4 serving both Altstetten and Werhölzli. In fact Werhölzli is now served by a new route 17 from Hbf.

This map is very useful for the various articles on Zurich trams, and I'd love to fix it myself, but I have neither the skills nor the tools. If anybody else can, that would be great. In the meantime I've removed the map from this article, but will put it back if and when it gets updated. -- chris_j_wood (talk) 13:16, 10 May 2012 (UTC)


 * Commons user Lord Alpha has updated the map, so I've put it back on the article, replacing the schematic that has stood in the meantime. Many thanks to all involved. -- chris_j_wood (talk) 16:45, 18 March 2013 (UTC)

Requested move to Trams in Zurich

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was: moved per request. Favonian (talk) 17:41, 16 July 2012 (UTC)

Zurich trams → Trams in Zurich – In line with most/many other articles on the tram systems of various cities. For example Trams in Basel, Trams in Bern, Trams in Milan, Trams in Sydney. -- chris_j_wood (talk) 12:02, 9 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Support- As you noted, many other tram/city articles use the Trams of... protocol rather than (Blank) trams format. Oakley77 (talk) 02:53, 11 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Support per nom. mge o  talk 13:08, 11 July 2012 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Image queue.
There is a huge image stacking problem on this page (at 768*1366 the images start pushing against the portal box, higher res and it would be much worse.) To combat this I've altered the image formatting and started an image queue in a gallery here, when more text is added to the page images should be reintroduced.

GALLERY REMOVED (SEE BELOW)

Regards, Liamdavies (talk) 17:21, 5 July 2013 (UTC)


 * Actually, your changes violated the MOS:Image that you quoted to justify them, because they ended up sandwiching text between two images that face each other (the ticket machine v. the cargo tram). I also thought they did nothing for the article, removing a lot of images that were carefully selected to illustrate aspects of the text, and (whilst I appreciate this is a matter of taste) making it look ugly.


 * I can only take your word for the image stacking problem you talk about, as I don't see this in my environment (a chrome browser running on a screen at 1024*768). But surely that is always going to happen at over the top screen resolutions. We should not be dumbing down our content just to cater for that.


 * Anyway I've reverted your principle changes for the above reasons. I do know that you made some good changes too; I will go back and review those and re-add them. If you don't like what I've done, please discuss here. -- chris_j_wood (talk) 10:40, 15 July 2013 (UTC)


 * I've now reapplied some of your changes, most specifically the tabulated images for rolling stock (which I liked), and made some other changes that will hopefully reduce the possibility of image stacking with high resolutions. I've also made sure that all images are in the relevant level 2 section. -- chris_j_wood (talk) 12:42, 15 July 2013 (UTC)

I've updated the image gallery below, now only one image isn't in the article.

Liamdavies (talk) 17:30, 15 July 2013 (UTC)

Requested move 02 September 2013

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was: moved per request. Favonian (talk) 17:47, 10 September 2013 (UTC)

Trams in Zurich → Trams in Zürich – In line with decision at Talk:Zürich. chris_j_wood (talk) 09:33, 2 September 2013 (UTC)

Survey

 * Feel free to state your position on the renaming proposal by beginning a new line in this section with  or  , then sign your comment with  . Since polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account Wikipedia's policy on article titles.


 * Support as proposer. A consensus and decision has been documented at Talk:Zürich that the appropriate name for the city in WP:EN is Zürich rather than Zurich. For reasons of consistency, this page should be renamed in line with its parent. -- chris_j_wood (talk) 09:36, 2 September 2013 (UTC)
 * support. The present proposal is also consistent with the longstanding name of the Zürich Hauptbahnhof article, which is about the focal point of the public transport network in Zürich. Bahnfrend (talk) 09:45, 2 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Support, for consistency with the titling of our article on Zürich. ╠╣uw [ talk ]  10:34, 2 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Support, I only commented on the original RM because although the trend is to regarding "Zurich" as a typological limitation rather than a real English exonym, I didn't think the scale had tipped yet. The Google Book results were behind "Cadiz" and "Aragon" which are still in some kind of napoleonic.wikipedia.org time bubble here while The Guardian spells Cádiz and Aragón. But OCR errors seem to have obscured some Zürich umlauts. And for some reason tram-related sources seem to be umlaut-friendly, Neil Forsyth, ‎Judith Forsyth Cycle Touring in Switzerland 2012 Page 23 "In bigger cities, like Basel or Zürich, trams are a special hazard for those unused to them. They are quiet, use lines almost designed to unseat the unwary rider and have priority over most other road users." In ictu oculi (talk) 11:01, 2 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Support per nom. -- Necrothesp (talk) 11:01, 2 September 2013 (UTC)


 * Oppose Zurich should be Zurich in both articles. ChubbyWimbus (talk) 13:43, 4 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Oppose - as per WP:COMMONNAME, WP:USEENGLISH, etc. Red Slash 01:49, 10 September 2013 (UTC)

Discussion

 * Any additional comments:
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Zurich Tram Depots
In order to be consistant with other English language tram article entries on Wikipedia (e.g. Vienna & Prague) and to match (at least) the German versions of this article, I think the presence (and probably location) of the Zurich tram depots should be recorded within the article. I've been doing a bit of research, and I've found 5 depots, the main works and 2 old depots now used for museum purposes. Should this info be added to the article???

Taff Hewitt (talk) 17:21, 15 September 2013 (UTC)


 * Yes, especially if you can support it with reliable sources, such as Schwandl's tram atlas. You might want to put up a draft of the additional material here, so that we can have a look at it first. Bahnfrend (talk) 01:04, 16 September 2013 (UTC)

OK, I'll give it a go. The trouble is that I don't know the actual NAMES of the depots, so I'm approximating. Here goes...

1) HARD - in the north of Zurich, between Hardturmstrassem and the River (Limmat), immediately west of the Hardbrucke. There is a possibility that the depot is in 2 halves - the east side looks unused, whereas the west side is fairly active. Tram route 17 passes the depot. I think the nearest tramstop is ESCHER WYSS PLATZ, just east of the Hardbrucke, and served by routes 4, 13 & 17.

2) IRCHEL - north of the city centre, the depot is on the south-west corner of Irchelstrasse and Scheuchzerstrasse, with entrances on both streets. Tram routes 6, 9 & 10 traverse both streets, with a stop titled UNIVERSITAT IRCHEL positioned on Irchelsreasse, almost at the depot entrance.

3) WOLLISHOFEN - In the south of the city, the depot is immediately south of the turning circle at the terminus of route 7.

4) KALKBREIT - Just west of the city centre, the depot is bounded by Kalkbreitestrasse, Elisabethenstrasse and Zweierstrasse. A railway station is on the 4th side. There are no tram or bus routes that pass the depot, but the Kalkbreite tramstop on routes 2 & 3 is at the end of Kalkbreitestrasse.

5) OERLIKON - The depot is in the district of Oerlikon, well north of Zurich. It is bounded by Wallisellenstrasse, Dorflistrasse and Tramstrasse. The nearest tramstop is STERNEN OERLIKON, on routes 10, 11, 12, 13, 14 & 15, which is located on OHMSTRASSE, at the west end of Wallisellentrasse

The tram workshops are in the northwest of the city, the entrance being on the south side of Badenerstrasse. On tram route 2, the nearest tram stop is GRIMSELSTRASSE

The tram museum at Burgweis is an old, closed depot. Located in the south east of the city, it is on the south side of FORCHSTRASSE, on tram route 11. The BURGWEIS tramstop is outside the museum entrance. There is a support storage facility at another closed depot on the north side of LIMMATTALSTRASSE, in the northwest of the city. The nearest tramstop is WARTAU on route 13.

My information has come from Google Maps, Google Streetview and the current Zurich Tram Map issued by the tram company on their web-site. Note that as I'm ignorant of the German language, I've omitted punctuation marks from a few words (umlauts and the like) - sorry about that!

Taff Hewitt (talk) 15:35, 19 September 2013 (UTC)