Talk:Transport in Slovenia

POV
The section about Ports in Slovenia doesn't seem to be neutral. Trieste and all of Istrian coast have been inhabited by people of Italian nationality for a very long time (Republic of Venice dates back to X century). It seems to me that the author of this section reflects the old clichés without considering the difference between coastland inhabited by Italians and inland inhabited by Slavs. What Slavs suffered under Italian fascist rule and what Italians suffered under titoist ethnic cleansing should be considered before being so tranchant...


 * It is not stated anywhere that the city was not inhabited by an Italian majority, it only states that there was a third of slovenes there and that the aspirations of slovenia where to integrate the city in yugoslavia making it Slovenia's main port. i was merely trying to establish the circumstances under which the port in Koper was built. Certainly you can't negate that about a third of the population was slovene or that the surrounding villages where slovenophone as i am aware that the western coast os Istria was predominantly Italian and in many places it still has a strong Italian character. But if you think that it could be bettered i am certainly open to suggestions and cooperation and we can adjust it so that it would not be ofensive for anyone (if you think it is really offensive or factually wrong) Rokpok (talk) 08:55, 29 October 2008 (UTC)

I didn't mean to start another nationalistic discussion about the status of Italian / Slovenian border. I apologize if I didn't make myself clear. I don't want to deny that villages around Trieste are inhabited by a majority of Slovene nationality people: they are. It's a fact that everybody can verify just taking a walk in the outskirts of the town (and what I wrote here above, by the way). It just seemed to me that the part about the aspirations of Slovenia about Trieste could be erased in order to improve this article: in my opinion, without it the section of this article would be more fact-oriented and less prone to fall in the old Italian / Slovenian quarrels about who did what to whom (with all respect due to people of both nationalities who suffered in past times); you can have an example of how this still is a sensitive topic just visiting the discussion about the wiki article on ethnic cleansing: people quarrelling and insulting each other... I'd start the section just stating that Koper is the main port of Slovenia, etc.etc., leaving the post-war settlements between Italy and Yugoslavia in the history section of the article about Slovenia. It's just my opinion, but I felt compelled to express it. Thank you for your willingness to discuss about it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.25.62.90 (talk) 18:51, 28 November 2008 (UTC)


 * I think it is important to show why the port was constructed and that is not sensibly done if a summary of the turbulent history of trieste is not mentioned. The port in Koper was built exclusivly because Trieste, that was the main port of the Slovene lands untill then, fell to Italy (ofcourse during the interbellum slovenia had no access to sea). The article about ports in Slovenia should include history and causation of it aswell.

So that is why the part about the Slovenes in Trieste is important to show the readers not willing to walk around villages to check the situation on the ground the 'ratio' of Slovene aspirations to include the port in their (at the time Yugoslave) territory and subsequently their need to build a new port.

I hope that you do not object the figures of the austrian census that showed that a third of Trieste was Slovene.

I also hope that a nationalist discusion about something as boring as transport will not erupt. Rokpok (talk) 14:36, 3 December 2008 (UTC)

If you think that the section establishes guilt over who did what to whom you are welcome to reform. I think that only widely accepted facts as there as no mention of any wrongs done by anybody(such as fascism, foibas...)is included merely the course of history that has resulted in the existance of a new port. There is not much else of interest regarding the port of Koper but for it's relationship with Trieste. Rokpok (talk) 23:15, 3 December 2008 (UTC)

Ok, my suggestion to take a walk around Trieste was just to stress the fact that villages there around are inhabited by people of Slovenian nationality: of course, not all readers can or are willing to walk there (even if it's a beautiful place with nice people and many things to see). I have nothing to say about the Absburgical census and I hope that nowdays there are even more people of different nationalities living in Trieste than those recorded there, since I think that this fact enriches a country. I do not want to reform your article since it's your work and I respect people willing to cooperate in Wikipedia in order to improve global knowledge and mutual understanding. I just think that the part about Slovene aspirations about Trieste could be more appropriately inserted in the historical section of the articles about Slovenia, about Koper, about post-war settlements between Italy and the former Yugoslavia, making this section more fact-oriented (or as boring as transportation might be). These are, I think, the correct places to explain the reasons that brought Slovenia to build a new port, etc.etc. Thank you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.25.62.90 (talk) 10:26, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

I've rewritten the offending section about Trieste and tried to make a distinction between the actual status on the ground and the historical actions of Slovens/Yugoslavs and Italians. Is this a reasonable compromise? I've tried to give balance to both sides, there by allowing people to know the facts.--AnthonyBurgess (talk) 13:41, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

Dear Mr. Burgess, thank you for your intervention. I appreciated your effort to keep a balance between the different points of view. I'm afraid that we're discussing about different topics: leaving apart the personal research written by Mr. Rokpok, I still think that this article is not the correct place to explain the reasons that brought Slovenia to build a new port. I'm afraid that only in the historical section of the articles about Slovenia, about Koper, about post-war settlements between Italy and the former Yugoslavia, the reader will have a deeper and balanced knowledge of the facts. In my opinion, in this article, for its nature of being a fact-oriented list (roads such and such, ports such and such, railways such and such, airports, etc.etc.), it's not possible to give a balanced knowledge of all the historical reasons of both sides: it would become a mix of the two types of article - the historical article and the fact-oriented list. Thank you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.105.244.147 (talk) 15:17, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

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