Talk:Trepak (The Nutcracker)

Trepak vs. Tchaikovsky's Nutcracker Trepak
Apparently in multiple instances someone has deleted articles about the trepak, a form of music and dance indigenous to Ukraine, and left only information about the single trepak Tchaikovsky composed for his Nutrcracker ballet. In no instance was this decision explained. Possibly a conventional deletion procedure was followed but I haven't found any indication. In the unlikely event it matters I am requesting that future work not be summarily erased, although I'm not going to re-create or resurrect old articles or old article versions. Ventifact (talk) 01:41, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

Cleanup
I'll agree that this article needed some cleanup. However, since no specific complaints were posted to this talk page and I have given the article a decent cleanup I'm taking the liberty of removing the cleanup tag. If this is premature please re-tag the article and explain why here. Ventifact 21:47, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

Trepak is not just part of The Nutcracker
I have created a page for Trepak and redirected it here. I have added an opening paragraph to this article that, in part, explains what a trepak in general is, then transitions to Tchaikovsky's "Trepak." Also, Wikipedia's not supposed to be a how-to, but the "tips" below that someone has posted could be turned into legitimate content if they were rephrased in encyclopedic format, viz. not tips on how it should be played but how it is played. Ventifact 21:28, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

Tolstoi already uses the term "Trepak" in "War and peace". Therefore I would agree that "Trepak" is not just part of "The Nutcracker". 24.96.23.17 (talk) 11:09, 26 September 2013 (UTC)

Tips for playing Trepak (Russian Dance)
Trepak for the most part is a very loud song, though control of volume is an important element of how it is played.


 * The first violin part in the first melody should be heard clearly. All notes should be clean and crisp. Do not let the other parts overshadow it.


 * In their tied quarter notes, the clarinets and bassons should also be the loudest and heard clearly. Do not let the string parts overshadow this.


 * In the next melody, the cellos and basses should be very loud, and is very important that they are not blocked out by the other parts. The title of this song is Russian Dance, and these two parts provide the central russian flavor of the whole song. Make sure that all the sixteenth notes are played crisp and clear. The violin parts should be somewhat louder than the cello and bass parts, but it is important that they do not block those parts out. The quarter notes played by the Corni in F are vital to the cello and bass parts, and should be heard clearly, esp. when the cellos and basses enter crescendo.


 * Do not have the trumpets play too loud towards the end, for they can easily blot out the strings. When the trumpets play the eighth and sixteenth notes at the end, they can take over as the loudest instruments.


 * The bass's parts independent of the cello should be made sure that they are heard clearly throughout the whole song, again adding to the russian flavor.

Трoпак or Трiпак?
Is the dance in Ukrainian called Трoпак or Трiпак? Marxolang (talk) 04:11, 31 October 2008 (UTC)

As a slavic language, thej vowels developed in Ukrainian in an interesting manner. Unaccented vowels were initially often hard to distinguish. Currently in Ukrainiian it shouold be Tripak, but in previous spelling it would have been tropak. In Russian the manner in which they treat vowels would make it into an e. Similar can be seen in the word for bread which in Ukrainian is Khlib and in Russian is pronounced khleb. Previously there was a specific letter for this vowel which in Ukrainian changed to i and in Russian to e. Similaraly ie. Vira and Vera

Reorganisation
There was an amount of material that dealt with the Tropak, which was not specifically about this piece of music by Tchaikovsky (which we know as "Trepak"), and deserves its own article. I've created a new Tropak article and moved the material into there. I've also renamed this article "Trepak (Tchaikovsky)" because it's not the only trepak ever written by composers. It still needs some sources and categorisation. -- JackofOz (talk) 00:27, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

Merge with The Nutcracker
On second thought 5 years later (I'm a bit slow sometimes), why does this excerpt, alone of all the famous dances from the ballet, have its own article? There are redirects from Waltz of the Flowers and Dance of the Sugar Plum Fairy to the main article. Why not this one? --  Jack of Oz   [pleasantries]  01:58, 31 August 2013 (UTC)

I concur with Jack, to the extent that the Trepak referred to is the one in The Nutcracker, but I think it is worth remaining a separate entry about the Ukrainian folk dance, with a pointer to The Nutcracker as a well-known example. (There, isn't that a typically Canadian solution?) User:Moorespoint 03:51, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
 * ...a year later, I have removed the suggested merge tags. There's a note in this article that the dance was also used in Fantasia. Additionally, unlike the other dances which are named after movements in the play, "trepak" is a Ukrainian folk dance. I think this can stand alone. Keegan (talk) 07:58, 18 December 2014 (UTC)

Trepak is Ukrainian, not at all Russian
User 85.212.239.42 and anyone else looking to alter this article the way User 91.108.31.232 has been doing for Tropak needs to at least offer reliable sourcing for their edits attempting to present Trepak/Tropak as a Russian dance tradition. Trepak was developed and danced solely by the Ukrainian Cossacks. Neither the dress identified with the dance nor the dance itself was ever part of Russian culture. The fact that Tchaikovsky used traditional Ukrainian dances and folk music does not magically transform these dances and folk music into traditional Russian dance and traditional Russian music. To be clear: Russians have never danced Trepak/Tropak/Hopak as part of their traditional national heritage. The Trepak is a clearly identifiable feature of the Ukrainian heritage. 85.212.239.42 made edits here to fold Trepak into a Russian tradition of dance. These efforts appear to go beyond cultural appropriation, these attacks on the sourced facts of Ukrainian culture are in tune with Russia's larger дезинформация campaign to weaken Ukrainian culture. -- Paleorthid (talk) 00:21, 9 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Yeah, maybe Putin himself made those edits to weaken the Ukrainian nation! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.37.148.238 (talk) 10:27, 16 July 2020 (UTC)