Talk:Trill (music)

First note
"However, in general, classical music before the time of Mozart is executed beginning on the main note, and music from after the time of Mozart starts on the auxillary note." Is this acurate? Is it not the opposite??? --Orpheo 10:01, 21 November 2005 (UTC)

Classical music before Mozart starts trills on the preceding note, and those after start on the written note. You are correct. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.98.138.53 (talk) 23:14, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

Squiggly
Not that it doesn't perfectly describe the notation, but is there no more technical/professional term available than "squiggly line"?! BigBlueFish 09:18, 30 March 2006 (UTC)


 * I thought that too, but then I thought it describes the word perfectly and everyone knows what it means, so it's the most accessible use of language. 86.16.223.203 14:40, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Verdi - Caro nome.ogg
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BetacommandBot (talk) 02:38, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
 * -I have removed the broken link (that once was this audio file) on the page to avoid confusion. (fabnt (talk) 17:52, 27 April 2009 (UTC))

Now with references!
I added a citation to a book, then I deleted the 'unreferenced' information box at the top.

I'm new to wikipedia so i'm unsure if this is acceptable or not, so please feel free to add it again if nessesary. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Fabnt (talk • contribs) 18:40, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

In electronic music
I deleted the following after listening to the last 7 minutes of the cited part one, which neither announces "The Venetian Effect" nor has anything resembling a trill.

'On Mike Oldfield's Tubular Bells II'', a digitally synthesized trill, referred to as "The Venetian Effect", is used extensively. It is formally introduced along with the other instruments at the end of Part One.'''

If there is a trill elsewhere, some explanation of why it is notable, unique, or even apt as an example is still needed, I think. Sparafucil (talk) 01:49, 26 June 2009 (UTC)


 * You are right - on Tubular Bells I, it is introduced as "mandolin". It is in Tubular Bells II, track 7 (The Bell), where it is introduced as "The Venetian Effect".  I will correct that.James Monroe (talk) 14:30, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for the clarification, but let's hang on a bit: in the first place this effect is usually called bisbigliando by mandolinists and is not a trill as defined by the article. In the second place, before adding this to tremolo, what makes this particular example noteworthy? Does the reiteration of the note take place electronically as opposed to just playing/entering two notes for one? Sparafucil (talk) 08:12, 27 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Honestly, my main goal was to provide a definition for Oldfield's "Venetian Effect" somewhere on Wikipedia. I was listening to it and couldn't find anything, anywhere online, that explains what the hell a "Venetian Effect" is.  Eventually I realized that it was just a trill performed on the mandolin.  However, if there is a specific name for the mandolin effect, then it would probably be better to write an article on that effect and then have "Venetian Effect" redirect to that page.  Unfortunately I am not qualified to write that article :( James Monroe (talk) 15:43, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

Oh, I see what you mean now (I think). For a one-use term, you might make a page the redirects to Tubular_Bells_II and put something in that article to the effect that

"The Venetian Effect" refers to a characteristic mandolin technique, the bisbigliando or tremolo, in which the effect of sustained notes is achieved by repetition.

Hope this helped! Sparafucil (talk) 01:20, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Alright, I put it in the article on "The Bell". Thanks for your help!  —Preceding unsigned comment added by James Monroe (talk • contribs) 17:10, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

Baroque Trill example
With all due respect to the author who took the time to create and post the example of a Baroque trill and sound clips of its Baroque and "modern" realizations (visible near the beginning of the article and to the right), it seems a bit...funky. Unless it's some less common realization (using the + sign for the trill indicates it's French?), I think perhaps a more standard representation of a Baroque trill would be preferable. Specifically, the dotted-8th-note d" is not as clear as using two notes and a tie. Also, why is the note before the trill (that d) held over the beat?  Why is the d then repeated?  Even listening to the audio representation, it sounds rather...odd.  Perhaps the dotted 8th was not supposed to be dotted?

Requesting some clarification on this one. IMHO, a more standard trill would be, starting on the trilled note itself, 16th-notes d"-c#"-d"-c#" (tied to an eighth-note c#"), then the 8th-note d" anticipation of the plain version followed by the last note of the example. Or there could be three d"-c#" rotations instead of just two, or the first d of the trill could be lengthened. But the version as shown in the article has me befuddled.

thankee

the_paccagnellan (talk) 04:11, 19 April 2011 (UTC)

Faulty first sentence
Re: "The trill (or shake, as it was known from the 16th until the 19th century) is a musical ornament consisting of a rapid alternation between two adjacent notes, usually a semitone or tone apart, which can be identified with the context of the trill."

Several problems here: 1) In the twentieth century trill was the American term and shake the British term. 2) What "adjacent notes" are not "a semitone or tone apart"? 3) The term tone is not necessarily synonymous with whole-step or major second. It can include the semitone. 4) Rapid alternation between pitches greater than a major second apart is called tremolo. 4) The last clause, which can be identified with the context of the trill, is gibberish. TheScotch (talk) 09:29, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Block quote in lede
I tried to separate out the line "Caccini also makes use of the term trillo..." from the block quote, by adding the "closing" "}}", which does successfully bring the non-quoted content back out to the left margin, but it also strangely leaves an errant "}}" in the visible text. Could someone more familiar with how to properly address Template:Quote please look into this? - Buckaboob Bonsai (talk) 16:21, 16 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Buckaboob Bonsai, you touched on an interesting point. The answer, in a way, is simple--we shouldn't have block quotes in the lead; I'm sure it says that somewhere in MOS:LEAD. Plus, the whole thing was an unattributed quote from the Grove Dictionary of Music anyway, and we are not going to lose anything by cutting it, which I just did. Thanks, Drmies (talk) 00:40, 20 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Great work on your part, Drmies. It's amazing how you keep coincidentally landing on the articles that I have serviced. We are truly blessed to have you working on Wikipedia with such resolve! - Buckaboob Bonsai (talk) 04:30, 20 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Alas, though... I don't see anything in MOS:LEAD about block quotes. - Buckaboob Bonsai (talk) 04:36, 20 May 2020 (UTC)

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