Talk:Trinity Baptist Church sex scandal

Contested deletion
This page should not be speedy deleted because... --Mykjoseph (talk) 02:42, 21 April 2011 (UTC) This page covers Trinity Baptist Church, a long-time (30 year) church located in Concord, new Hampshire, that has been the subject of national and local media coverage in the United States and worldwide over a pattern of possible abuse by church members and leaders. This coverage has included ABC News, CBS News, and many more from 1997 to 2011. Church leaders have spoken up about this abuse and should be permitted to give their position through this page. If this page is not available, it will possibly prevent many people from drawing their own conclusions about these alleged abuse cases over the years. After all, Wikipedia does not currently have any reference to abuse taking place within independent Baptist Churches across the US at present, even though their have been countless reported incidents in many leading media outlets, as mentioned above. This article is meant to serve as a starter article, and of course there is room for addition.

I should also point out that there are many individual churches that have their own Wikipedia pages (I can provide list if you would like.) and these have no such notable situations like Trinity Baptist Church does. And, no, I am not an IFB member or past member. Thank you. Mykjoseph (talk) 02:42, 21 April 2011 (UTC)

Broken links
I think all the Concord Monitor links are now broken.--John Foxe (talk) 23:13, 23 May 2011 (UTC)

COI Editing
John Foxe has a serious conflict of editing here as he has been directly involved in the Tina Anderson affair and has been supportive of Chuck Phelps in his real world academic position and very critical of the rape victim Tina Anderson. His only purpose here is defend all things fundamental and Bob Jones University affiliates like Phelps. All of his additions should be removed immediately concerning the BLP violations concerning the rape of Tina Anderson. 172.56.9.207 (talk) 12:46, 17 February 2015 (UTC)
 * note - there is an ongoing discussion of this at COIN, here Jytdog (talk) 01:30, 20 February 2015 (UTC)
 * that discussion has been archived, and is now here. Jytdog (talk) 20:33, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

This article is significant because of the national media attention surrounding the emotional abuse of a minor rape victim by the church officials
The reason this article is here is because the church officials egregiously emotionally abused a minor rape victim who was impregnated by the 39 year old Willis who would remain in the church unpunished for more than a decade after his violent crime with the church officials being aware. Chuck Phelps was the Pastor and has tried to wash his hands and clean up his image over the emotional abuse of the victim whose mother brought the matter before the church officers. It is much bigger than the tragic rape of a teenage girl by a church member which tragically occurs way to frequently. It is about the church's handling of the rape and impregnation of a minor and blaming her for being raped by a man 24 years senior. It is about Trinity Baptist Church, their Christian school and the pastor at the time Chuck Phelps. That is why national media such as 20/20, MSNBC, and many major online media outlets covered this story. It should stay here. USER:John Foxe has commented he would like to see its name changed in an ongoing COI investigation regarding him and this article. That is not unexpected as the article has been greatly improved since John's intensive prior editing that appears to minimize the events as much as possible. John is to closely connected to Phelps to be subjective here (and his long history of edit warring, COI and sock puppetry User:Hi540 and support that). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.56.15.75 (talk) 12:59, 18 February 2015 (UTC)


 * Nope. Wikipedia does not support coatrack articles - articles supposedly created on one subject, but actually intended to cover another story which itself would not meet our notability guidelines. AndyTheGrump (talk) 13:28, 18 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Andy your premise that it is not notable is completely false, when most of the major media television, print and internet outlets cover it is notable but once you dig your heels in Andy you seldom are swayed by reason. 172.56.15.75 (talk) 14:19, 18 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia is not a newspaper. And as for your comments about me, I have to ask what exactly qualifies you to make such an assertion? AndyTheGrump (talk) 16:17, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

BLPN notice
I have opened a discussion at WP:BLPN concerning the BLP issues and potential refocusing of the article. See here. Jytdog (talk) 01:29, 20 February 2015 (UTC)


 * The church's officers conspired cover up of a rape of a minor was the subject of national media for several months including a 20/20 section. The mother contacted her pastor Chuck Phelps about the sexual abuse of her daughter. The pastor and his wife grilled the victim for quite some time about her dress, whether she enjoyed it and repeatedly asked and told her she was partly responsible according to the victim's court and public testimonies. The 15 year victim was then coerced to read an apology pastor Chuck Phelps (who is still pastoring a church but forced to resign from Bob Jones University advisors by public demand) and his wife drafted and convinced the girls mother to accept in front of the congregation. All this after telling them she was forcibly raped by 39 year old Willis a member. This closely resembles behavior of a cult and it was appalling that the leaders in the church participated in this further verbal and emotional abuse of child. On top of that the offender was allowed to remain in the church for over a decade with many in the top leadership knowing a minor had been violated by that man. The perp also tried to get the girl to let him punch her in the stomach to cause an abortion. The church's insane handling of a rape of a minor is what makes this rape much different than another sexual abuse by the clergy. It was the cover up by the church that drew the national media attention and they got it right when they chose to expose the churches abhorrent behavior. The church name should remain in what ever title change takes place as the public should be informed and the church should not be able to hide the atrocious behavior. A possible change would be Trinity Baptist Church Sex Abuse Scandal (Concord New Hampshire) but leaving the church's name out is an attempt to hide the story of the church cover up of a rape of a minor. 172.56.38.55 (talk) 05:09, 20 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Per WP:TPG, please write shorter posts. WP:WALLOFTEXT detracts from the points you are trying to make.  Thanks. Jytdog (talk) 08:39, 20 February 2015 (UTC)


 * not too much commenting there, but comments were directed to rename to Trinity Baptist Church Sex Scandal. I just did that. Jytdog (talk) 00:07, 23 February 2015 (UTC)
 * note - archived discussion at BLPN is here. Jytdog (talk) 20:35, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

Article Improvement
The article has been moved and some content that doesn't deal with the topic at hand has been removed. I suggest it's time to improve the article. It needs reorganization as it tends to ramble and jump around in chronological order. Maybe reorder paragraphs to describe the rape, describe the exposure, national attention, what the church did in response, the trial, and so forth. In other words, rewrite for better reading flow and understanding. Doesn't necessarily need sections as the article isn't particularly long. Thoughts? - Becksguy (talk) 09:20, 23 February 2015 (UTC)
 * i was thinking the same. have at it - be bold. Jytdog (talk) 09:30, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

Update
The following 2013 update should be included: .--John Foxe (talk) 01:34, 3 March 2015 (UTC)

Vandalism
An IP editor who is apparently a member of the congregation has been vandalizing this article. I am going to seek page protection. Jytdog (talk) 20:10, 24 February 2016 (UTC)