Talk:Triple Crown (professional wrestling)/Archive 4

Sigh
I quit. I'm not going to edit or discuss this page anymore. I get too angry. This isn't worth it. I'm taking off my watchlist. Good luck everyone. 声 援 -- The  Hyb rid  19:47, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

AFD
The descision for the TCC was 8 keep to 6 delete, the Grand Slam was 12 keep to 6 delete. Both articles stay for the moment. Darrenhusted 22:23, 25 February 2007 (UTC)


 * I restored the AFD back, it needs to go the full 7 days, and have an admin check it over and make a decision. Just because there are more keep votes doesn't mean that the article is automatically kept. Booshakla 08:21, 26 February 2007 (UTC)


 * And I reclosed it. AfDs only go for 5 days, and there was no established consensus. Farewell, 声 援 -- The  Hyb rid  03:58, 27 February 2007 (UTC)


 * As I've stated before: votes don't matter, the arguements for or against the article do. This article is alot of original research (and those tags are likely to remain on the article for a while I bet). RobJ1981 06:21, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Booshakala, I was just relaying the result becasue the afd box had gone. RobJ1981, the arguments for and against were prety much of the "this is OR get rid/this exists find more sources" variety. I added the OR tags because I think that improving this article is better than deleting it. This and the Grand Slam page need a lot of work, but that's what Wikipedia is about. I just hope that WP:PW can get a handle on this and get these two articles tamed. Darrenhusted 12:53, 28 February 2007 (UTC)


 * What sort of work do they need? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Mlsq42 (talk • contribs) 12:49, 4 March 2007 (UTC).

Verifiable sources would be a good start. Darrenhusted 14:13, 4 March 2007 (UTC)


 * For what, the title wins? People being called a Triple Crown Champion by the WWE? The concept? Forgive me, I'm new at this.Mlsq42 02:33, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

The whole thing, titles, dates of wins, the concept of a triple crown, those acknowledged, what is not a TCC. Darrenhusted 23:53, 5 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Ok, so does Online World of Wrestling's title history page count as a reference? Does WWE's Title History page count?Mlsq42 08:47, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

Charlie 1227
Seems to be going for a record for single daily edits, this page has remained untouched for nine days (something of a record) and now Charlie 1227 had made 17 edits between 16:21 and 19:09, most of which were minor table corrections. He is not a newbie and he is not adding anything to this page which hasn't been discussed to death. I have asked him at his talk page to stop editing with information which is not needed. But just in case any one else is watching this page, can they help revert in case he gets the editing rush. Darrenhusted 19:29, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

All the titles
Is there a term for someone who has one all the titles they can win in the WWE:

1. WWE Championship

2. World Championship

3. Intercontinental Championship

4. United States Championship

5. World Tag Team Championships

6. WWE Tag Team Championships

Because if the term exists, then there would be these Potential Champions:


 * Chris Benoit needs a WWE Championship reign


 * Edge needs a World Heavyweight Championship reign


 * Ric Flair needs a WWE Tag Team Championship reign


 * Shawn Michaels needs a WWE Tag Team Championship reign


 * Triple H needs a WWE Tag Team Championship reign


 * Kurt Angle (who is currently not contracted by the WWE) needs a World Tag Team Championship reign


 * *Not including the ECW Championship (bcuz KAYFABE explains it is not part of the WWE), nor any defunct titles (European, North American, Hardcore, etc.

GOOD NEWS Edge doesnt need the World Championship anymore. So, by a coincidence of this question i made a long time ago, now, it has actually happened. So, we should create a term for someone who has won all those titles. Lex94 10:47pm May 10, 07


 * WWE does not have a term like that. As for your list, Shawn Michaels and Triple H have never won the US championship. Anakinjmt 20:24, 11 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Creating a term would definitely amount to considerable original research, which is one of wikipedia's core policies, therefore, we shouldn't, nor will we create such a term. Bmg 916  Speak 03:20, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Potential Champions
There aren't any potential champions if the United States Championship was considered part of the Triple Crown, so I took that sentence out. Lex94 April 23 9:40

Show Edge some love
Edge just did something historic here.

He has won a Triple Double.

He has won both the Raw and Smackdown versions of the Triple Crown. (I know the U.S. Title isn't "official", yadda yadda yadda.)

But, come on, are we going to let a mere technicality derail the fact that Edge has done something special here.

We need to put something in here that acknowledges this great feat.

Ohgltxg 16:12 May 9, 2007 (UTC)

If you want to show love how about Jericho, he won the WCW, WWE, IC, Tag, Hardcore, Euro, ECW TV, WCW TV and CW titles. That's a man who deserves love. As for the Edge thing, if he's the first to have won all five titles since the brand split then maybe a note on his page is best. Darrenhusted 21:41, 9 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Edge has never won the WWE US title. He's won the WCW US title, which is different. Anakinjmt 20:27, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

He won the WCW United States Championship while it was under the WWE. Lex94 11:34 May 12, 2007

Edge has done something extrodinary winning a double Triple Crown in WWE. Now all he needs to do is win the ECW title and he will have held all seven championships. User: Vermon CaTaffy 8

Yes, and all he has to do after that is lose 30 pounds and get a sex change and then he can win the WWE Cruiserweight and Women’s Championship.--Prince Patrick 13:45, 15 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I'm not going to be able to get that image out of my head... ugh! Lemon Demon (talk) 14:50, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

WWE
Why dont we email WWE and ask him for the reference of the definition of Triple Crown? Lex94 18:00, 26 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Doesn't work, tried it. — M o e   ε  09:09, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

The introduction of the page
'''In professional wrestling, a Triple Crown Champion is a term describing a wrestler who has won the three most prestigious belts of their promotion - typically a heavyweight belt, a tag team belt, and a second-tier belt. A "multiple triple crown" distinction also exists, with having won the three constituent titles at least a specified number of times.'''

If this is true, the only Triple Crown would be THE BIG SHOW, for he is the only one to win "the three most prestigious belts of their promotion" (ECW Championship, WWE Championship, World Championship) Lex94 16:19, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

Not really, that is a reference to the TNA triple crown being won multiple times, if you scroll down the page you will note that Big Show is not a Triple Crown Champion, and thus could not be referred to in the intro. Darrenhusted 18:19, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

I thnk his point was that the definition on the beginning of the page is wrong. A Triple Crown is not the one who won the three major titles in a wrestling promotion. If that was true, the WWE Championship, World Championship, and ECW Championship would be the Triple Crown. The definition should state

'''In professional wrestling, a Triple Crown Champion is a term describing a wrestler who has won the Heavyweight Championship, Tag Team Championship and Second-tier championship of their promotion. In WWE's case, of their respective brands. 68.88.70.146 21:24, 25 July 2007 (UTC)


 * It already says heavyweight, tag and second tier. The intro needs to be short, I really don't see any difference between what is already written and what you are saying. Darrenhusted 22:07, 25 July 2007 (UTC)


 * "Three major titles of their promotion" is not the same as "Heavyweight, tag team and second-tier belt" (the three major titles are the WWE, World and ECW Championships). Lex   T / C    Guest Book    11:34, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

Multiple Triple Crown Winners + ROH/TNA?
Now that ROH has a PPV National deal, should they have their triple crown up. I think they should, because, they are kind of a national promotion, when you take in the fact that the PPV's are broadcast around the Nation.

Also, TNA's triple crown should be able to sub the NWA belts for the TNA belts, correct, since they are still part of that promotion?

I also think we should have a small section of WWE Multiple Triple Crown winners, because Shawn Michaels would be a three time triple crown winner by that defination(He held the WWE Title 3 times, the World Tag Titles 4 times, and the IC Title 3 times.)

Also, just saying, if a Triple Crown definition does state the use of a Primary Title, a Secondary Title, and a Tag Title counts toward someone being a TCC, wouldn't that count the US Title as well, because it is a second-tier title of SD, easily? I mean, take the common sense definition of it, and basically it is a part of the triple crown, as per the definition. Tommyspud 15:07, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

Find a source, and the US title debate has been discussed to death, I suggest you RTA Darrenhusted 15:15, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

So, you are denying the definition of a triple crown? The definition of a triple crown has been proven, so if the US Title is a second tier title, which it is, it should be in the triple crown. Tommyspud 15:31, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

I have the WWE History of the Champion which defines the TCC as WWE/IC/WWE Tag, then Shawn Michaels redefines it as WORLD/IC/WWE Tag, then Kurt Angle adds WORLD/IC/WORLD Tag. No where is there a reference which confirms the US title as an equal replacement for the IC. So once more I ask that you RTFA. What you are saying may seem to be common sense but it is also OR, and Wikipedia says no OR. Darrenhusted 15:34, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

Again, look at the pages for both the IC Title and the US Title, they each state that they are the second highest belts on their respective brands, making them second tier titles, therefore they are equal replacements for each other. Don't tell me to RTA, because, I've already read it, and I didn't see anyone try to make a claim as to the definition of a triple crown. Tommyspud 15:40, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

Well, if you have read the archive you will see that people have grown tired of this debate, the US title is not the same as the IC, and no consensus has been reached, once you find a source that backs you up then I will happily leave the US champs in, until then it is OR. Darrenhusted 15:59, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

As a supplement, the whole TNA/NWA thing has resulted in a hundred edits, I'd find a source for that too. Darrenhusted 16:00, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

Got that sourced and verified, seems as the TNA belts can be interchanged with the NWA belts as per the roster bios. http://www.tnawrestling.com/roster/ajstyles/index.html

http://www.tnawrestling.com/roster/brotherdevon/index.html

See, it just lists them as actual World Heavyweight Champion or World Tag Team Champions, so I guess the TNA Triple Crown would include the TNA belts. Tommyspud 03:50, 8 July 2007 (UTC)

If the source is good then edit away, but don't be surprised if it gets quickly reverted. Darrenhusted 10:49, 8 July 2007 (UTC)

Fine, and there is also this... http://www.tnawrestling.com/info/history/tnaworldtitle.html That proves they are interchangeable. Tommyspud 17:23, 8 July 2007 (UTC)

Fine, be warned that if you have read the archives then you may want to check the page history because the edit you want to make may have already been made and revrted. Darrenhusted 17:36, 8 July 2007 (UTC)


 * The TNA website states that the TNA Triple Crown consists of the NWA World-, NWA Tag- and TNA X- titles. Unless they explicitly state that the Triple Crown definition has been revised, editing the page to reflect this is original research. Moreover, the title history page states, "[the] NWA World Title is replaced by the TNA World Title" (emphasis mine). A new title would logically commence a new Triple Crown. McPhail 14:01, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Exactly, REPLACED, which means in the Triple Crown, that the NWA belts would be Replaced with the TNA Belts. They still refer to AJ as a triple crown winner, check the newest TNA Today, so therefore, the Triple Crown stays to what I had it. The triple crown belts have been replaced, as to the Title page, so we must say that the triple crown, is under the exact same decision. Tommyspud 18:30, 11 July 2007 (UTC)


 * The TNA website states that the NWA World Title was replaced, not that it became the TNA World Title or was renamed the TNA World Title. Furthermore, your argument is based on conjecture rather than evidence. Unless TNA specifically states that the Triple Crown has been redefined, or acknowledges Daniels or Senshi as a Triple Crown winner upon winning the TNA World Title, the definition should be left as it is. McPhail 23:26, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

The TNA Title History also states that the NWA Title holders are still TNA World CHAMPIONS, because they are on that list, so either, all the NWA title holders in TNA need to be switched to the TNA Title holders as well, thereby making the effect that if the NWA belts do not be switched, then an entire new section should be added. Tommyspud 00:17, 12 July 2007 (UTC)


 * The table indicates a break between the NWA and TNA world titles. There is no suggestion that the TNA world title retrospectively occupies the role played by the NWA world title. In any event, this is a moot point. There are numerous sources stating that the TNA Triple Crown consists of the NWA world/NWA tag/TNA X titles. Unless you can supply an official source confirming that this definition has been revised, the article must remain in the referenced version. McPhail 20:20, 14 July 2007 (UTC)

There is also no SUGGESTION that it isn't either. All we have to go on is that the NWA Title holders are on the TNA title history. If the definition of the Triple Crown HASN'T change, then tell me why the NWA Title holders in TNA are a part of the TNA Title History, instead of having it's own section. So if there is a BREAK between the NWA and TNA titles, then there should be a break in the triple crown as well. (From Tommyspud) 75.162.15.86 01:07, 17 July 2007 (UTC)


 * I'll repeat once more: cite sources, not rationale. There are existing references defining the TNA Triple Crown as the combination of the NWA World-, NWA Tag- and TNA X- titles. There are no existing references defining the TNA Triple Crown as the combination of the TNA World-, TNA Tag- and TNA X- titles. Unless you can supply these references, there is nothing further to discuss. McPhail 15:27, 17 July 2007 (UTC)


 * To McPhail, even if there aren't references to TNA's triple crown definition changing, it's implied with the move from the NWA World Tag and Heavyweight Titles to the TNA branded ones. TonyFreakinAlmeida 19:17, 9 September 2007 (UTC)


 * I would consider AJ Styles the first and only NWA-TNA Triple Crown champion since he held the NWA World, NWA Tag and TNA X-Division titles. TNA may be trying to re-write history by saying that all their former champs are TNA champs because they lost the rights to the NWA name. Kurt Angle would be the first TNA Triple Crown champ because he held the TNA World, TNA Tag and TNA X-Division titles. Kurt is not a former NWA World champ because he is not recognized by the NWA as such and also in one of TNA's ads hyping a PPV they stated Angle was a 7-time world champ which means they are counting his 6 WWE reigns and his current TNA reign and not a NWA title reign. (From wwffan1)

Samoa Joe
I had been reverted attempts to list Joe in the "potential champions" section of the TNA Triple Crown yesterday. I had compeltely forgotten that the PPV had even aired. I apologize for my behavior. Gavyn Sykes 18:20, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

Kurt Angle in TNA
Should Kurt be added temporarily to the list of Potential champions for the TNA Triple Crown since he will become one if he wins one match at Hard Justice? Virakhvar321 06:41, 20 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Are you asking to make him a potential potential champion? Don't you think that list would include half the TNA roster? I would leave any wrestlers off until they actually win titles. Darrenhusted 11:43, 20 July 2007 (UTC)


 * No I'm saying that he needs 2 more titles to be a Triple Crown champion, but he can do it in just one match; no one else in TNA can do that. Angle can win the X Divison and Tag Team titles with one pinfall while it would take everyone else multiple matches. I'm just saying Angle can be a Triple Crown champion by winning one match with all the titles on the line. Virakhvar321 23:32, 20 July 2007 (UTC)


 * I would leave it off until the match is over, there are hundreds of matches during the year when wrestlers could win stuff, I would say it falls under WP:CRYSTAL. Darrenhusted 23:38, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

Randy Orton
I know its not the biggest of matters, still i had a thought that i was hoping someone could clear up for me. does it matter which title you win first. As randy orton has won both wwe and world heavy weight is it not fair to say he has became a triple crown champ in the traditional way now?Black6989 (talk) 04:23, 29 January 2008 (UTC)Black6989


 * Also there is a mistake with Orton. It says he won the WWE Tag Team Champiomship, December 2003. That is suppose to be in the IC section, I would change it if I knew how that table works but I don't so someone needs to. WeLsHy (talk) 23:57, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

AJ Styles
Can somebody put that he won the TNA Tag Team Title? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.124.4.220 (talk) 03:25, 8 February 2008 (UTC)


 * Why? Darrenhusted (talk) 15:27, 28 April 2008 (UTC)


 * Yeah. AJ can become another Triple Crown but we would be using his NWA tag because that reign came first. Until he becomes a 5 time Triple Crown we don't have to place that in here because you can become a multi Crown champion.-- Will C  02:51, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

Chris Benoit
It should be pointed out that although Benoit's World Title is now the "lesser" of the two, when he won it at Wrestlemania, it was the premier title of WWF at the time. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.206.238.152 (talk) 20:06, 1 April 2008 (UTC)


 * no. There is no reason. That doesn't change anything. The WWE title for a while there was the top title from 2002 to 2003. That doesn't change anything. The WWE title was the top one when HBK won the World. Should we change that one to? Should we place that Cena won the WWE title when the WHC was the more important one after he wins the IC in a year or so.-- Will C  02:48, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

Edge
Wouldn't Edge be either a grand slam champion or at least a potential grand slam champion? He isn't listed as either though he has held the WWE Championship, World Heavyweight Championship, World Tag Team Championships, WWE Tag Team Championships, and Intercontinental championship (All multiple times) What else does he need to win? Am I missing something?JakeDHS07 (talk) 17:30, 25 April 2008 (UTC)JakeDHS07


 * He never won the European title. Gavyn Sykes (talk) 17:56, 25 April 2008 (UTC)


 * Yeah he needs a European and because that title is unified with the IC there is no way for him to be a Grand Slam. WWE would have to bring the title back. And I don't think they are. So there is no reason to say he is a potential GS champion.-- Will C  02:45, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

A.J. Styles
I'm not sure, but wouldn't A.J. Styles be a potential champ, only needing a TNA Heavyweight reign? It seems like it is like that. 69.61.221.25 (talk) 01:47, 28 April 2008 (UTC)


 * He has already won the TNA TC three times, therefore he is not a potential TCC, he is one, three times. Darrenhusted (talk) 15:28, 28 April 2008 (UTC)


 * "In TNA, it is possible to be a multi-time Triple Crown Champion, as evidenced by commentators Mike Tenay and Don West referring to Styles as 3-time Triple Crown Champion. Styles is a 3-time NWA World Heavyweight Champion, 6-time TNA X Division Champion, 4-time NWA World Tag Team Champion, and 1-time TNA World Tag Team Champion, making him a three-time Triple Crown winner." So, wouldn't that make him a possible one? 69.61.221.25 (talk) 21:13, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

No. Darrenhusted (talk) 15:09, 6 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Actually I agree with the IP guy. Maybe we could place that AJ Styles is a potential 4 time Triple Crown winner just needing another World reign in TNA to become a 4 time. Because he is a potential 4 time.-- Will C  02:42, 10 June 2008 (UTC)