Talk:Tupolev PAK DA

Specifications
Can someone please find out the specifications for this plane. I would really like to know the top speed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Badger Brock (talk • contribs) 02:58, 8 January 2008 (UTC)

Sources?
This article seems devoid of sources. A google search on PAK-DA didn't come up with much. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Senor Freebie (talk • contribs) 09:44, 6 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Classified records are usually like that, you can't find them on the internet. Right now we can only use news reports or quotes from people involved in the project.Still, it's a stub. The reason there is little mention is because you are looking for a Russian designed plane on the English version of Wikipedia. The Russian version carries more info. I have found multiple news sites mentioning it so I will list them:

http://www.lenta.ru/news/2007/12/12/strategic/

http://vpk.name/news/9651_na_sozdanie_novogo_strategicheskogo_samoleta_dlya_rossiiskoi_armii_potrebuetsya_67_let__genkonstruktor_kompanii_tupolev.html

http://www.lenta.ru/news/2007/12/12/strategic/ ↑ http://www.lenta.ru/news/2007/12/12/strategic/

http://nvo.ng.ru/armament/2005-01-21/6_plane.html ↑ http://nvo.ng.ru/armament/2005-01-21/6_plane.html

http://vpk.name/news/7748_v_rossii_nachinayutsya_rabotyi_po_sozdaniyu_novogo_strategicheskogo_raketonosca_dlya_dalnei_aviacii.html http://vpk.name/news/7748_v_rossii_nachinayutsya_rabotyi_po_sozdaniyu_novogo_strategicheskogo_raketonosca_dlya_dalnei_aviacii.html

http://www.lenta.ru/news/2009/08/19/bomber/ ↑ http://www.lenta.ru/news/2009/08/19/bomber/

http://www.royfc.com/acft_news.html

http://www.deagel.com/Long-Range-Attack-Aircraft/PAK-DA_a002424001.aspx

http://en.rian.ru/mlitary_news/20090819/155857912.html

http://www.paralay.com/pakda.html

There is even a Free Republic article on it (/focus/f-news/2325018/posts)

http://english.pravda.ru/russia/economics/02-05-2007/90775-russian_bomber-0

Pick the source that pleases you most Zalgo 05:53, 27 August 2009 (UTC)
 * That picture is old, incorrect, & fan-made. It needs to be removed for those reasons. 71.50.103.166 (talk) 03:30, 14 November 2009 (UTC)

Overview
This article by Mikhail Barabanov gives a good overview of where the programme is as of September 2012 - and speculates whether it might be cut given the likely budget environment over the next few years. Le Deluge (talk) 16:06, 28 September 2012 (UTC)

design
according to the Voice of Russia this will be a flying wing, possibly deriving from the Tu-202, but the picture in the box is a swingwing, like the Backfire and not like the B-2. -- 76.65.128.222 (talk) 12:10, 17 July 2013 (UTC)


 * Looking at these sketches: internal structure, sketch, it is a swing wing that is also a flying wing. At this point and likely for another decade this is all speculation. I would say don't jump to things and leave it at that. Mightyname (talk) 12:46, 22 February 2014 (UTC)

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Aircraft name is incorrect
the translation of the aircraft name is incorrect, not a courier, the word "ПОСЛАННИК"="MESSENGER" is used, it is something more, more than just a "courier", it is a reference to the texts of the Bible and even the Koran  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A00:1370:812A:85F:B9C4:513C:77D6:6713 (talk) 11:36, 15 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Are there any sources supporting your claim? -- Nicholas Velasquez (talk) 13:22, 15 January 2020 (UTC)

I am Russian and I understand the difference between a courier and a messenger, the messenger has a special mission and fulfills a special will: Tsar, God, Heaven. The courier a word of French, we have couriers deliver legal correspondence, or PIZZA :) MESSENGER is a rarely used word in the Russian language and has a certain state status or a mystical halo. There is such a thing as symbolism, do you think that the Russians will call such a plane a courier, a pizza delivery man ?

I will give you links, at the moment there is only one meaning in the Russian Wikipedia, but in such cases I recommend turning to religious sources in Russian, there are stable phrases " messenger of God, messenger of Heaven"

Посланник https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9F%D0%BE%D1%81%D0%BB%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%BA

Посланник https://dic.academic.ru/dic.nsf/ogegova/175074

Посланник | Brockhaus Bible encyclopedia https://bible.by/lexicon/brockhaus/word/3178/ ( 2 Cor. 5:20 "so we are messengers in the name of Christ, and as it were God himself exhorts through us, in the name of Christ, we ask that you be reconciled with God».)

https://znachenie-slova.ru/%D0%BF%D0%BE%D1%81%D0%BB%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%BA I have given this link to draw your attention to a group of associations and synonyms:

Meanings of synonyms for the word messenger

agent / angel / apostle / Archangel

+ Associations to the word messenger

hell / angel / apostle / god

Koran:

http://islam.ru/content/veroeshenie/43542 Messengers of the most high: what is their difference from other people

http://islam.ru/content/veroeshenie/50735 what is the difference between a prophet and a messenger?

in general you have incorrectly translated the word and are not familiar with its associative series

I doubt that when the plane was given the name "Посланник""Messenger" they meant the Vienna Convention :), rather it is the messenger of the Ruler-the Supreme commander, if not of God :)

the name has a deeper meaning, but if you like, you can still name the plane incorrectly :) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A00:1370:812A:85F:E5C8:3D82:A24:CDF2 (talk) 05:20, 25 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Religious sources are misplaced there, as well as any kind of original research. If there are any sources explicitly stating the meaning of "Poslannik" in the PAK DA context is stricly "message deliverer", feel free to present them. So far "courier" is sufficient, since "message deliverer" is already encompassed in it: https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/courier -- Nicholas Velasquez (talk) 16:09, 25 January 2020 (UTC)