Talk:Tuvalu/Archive 1

Capital
According to the CIA Factbook the capital city is called Funafuti (located on the atoll with the same name). Look at this link: CIA Factbook - Tuvalu Mnemo 22:21, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

This is correct.

The CIA Factbook is not always a reliable source of information. Funafuti is the name of the atoll, Fongafale the name of the island within the atoll where the capital is located. Skinsmoke 05:31, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

Economy section: NPOV
I have reviewed the "Economy" section in all country articles on Wikipedia; unfortunately, many of them have NPOV issues, and by my reading, this article is one of them.

Common issues with this section include:
 * verbatim quotes from the CIA world factbook
 * describing a country's economic policy as "sound", "unsound", "imprudent", etc.
 * assuming a link between economic health and low inflation
 * using expressions like "the GDP improved" (should be increased), "beneficial levels of inflation" (should be low levels of inflation), etc.
 * postulating cause-effect relationships that seem controversial.

Issues in this specific article are:


 * judgment of government actions
 * "Thanks to wise investments and conservative withdrawals, this Fund grew from an initial $17 million to over $35 million in 1999": this appears to suggest a growth rate that was somehow very good, though the numbers suggest a rather average 5.6% p.a. growth; it's also not clear whether any money was put into the fund.
 * unsourced dubious statement
 * "Royalties from these new technology sources could raise GDP three-fold or more over the next decade, but it is not likely to reach the lofty numbers which Tuvalu was initially promised."

This note will stay up for a week before I'll make any further changes. Please feel free to be bold and fix the article yourself, though! I'll also be monitoring this discussion page, and will try answering any concerns.

If you want to discuss the entire project, you can do so on my talk page or at the talk page for this specific prject.

(Note: this is only the third country page I'm trying this on, and I haven't gotten any comments so far, so please let me know what you think about the idea.)

RandomP 11:36, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

Kyoto?? and sea level falling
"while Australia has refused the Tuvaluans' petitions, presumably based on that country's rejection of the underlying basis of the Kyoto Protocol."

Maybe I'm missing something, but what does the Kyoto Protocol have to do with anything? I can't figure out why that bit is there.


 * The proposed possible evacuation of Tuvalu is due to anticipated effects of global warming: that the sea level will rise enough to cover much or all of the islands. The Kyoto Protocol is a treaty to reduce greenhouse gas emissions in order to help reduce or reverse global warming due to the greenhouse effect.  So it sounds like this excerpt from the article is just saying that since, officially, Australia doesn't "believe in" global warming, it refuses to accept the claim that Tuvalu might need to be evacuated due to global warming.  I agree that saying "the underlying basis of the Kyoto Protocol" is a very obtuse way of referring to global warming.  I think the article should be changed to say something like "... presumably based on the Australian government's rejection of the reality of global warming."  However, I don't know what Australia's exact position is, so I won't change the article.


 * Also this article should mantion that there is possible danger tuvalu beeing flooded because of global warming, I read about that in the global warming effects article but it's not mentioned at all in the tuvalu article --Defufna 18:50, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Edit. removed sea levels falling. the two references are completely unscientific, one is a british tabloid, the other a right wing newspaper. furthermore the UK telegraph is misquted, although it does say that recent measurements showed a decrease it qualified the statement by saying (as the do the scientists who did the study) that it is a blip in the readings caused by local effects of el nino, and that the records show that over the past 30 years sea levels have been rising. the second reference includes wording such as "new zealand has been duped into taking tuvaluen immigrants by fanatical left wing scare mongers" - hardly objective. a scientific debate is defined by peer reviewed aticles in science journals NOT newspaper articles by journalists. if the rise or fall of sea level is referenced it should be to reputable sources ie peer reviewed scientific journals, not tabloids.

Tourism Link
I added a link for Timeless Tuvalu, the official tourism website. I thought that was an important link. Inkan1969 16:26, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

Proposed WikiProject
In my ongoing efforts to try to include every country on the planet included in the scope of a WikiProject, I have proposed a new project on Polynesia at WikiProject Council/Proposals whose scope would include Tuvalu. Any interested parties are more than welcome to add their names there, so we can see if there is enough interest to start such a project. Thank you for your attention. Badbilltucker 17:21, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Tuvaluan Scouting
Can someone render "Be Prepared", the Scout Motto, into Tuvaluan? Thanks! Chris 06:55, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

Kiribati language
Check if "I-Kiribati" is an appropriate name for the Kiribati_language. Apokrif 09:12, 17 Mar 2005 (UTC)

It is not. It means People of Kiribati (or Gilbertese).-Enzino 19:51, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

Tuvalu Districts
There seems to be an error at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuvalu In the Districts section, it states that there are nine islands in Tuvalu. In the next paragraph, however, it goes on to say that there are six districts that consist of more than one island each and three districts that consist of only one island each, meaning that there would have to be a minimum of 15 islands (6*2+3*1). Are there only nine islands or fifteen or more islands in Tuvalu? I do not think that twelve (or more) plus three equals nine (even in Tuvalu). —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cheerful-Pickle (talk • contribs) 09:20, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
 * It was confusing. There are nine atolls in Tuvalu. Most consist of several smaller islets, but in some these islets are fused together so there is only one island forming the atoll. The table just below the Districts section may make this simpler, and I've changed the word islands to islets in one place since "island" can mean either islet or atoll.- gadfium 18:50, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

this is the zodiac speaking. I have recently bean informed about your litle website. You canot ex cape me
how do you fix that floating banner? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.24.170.46 (talk) 05:35, 18 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I got in contact with wikipedia's helpdesk last night and they took care of it. According to the email the helpdesk sent me, they said "Thank you for your email. We've been experiencing a fair bit of this lately. I've reported that article to the people who will know how to fix it(unfortunately, my own understanding of the technical elements in question is pretty limited).  It should be fixed within a few minutes, but I'll keep my eye on it to be sure." Its fixed, so they did something right Aquamelli (talk) 12:34, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

suggestion for article
I suggest that the official name of the country be listed. What is it? Kingdom of Tuvalu, Commonwealth of Tuvalu? It's probably not Republic of Tuvalu because the Queen is Head of State. Presumptive (talk) 03:36, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

Added links
Please do not remove the following links I added:


 * Paradis Perdus: Les derniers jours de Tuvalu (part of the documentary)
 * Tuvalu's options on setting up defences against the rising sea
 * SOPAC working with Tuvalu to defend it against the rising sea by strengthening the island trough the filling of the US borrow pits

Also, you may want to update the article (especially the geography section) with the info from these articles. The articles include "weak spots" of the island and how it can be strengthened against the rising sea.

Thanks, KVDP (talk) 08:39, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

Tuvalu on globalEDGE
The link I posted was removed, however I feel that the globalEDGE website is a necessary and important portal of information regarding international business and has much to offer that isn't currently on any of the links that are on this page. Nbashaw 18:00, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
 * The site acknowledges its sources as being the CIA World Factbook and the U.S. Dept. of State Country Background Notes. It appears to be just a repackaging of these sources. I don't see how this adds significant value to the article.- gadfium 20:09, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
 * One way would be to put a high-precision GPS receiver on the island. If the island is sinking, the height measured by the GPS will decrease. 62.172.108.23 (talk) 11:43, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Population
The article gives two different population counts for 2005: 11,636 and 9,403. So which is it?
 * I don't know where the latter figure came from. 11,636 is what the CIA World Factbook gives, so I've corrected the second figure. I've also updated Demographics of Tuvalu with more current figures.-gadfium 18:44, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

I have amended the population figures on the main page to show the 2002 Census results, rather than the CIA 2005 estimate, as this equals the total of the island populations. I have left the 2005 estimate on the Demographics of Tuvalu page. Skinsmoke 05:34, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

Either way, Tuvalu is less populous than Nauru so the population statement on the main page appears incorrect. Tuvalu is second least populous only behind Vatican City.Lowmagnet (talk) 14:43, 27 February 2009 (UTC)

Annexing
Wiki hipocricy. Why Hitler's Germany or Soviet Union occupy and annex territories, but British and US "bring them to the sphere of influence, liberate, and establish colonies? Why Tuvaly, occupied by GB "got in the British sphere of influence", and Nauru (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nauru ) was occupied by Germany. Lets use the same words to describe the same events. Because of Doublespeak, Wikipedia is not a reliable source of knowledge any more. Wikipedia is Reliable.*(see small print for details) Wikipedia dosn't have adds. So, it is a free (not free*) enciclopedia. Lets keep it reliable, rather than reliable* —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.72.179.57 (talk) 20:47, 28 July 2009 (UTC)


 * You are confusing the gradual increase of influence over the islands, which was a combination of missionary activity (non-governmental) and (probably) the deliberate government policy of keeping rivals away, and the formal establishment of a protectorate in 1892. The sentence you changed was about the gradual increase. I don't know whether the protectorate can be called an annexation; you can find some definitions of what "protectorate" and "annex" actually mean, but crucially you would need to find a reputable source which calls this an annexation.- gadfium 21:14, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

Merge proposal: Tuvalu and the United Nations
I have proposed that any relevant material in Tuvalu and the United Nations be merged as and whereever appropriate to this article, and that article be turned into a redirect to this article.

The article to be merged, as it stands, is mainly large quotations from addresses to UN bodies by the nation's Governor-General, the Prime Minister, and the UN Ambassador. The proportion of primary source material is thus very high and it is unsuitable content for a Wikipedia article. My main thought is that appropriate secondary sources that evaluate these speeches may be found and, if relevant, added to a section about the country's membership of the UN. --TS 17:52, 13 August 2009 (UTC)


 * I oppose a merge with this article, since the topic is too specific for a country-level article. However, I would have no objection to a merge of Tuvalu and the United Nations into Foreign relations of Tuvalu.- gadfium 21:35, 13 August 2009 (UTC)
 * As proposer, I am inclined to agree to the merge gadfium suggests. --TS 22:39, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

The topic of the article "Tuvalu and the United Nations" is specific, and important in relation to Tuvalu. It definitely does not belong in its entirety to the main Tuvalu article, nor to the article "History of Tuvalu", though a brief summary with a link can be included in those. Tuvalu's voice in the UN has been been particularly important to its current politics and foreign policy. Given that we have articles about "[Nation] and the United Nations", it appears to make sense that a country which particularly values its place in the UN should have such an article. It also makes the information accessible via the "Nations and the UN" template, which is obviously where it should be accessible from. The article "Foreign relations of Tuvalu" currently has a summary, with a link to the article, which is as it should be. In any case, I've now "rescued" the article by adding additional information, with secondary (media) sources, notably on Tuvalu's role at the UN climate change conference in Copenhagen. Aridd (talk) 21:44, 22 September 2011 (UTC)

link for government of Tuvalu
The link "Government of Tuvalu" seems to be a dead link, and I cannot seem to find a current one. Can anyone help out? Thanks.--Halmass (talk) 02:24, 10 January 2010 (UTC)


 * Unfortunately, there still isn't an active government website. Following the news and politics of Tuvalu is rather difficult, in the absence of any government or media websites for that nation (other than the unofficial Tuvalu News). Even major events tends to filter out only slowly and partially. Aridd (talk) 21:59, 22 September 2011 (UTC)

Climate change section- two lines?
Whether tuvalu is sinking, or being affected by rising oceans, or both, there should be more than just two lines when there is an entire page about it.124.149.45.164 (talk) 12:21, 28 February 2011 (UTC)

Is the ocean level really rising in any meaningful way at that point on the globe? Haven't seen any documentation of that. The groundwater problems are more likely caused by seawater intrusion, resulting from pumping out untainted groundwater for consumption. This is a common phenonenon in Southern California, and a lot of money is spent running coastal water injection wells to stop or slow the intrusion. Opus131 (talk) 18:23, 3 October 2011 (UTC)

Merge Proposal - Law enforcement in Tuvalu
I support the proposal to merge the Law enforcement in Tuvalu into the main Tuvalu page. I don't see that the quote of the section of the Constitution adds anything and should not be included in the main Tuvalu page.(MozzazzoM (talk) 02:30, 22 November 2011 (UTC))

Article is internally inconsistent
In the first paragraph, second sentence: "It comprises four reef islands and five true atolls spread out from 6° to 10° south."

Under Geography and Environment, first sentence: "Tuvalu consists of three reef islands and six true atolls."

The Wiki page "Islands of Tuvalu" and "Geography of Tuvalu" also report six true atolls and three reef islands. Jdlawlis (talk) 20:16, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

Orphaned references in Tuvalu
I check pages listed in Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for orphaned references in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of Tuvalu's orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for this article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.

Reference named "TAHES": From History of Tuvalu:  From Gilbert and Ellice Islands:  

I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. AnomieBOT ⚡ 04:25, 15 January 2015 (UTC)

Global Warming and rising sea levels
Found this link in reuters - Rising Sea Levels about Tuvalu potentially being flooded within the next 30 - 50 years. Apprantly there is talk under way to potentially evacute the nation to New Zealand if this happens.--Floorwalker 02:09, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

After looking at the animation in the article for Atoll where one can see an atoll sinking for real (the legend says "subsiding": the atoll is going down, while water level is not rising). Now I wonder... how can one make sure it is the water that is rising, not the atoll that is subsiding (together with the gauge)? --WikestLink (talk) 14:57, 13 November 2008 (UTC)

I've made a couple of small changes in the section on Climate Change. I rearranged the first sentence since it is generally accepted that the polar regions will be first to experience the effects of climate change (i.e. temperature) while Tuvalu would undoubtedly be one of the first countries to experience the effect of rising sea levels. I also removed the part about rising saltwater table killing coral reefs since salt water is the natural environment of coral reefs and nobody has ever suggested that rising sea levels will kill corals. AtxApril (talk) 01:56, 10 February 2009 (UTC)

Increased carbon dioxide in the atmosphere leads to higher levels of carbonic acid in the ocean which do attack coral. This will affect a lot of small island nations and deserves to be mentioned, but if I'm going to do it, I need to check related pedia entries which I can't do now.Randy.f (talk) 23:29, 15 December 2009 (UTC)

I've removed the statements about the collapse of the Greenland and Antarctic ice sheets since catastrophes that might happen over the next several centuries or millenia are simply not relevant to the discussion about Tuvalu and the potential effects of sea level rise. For example, a large asteroid might land on Tuvalu and cause a similar catastrophe, but the Wikipedia article should not be enumerating all of the possible ways that the islands could be inundated in the distant future. Instead the article should focus on the issues that are verifiable as likely and known to be a concern. AtxApril (talk) 19:25, 1 March 2009 (UTC)

Astronomic tides in the area are generally small, although the 18yr cycle noticeable. 'King' has no place in terminology, as it's a corruption of 'spring', and not a ref to HAT. Tuvalu is mildly affected by sea levels due to the equatorial Kelvin bore during El Ninos, and is in the positive anomaly area. (PNG has a negative anomaly.) The 3-day equatorial phase-coherent tide is measurable here. The main influence on sea level is the inverse barometer effect. Sea levels rise considerably when the Pacific high pressure (as measured at Tahiti) diminishes during El Ninos. Cyclones with very deep lows can cause sea levels to rise by a meter for several hours, or even days. The IB rate is 1cm of sea level rise per 1mb of atmospheric drop. Tuvalu is coral sand on the flat of a limestone guyot. Uninhabited atolls will keep pace with slow sea level rises as the continual production of coral sand builds up on the guyot top. (Coral will grow upwards to the point where is spends about 3hrs out of the water in any 24hr period.) The sand is driven into banks by winds and also cyclonic Taylor columns may sweep silica sands up from deep water. The presence of humans is significant impediment to this process as they build roads, houses, and other sealed constructs. It is likely that such structures will sink as the sand bank moves away from them, and builds up in uninhabited areas.14.202.248.58 (talk) 01:50, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

Administrative subdivisions
Hello, folks. This is just a friendly 'heads up' that the article's discussion of administrative subdivisions hasn't been updated to reflect the data in the ISO coding scheme. See ISO 3166-2:TV. NewYorkActuary (talk) 19:41, 3 August 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
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External links modified
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External links modified
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The Evacuation
How many of the Tuvaluans will leave the islands? Surely not all? --Menchi 18:04, 16 Nov 2003 (UTC)


 * I'm not sure how many climate refugees have actually left Tuvalu. Since the islands are actually growing larger in area "Results highlight a net increase in land area in Tuvalu of 73.5 ha (2.9%), despite sea-level rise, and land area increase in eight of nine atolls." as one study in the refs said, any refugees are avoiding some future threat rather than an actual one. Greglocock (talk) 19:40, 13 December 2018 (UTC)

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Dry season?!
The climate section bizarrely states that Tuvalu has a dry season, yet the climate chart shows that every month has very high rainfall. Jim Michael (talk) 10:47, 8 September 2018 (UTC)

Religion
Can we make a circular graphic of the religión in Tuvalu? Scgonzalez (talk) 15:56, 27 November 2018 (UTC)

Expansion of land area
I wondered how long this off-message fact-mongering bit would survive, but hadn't realised it was a direct copy. i'll write a better version. Greglocock (talk) 22:16, 8 February 2019 (UTC)

Submerged Tuvalu
I just created this subcategory on the page, and I am not sure if anyone will object with it, but then I am not sure if it is okay or something.Nikitan3096 (talk) 03:42, 31 March 2019 (UTC)
 * There's already a section dealing with the threat. See Tuvalu.- gadfium 04:13, 31 March 2019 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion: You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 21:54, 22 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Tuvaluan anthem.ogg

Moving text to existing separate article on Climate change in Tuvalu
I plan to move some of the text that is currently in the climate change section to the existing separate article on Climate change in Tuvalu. This is to avoid duplication of content. Does anyone have objections or want to help with these changes? EMsmile (talk) 01:22, 19 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Seems reasonable given the detail. We should include a summary and link to the main page though in either Climate or the relevant paragraph in Environmental pressures. CMD (talk) 02:49, 19 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Done and moved the section to be within the "Geography and environment" section, together with the information on cycles and kind tides. @CMD this is probably the only country article where I argued for LESS content on climate change, ha-ha! For most of the other countries I am "battling" to get a sentence or two about climate change into the article. Even for countries where climate change impacts are already very real and obvious like Bangladesh, India or Australia... Anyway, wondering if the amount of text I have left behind is good enough for a summary of the main issues or needs to be culled/adjusted further? EMsmile (talk) 02:15, 4 March 2021 (UTC)
 * I suspect the second paragraph which is about the nitty-gritty of sea level rise measurement is undue here, but overall it's a nice summary. I note the third paragraph of Environmental pressures is also effectively a Climate change paragraph, but I think it can be left for a more holistic assessment of the Geography section as a whole. CMD (talk) 02:35, 4 March 2021 (UTC)

Tuvalu Climate : Duration of Wet Season vs Dry Season in text does not agree with rainfall totals in data table in same article
In the word text sourced from Australia, the Tuvalu wet season is given as November to April (dry season May to October). This is not correct based on the rainfall totals provided in the same article in a table below. April rainfall at 250mm is actually one of the drier months so is not part of the wet season. April is also much lower than the 310 of March so is clearly the first month of the dry season. Similarly October rainfall at 270 is quite a bit higher than September 230mm so october is could probably better classified as the beginning of the wet season. Someone should change the words to wet season October to March (dry season April to September) to make the article's words agree with the data. That would change the source as well to the same source as the rainfall table. I did not feel comfortable making the change but articles need to be internally consistent. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Bernerjc1 (talk • contribs) 04:38, 10 April 2021 (UTC)

I want to add new information
e.g. their rich culture LoveVOo0y (talk) 13:57, 25 February 2022 (UTC)

Visited their parliament and talked to local people LoveVOo0y (talk) 13:58, 25 February 2022 (UTC)
 * Hello. If you have WP:Reliable sources, I'm sure new information would be much appreciated. CMD (talk) 14:29, 25 February 2022 (UTC)
 * Everything you personally do (descriptions of your visit, talks with locals) is forbidden as WP:Original research. David notMD (talk) 17:59, 25 February 2022 (UTC)