Talk:Tyll (novel)

Temporal Sequence Of Chapters
This novel is written in non-chronological order. There was previously a section of this page, "Temporal Sequence Of Chapters," that lists the chapters in chronological order. This section has been removed and restored so often that I felt it was time to discuss it here.

The most recent reason it was removed was due to the "No original research" rule, but there is no research required: all the information for the list is present in the book. Many non-chronological novels have an explanation of their structure in their entry. To take just one example, would the first paragraph of Banks' Use_of_Weapons constitute original research?

Looking at the edit history, this seems to be a section that appears and reappears based on the whim of the most recent editor. I know my personal feelings aren't a criteria for inclusion here, but the list was a big help to me when I was reading the novel and I think it would be useful for other people experiencing it for the first time. But more importantly, it does not break any guidelines as I can see and there are many other examples of content like this extant on Wikipedia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.180.149.157 (talk • contribs)


 * The first problem is that the original editor Gebhardtp was violating WP:No original research by adding this section, and every subsequent person has continued the violation. No WP:SECONDARY sources have been cited to support a discussion of the chronology of chapters. The chapter chronology is not explicit in the book; the reader must deduce the chronology. Yes, the information is there, but the reader must assemble the bits and pieces.
 * Wikipedia's fiction book guidelines can be read at Manual of Style/Novels and Manual of Style/Writing about fiction.
 * Specifically, WP:PLOTPRESENT says that the plot section itself should contain the basic chronological information needed to understand what's going on. A separate section is not recommended. And the entire plot description with integrated chronology must not be larger than 700 words per WP:NOVELPLOT. Binksternet (talk) 22:17, 5 August 2021 (UTC)