Talk:U15 Group of Canadian Research Universities

Doctoral Students Section
The addition of this information doesn't seem germane to the topic. Certainly universities, including those who are members of the U15, employ graduate students in research. But that seems unrelated to the U15 organization itself. Can we remove? Akiracee (talk) 16:31, 21 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I'll second that, it seems like it was taken from a U15 promotional fact list (especially considering the bullet points within the section) and doesn't seem to bring any context to the way the group actually functions collectively. Leventio (talk) 23:02, 21 August 2012 (UTC)

A solution
The designation is notable, but all this article is, really, is a list. The schools themselves are notable and have their own articles, and I don't foresee a huge amount of material going onto this page as specifically relating to G10 as opposed to one or more of its constituent schools. It would therefore seem to be much more reasonable and useful to have List of G-10 Universities (Canada} and link it to the school articles, and also Category: G-10 universities to solve the problem. MSJapan 05:06, 29 March 2006 (UTC)
 * I see a category as a compliment to this article, not a replacement. As it currently stands, perhaps there isn't a lot of substantive information at the moment, however it is a fairly recent organization. Give it a couple years, and the article may be as detailed as Ivy League. There's no reason to get rid of this page. -- pm_shef 05:11, 29 March 2006 (UTC)
 * I work at a unviersity planning office at one of these institutions, and Wikipedia has proved to be the most informative source on the G10 category, the data exchange, etc. This is vital to certain people and should be left intact.

Data Exchange
Added this section, as it seems to be one of the main activities of the G10 as a collective group. Much of it was from Western's annual report, which has already been used as a reference extensively (what can I say, it's a very long and thorough report). I'm sure this section could be expanded upon, and that would probably silence the accusations of illegitimacy that plagued this article earlier on. --Greenmind 03:50, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

Endowments
I added this section to replace the information that was once contained on the List of Canadian universities by endowment. The list was once based solely around the G10, which provided a nice comparison between the schools, but didn't represent all Canadian universities, which the title would suggest. I changed the list to reflect "all Canadian universities with endowments over 100 million", so I added an Endowment section to the G10 article because it seemed the appropriate place for the old information. Copied the format from the Ivy League article; I figured the article already had one prominently displayed table, so it might be unsightly to add two more. --Greenmind 04:20, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

I've added a tag questioning the factual accuracy of this page. The numbers for endowment per student do not agree with List of Canadian universities by endowment. One or both of these pages must obviously be wrong.


 * I update the Queen's Stat again to take into account both the Pooled endowment fund and Other Endowment investments.--J2000ca 19:42, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

The numbers on this page and List_of_Canadian_universities_by_endowment do not agree. Oct 2007. Marked as factually inaccurate. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.231.89.235 (talk) 04:59, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Nomination for Deletion
Why is this page a candidate for deletion? I think that an organisation of top-research universities in Canada is kind of important! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mcphysical (talk • contribs)

Yes, it clearly is important. Deletion would be inapproriate. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.231.186.194 (talk) 22:21, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Revamping
This article needs revamping with the recent additions of Dalhousie, U of C and U of O to the G10 (now the G13). Tried to edit it before but got reverted to it's last edition by an admin. There is no G10 anymore, and Ive seen a few mentions of the G13 already. Innacurate to keep this article unupdated without the 3 universities added. 06:15, 19 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Where have you heard of this as the "G13"? I've still only heard talk of the 10, not the 13.... Do you have a reference? --- Chabuk 13:10, 19 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Here's an article about macleans and 11 universities pulling out which mentions the G13: chronicle.com/temp/email2.php?id=vZfqpJGGSZMtkNG23xXFtK4c8rsN4yyq (I can see that they pulled the article down though, kind of old: but "Many of the 11 universities are members of a group of Canadian research institutions known as the G13. The decision to take a stand on the rankings evolved". Here's a mention of it on a U of T page: www.research.utoronto.ca/about/pdf/CCDS%20presentation.ppt  If you search for G13 with your adobe reader, you'll find it.  On McGill's Budget for 06/07: www.mcgill.ca/files/vpadmin/Budget_Book_06_07.pdf  Queens: http://www.queensu.ca/irp/links.htm#G-10%20Universities  Obviously, the G13 isn't being used much because the G13 doesn't receive a lot of publicity as would the Ivy League, but the fact is that there are 13 universities part of this group, and the name "G10" doesn't comply with it. 23:00, 19 September 2006 (UTC)


 * If you continue searching through the McGill budget document at least (I haven't checked the others) you'll see references to the G10 as well as the G13, leading me to believe that the G13 is a seperate group (possibly including most if not all of the G10 schools, but with the noticeable addition of some smaller ones). Unless it can be shown that the G10 has been changed into the G13, it should not be included in the article. Though if you have enough sources on the issue to make it encyclopedic, feel free to create a seperate article. Also, you might want to register a username. -- Chabuk 00:46, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
 * The reason there are mentions to G10 in the article is because the main focus of the G10 was research partnerships and the data exchange (big one). The G10DE still exists, but will in the next statistics collection, expand to include those three universities (to make it the G13DE).  It would be innacurate to use "G13DE" or "G13" if statistics from Dalhousie, U of C and U of O are not included.  Im assuming that the U of T page was mentioning statistics in this case.  If you look at the Queen's link, it links to the G10 (which they forgot to change) while going to the G13.  These sites have had G10 sites, but with the expansion it's gone.  They are not two separate groups, they are one.  As well if you look at the first citation to the U of C website ( http://www.ucalgary.ca/UofC/departments/PRES/documents/2006-04-07-Message.pdf#search=%22g13%20universities%22 ), it says "I am pleased to announce that the U of C has been added to this group of Canada's most research-intensive universities.  To be precise, the G-10 will expand to a G-13 to include the original members plus the U of C, University of Ottawa and Dalhousie University."  The G-10 will EXPAND to the G-13.  It's one group.  I don't think it would be accurate to make a separate article just for the G13.  And P.S. The University of Calgary, University of Ottawa and Dalhousie are not what I'd call "smaller" schools.  The reason for their additions is because their performances is equal to or greater than a few other schools on the list (in terms of endowment, how research intensive they are and how much they contribute to the research world, capital etc.) 02:35, 20 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Indeed! Well that's interesting news. Go ahead and add the information then and use the U of C document as a reference. Great work btw, we need more editors here like you! -- Chabuk 03:40, 20 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Thanks. Ive always used wikipedia but just didn't edit much (more of a reader) but thanks for the help.  Hope the signature works this time. --Buffer v2 04:09, 20 September 2006 (UTC)


 * I understand that this group has expanded once more and will rebrand itself as the U15. Akiracee (talk) 15:17, 22 July 2011 (UTC)
 * The creation of the U-15 does not necessarily mean that the G-13 has been superceded by the former. While the exact definitions of membership in the G-13 is somewhat blurred (primarily due to the fact that the group is technically an informal group), there exists two prevalently common criteria with exists with all current G-13 members.


 * First, those in the G-13 usually meet biannual to discuss things in relation to research, which a quick glance the provided U15 reference will show to not be a problem. However, the major issue comes with the second criteria, in which all the G13 members are apart of the G13 Data Exchange (G13DE). The G13DE also seems to be the indicator of expansion of the group (such as with the expansion of the G-10 to the G-13 was noted with the inclusion of Ottawa, Calgary and Dalhousie in the G10DE). As far as I'm aware, neither Manitoba or Saskatchewan are participants of the G13DE. While the reference provided about the U15 make lots of notes in regards to the group's goal to expand research in Canada, it makes no mention of a data exchange of any kind, or the possible future participation of Manitoba and Saskatchewan within the G13DE network.


 * There several more issues with the reference, over the fact that UofT is not a signatory of the memorandum (though it does state that it is a member... somehow). Secondly, the reference provided only states that the U15 is a group of research intensive universities with the intention of expanding research productivity in Canada. The reference provided does not even make a single mention of the the G13DE or Group of Thirteen. So we cannot assume that the U15 is superceding the G-13. To make a similar comparison, the U15 is to the G20, as to how the G-13 is to the G8. It would not be surprising however if the U15 did end up superceding G13, but keep in mind, Wikipedia is not a crystal ball (WP:BALL and should not have unverifiable speculation. I did however edit your initial edit to mention the formation of the U15.
 * Leventio (talk) 11:52, 25 July 2011 (UTC)


 * The reference is poor. Granted. But the group is, by nature, opaque. There aren't press releases. In searching some more, I've found two documents that indicate membership. The Vice-President Academic & Provost at the University of Saskatchewan confirms membership in the U15 and U15DE (http://www.usask.ca/university_secretary/council/Council%20Meetings/agenda_archives/2011_June_CouncilAgendaFinal1.pdf) and here the President of the University of Manitoba does the same (http://umanitoba.ca/admin/president/media/05172011_BOG_report.pdf). What are your thoughts? Do these suffice? Akiracee (talk) 15:00, 27 July 2011 (UTC)
 * The UofS report is a more than sufficient source to indicate the succession of the G13 to the U15 (the basis of the succession from the G10 to the G13 was through a University of Calgary president's report). While there is no U15DE website up (like the G13DE, although that was a rather limited site), a quick Google search reveals that both McGill and the University of Ottawa are in the process of hiring a U15DE Coordinator (albeit they are not the most reliable of sources). I'll add them into the article now. Leventio (talk) 07:41, 28 July 2011 (UTC)

Meaning of biannual
The article says that the group has biannual meetings. I didn't know that this was a word, but m-w.com tells me that it means either "occurring twice a year" or "biennial". Confusingly, "biennial" means "occurring every two years". I would use "semiannual" to mean "twice a year" or "biennial" to mean "every two years". Additionally, I can't find a reference anywhere that says how often they actually do meet. -- timc  talk   02:07, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

Assessment
I have assessed this as a Start Class as, while it contains a good level of organization, is lacking in prose and description about the topic. I have assessed this as low importance, as it is a highly specialized topic within Canada. Cheers, CP 14:37, 16 September 2007 (UTC)

Athletic Nicknames??
Having a column for athletic nicknames seems more than a little incongruous in an article about a group research-oriented universities. I suggest removing it. Silverchemist (talk) 14:40, 12 September 2013 (UTC)

Presentation bias
"Currently, U15 consists of 15 of Canada's most research-intensive universities."

I am sorry, I never contribute to Wikipedia but I highly doubt the claim. The U15 consists of the most renowed universities. There are many reason to that, but that doesn't make them the 15 most research-intensive of the country. Many smaller universities are more productive per researcher than these one. Also, some public school get more grant from the Canadian research councils per student (national contest). Therefore, I claim that without proper reference, this description should be modified for a more neutral approach. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 132.212.143.208 (talk) 01:30, 15 November 2013 (UTC)